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GTO+/CardRunnersEV? GTO+/CardRunnersEV?

07-03-2020 , 03:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by carlos243
I was wondering if it is possible to see an agregattion repport for the turn, the same way is possible to do it for the flop.
https://gyazo.com/454a636b80a946af6f3d4730d68100d9
Yes, this is available in v130.
For download go here: www.gtoplus.com/download
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 03:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadCat
What is the progress bar measuring exactly?
It indicates the next update for dEV.
Other than that, it's mostly just there for esthetic reasons, so that the user knows that the solver is running.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 08:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla
There's many different sources for preflop ranges. Both ranges based on experience, as well as ranges based on analysis. We're not particularly invested in designing GTO software specifically for this, given that almost no one has the hardware to run it anyhow. We prefer to focus our efforts on features that are within reach of all of our users.



Flopzilla costs $25 for a lifetime license, with all upgrades included. For example, even people who purchased in 2009 still get FlopzillaPro for free. We don't offer additional discounts on top of that.



Unfortunately, it's not possible for me to discuss development plans.




I would say so, although I am of course not an independent source of information.



In GTO, all bet sizes will perform really closely to one another. You can test this for yourself by building the same tree, but for different bet sizes. After that, check OOP's overall performance (his EV below the table in his very first decision; see the screenshot below). So, it's not possible to recommend bet sizing, given that all sizes will perform almost exactly the same when playing perfectly. As a consequence, we don't offer such a feature, and neither does pio.

What some people do here is use multiple bet sizes to see which action is used most frequently (it's possible to do this in GTO+). However, this approach doesn't really work, because the performance of the bet sizes is nearly identical. Whichever bet size is used most frequently is mostly just a coincidence, and different solving algorithms will find different "preferred" sizes.

Thanks.
Last question, I can not find any ways to import hands into GTO+ using the trial software. Is that option available on the fully licensed one? if not, what do I do about it?
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07-03-2020 , 10:49 AM
Purchased the Software regardless.
I typed in the flop, betting options and ranges for villain and just a pair of hole cards for myself, and the solver takes for ever. How long should it takes?

I have 16gb ram and a Ryzen 3600x. Do I need to upgrade my ram or something to make it quicker?
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 11:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Thanks.
Last question, I can not find any ways to import hands into GTO+ using the trial software. Is that option available on the fully licensed one? if not, what do I do about it?
Are you referring to preflop ranges?
It depends on in which format you have them.
We can import Flopzilla v1, FlopzillaPro, CREV and pio.
Please let me know if you need instructions for a particular format.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 11:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Purchased the Software regardless.
I typed in the flop, betting options and ranges for villain and just a pair of hole cards for myself, and the solver takes for ever. How long should it takes?

I have 16gb ram and a Ryzen 3600x. Do I need to upgrade my ram or something to make it quicker?
GTO analysis is intended for range vs range. Hand vs range will not really work, given that villain will know your exact holding. That being said, hand vs range should be extremely fast. It it takes forever, then please send a savefile to support. Or are you perhaps using a dEV of 0%? In that case the solver will run indefinitely.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 11:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla
Are you referring to preflop ranges?
It depends on in which format you have them.
We can import Flopzilla v1, FlopzillaPro, CREV and pio.
Please let me know if you need instructions for a particular format.
Thanks.
Nope, I wanted to know if it was possible to copy any hand histories from my game history directly into the software without having to input every hand manually.

Also, I'm struggling a bit. I configured a tree with a flop where Villain donk bets both flop and turn. For whatever reason I can not draw a river card, and when I play the solution Villain always checks on the flop. Also, how can I configure the turn and river cards to draw exactly the card I want when playing the solution like I can when choosing directly from the tree?
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 11:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla
GTO analysis is intended for range vs range. Hand vs range will not really work, given that villain will know your exact holding. That being said, hand vs range should be extremely fast. It it takes forever, then please send a savefile to support. Or are you perhaps using a dEV of 0%? In that case the solver will run indefinitely.
I was using dEV of 0.5. It took like 20 minutes.
So I can not review my real exact hands against particular range or even specific villain holdings to understand what exactly I needed to do in that hand that I believe I misplayed ?

Sorry my bad, the run solver options takes forever.

In the combos and percentages it shows villain's oop range and equities, but does not show mine against his range. Is there an option to reverse it if it makes ANY sense? And again, in the play against the solution villains always checks the flop when oop and I want him to donk.

Last edited by crowned; 07-03-2020 at 12:14 PM.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Thanks.
Nope, I wanted to know if it was possible to copy any hand histories from my game history directly into the software without having to input every hand manually.
Other than the board and stack-to-pot ratio there's not much information we could read from a hand history.
So I don't think that we can offer much of anything here.


Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Also, I'm struggling a bit. I configured a tree with a flop where Villain donk bets both flop and turn. For whatever reason I can not draw a river card, and when I play the solution Villain always checks on the flop.
If you want me to take a closer look, then please send a savefile to support.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Also, how can I configure the turn and river cards to draw exactly the card I want when playing the solution like I can when choosing directly from the tree?
The turn and river are drawn from the deck randomly while playing.
So they are not set manually.

Last edited by scylla; 07-03-2020 at 01:44 PM.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 01:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
I was using dEV of 0.5. It took like 20 minutes.
That sounds far too long. If it's a specific hand then it should be calculated very quickly. If you want me to take a look then please send a savefile to support. That being said, please consider setting a range for yourself instead of just a hand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
So I can not review my real exact hands against particular range or even specific villain holdings to understand what exactly I needed to do in that hand that I believe I misplayed ?
In poker you're holding a range; not a hand. It should not be clear to villain what you're holding, or otherwise he will simply play perfectly against your particular hand. So, if at all possible, please let him play against your range.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
In the combos and percentages it shows villain's oop range and equities, but does not show mine against his range. Is there an option to reverse it if it makes ANY sense? And again, in the play against the solution villains always checks the flop when oop and I want him to donk.
It's probably best if you enter a range instead of a specific hand. That being said, I'm fairly certain that your equity should be visible, even when just using a single hand. So if this is not the case, then please send either a savefile or screenshot to support.

Last edited by scylla; 07-03-2020 at 01:54 PM.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 03:35 PM
Hi Scylla,
How should I work with MTT in the chip ev (cash) in the tree settings? Should I indicate rake and cap in MTT?
The fact is that rake is charged along with the buy-in, and I pay it only once, which can’t be said about the cash. However, should it be specified? And what is the cap then? Thank you in advance.

Last edited by hammer7; 07-03-2020 at 03:44 PM.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-03-2020 , 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla
That sounds far too long. If it's a specific hand then it should be calculated very quickly. If you want me to take a look then please send a savefile to support. That being said, please consider setting a range for yourself instead of just a hand.
I believe it's alright now.



Quote:
In poker you're holding a range; not a hand. It should not be clear to villain what you're holding, or otherwise he will simply play perfectly against your particular hand. So, if at all possible, please let him play against your range.
Sure, makes sense. I just thought that perhaps I could play a predefined hand against a range just to replay a hand. But I can probably get the same benefit just by looking at the chart for that particular hand.



It will take time for me to learn this obviously so I appreciate the help a lot.
I do have to ask, if there is some kind of database available that consolidates all the preflop ranges for every position so I can run some quick sims? or just some custom settings to go for ? Also, just so I can get this straight, I can not input two different betting sizes (IE:half pot and full pot) to the trees? and it doesn't affect the outcome for different hands at all?
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07-03-2020 , 07:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla
Cheers! Thank you

I am planning to buy GTO+ soon. It looks quite powerful.
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07-03-2020 , 07:42 PM
Well, for some reason the software runs really slow on my computer. What do I need to debug it? how do I send a save file to support exactly? Even the streets that show on the tree at the top show like numbers before they show up and in the solution it takes like 2 secs for the next card to show.
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07-04-2020 , 12:06 AM
When building tree, I believe there's a way to add an "all in" option, on any given street, by inputting "AI" or do we have to add all in via a percentage?
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-04-2020 , 03:01 AM
Hi Scylla

Will you be able to add a filter for frequencies and then show those hands at that node? For example like 25%-30% or like 75%< and filter those hands and show those hands at that node?

Thanks
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-04-2020 , 04:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerboy1606
Hi Scylla

Will you be able to add a filter for frequencies and then show those hands at that node? For example like 25%-30% or like 75%< and filter those hands and show those hands at that node?

Thanks
Can you explain in a bit more detail what you mean?
I don't fully understand.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-04-2020 , 04:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hammer7
Hi Scylla,
How should I work with MTT in the chip ev (cash) in the tree settings? Should I indicate rake and cap in MTT?
The fact is that rake is charged along with the buy-in, and I pay it only once, which can’t be said about the cash. However, should it be specified? And what is the cap then? Thank you in advance.
If you're far away from the money, then you should be able to use "cash game" mode. It's not necessary to add rake. The rake from the buy-in has already been paid in the past, and does not influence your decisions in the tournament.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-04-2020 , 04:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
I believe it's alright now.
Sure, makes sense. I just thought that perhaps I could play a predefined hand against a range just to replay a hand. But I can probably get the same benefit just by looking at the chart for that particular hand.
It will take time for me to learn this obviously so I appreciate the help a lot.
I do have to ask, if there is some kind of database available that consolidates all the preflop ranges for every position so I can run some quick sims?
We don't offer databases for this, given that there's no absolute preflop ranges. They are mostly unique to a certain situation. Using pre-made preflop ranges basically just provides a false sense of accuracy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Also, just so I can get this straight, I can not input two different betting sizes (IE:half pot and full pot) to the trees? and it doesn't affect the outcome for different hands at all?
You can add multiple bet sizes in GTO+. However, there's not much EV to be gained from this. Almost exactly the same profit can be made when using single bet sizes. And surprisingly, all bet sizes will perform roughly the same. What is really important is the quality of your play. The influence of the quality of play far outweighs the importance of bet sizing.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-04-2020 , 04:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowned
Well, for some reason the software runs really slow on my computer. What do I need to debug it? how do I send a save file to support exactly? Even the streets that show on the tree at the top show like numbers before they show up and in the solution it takes like 2 secs for the next card to show.
Ok, I've sent you an e-mail address via PM.
Can you please send the file there?

Last edited by scylla; 07-04-2020 at 04:45 AM.
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07-04-2020 , 04:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dejavudu666
When building tree, I believe there's a way to add an "all in" option, on any given street, by inputting "AI" or do we have to add all in via a percentage?
For this use "Add/go all-in".
See the screenshot below.

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07-04-2020 , 08:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla
Ok, I've sent you an e-mail address via PM.
Can you please send the file there?
Hi, I sent you the file. It consists of 73 trees that I ran during the night. I wanted to complete 200, but only managed to complete 73.

I also purchased the FlopzillaPro to accommodate GTO+. Where can I watch all the benefits of them working together?

In GTO+ I auto played those 73 flops with a Button vs BB calling range, and I was wondering if it was possible to view how a combo plays against that range for all flops, and not just for a particular one if it makes sense? And when running through a database can I focus on one specific tree/flop and not run through them all in play against the solution?

Also, is it possible to view the statistics that Flopzilla shows for each flop and tree I ran? Is there also a database for Flopzilla?

And again, as far as how terrible GTO runs for me, when running in conjunction with FlopzillaPRO and running auto simulations, it's just so slow...gotta figure this one out.

Thanks for all your help Scylla.

Last edited by crowned; 07-04-2020 at 08:39 AM.
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07-04-2020 , 08:22 AM
Another question that arose when I worked in GTO +.
Why can I see all the actions of the hero on the flops only when I'm OOP? Why can't I see IP's actions also? It would be very helpful to see them all when working in Excel.


Last edited by hammer7; 07-04-2020 at 08:42 AM.
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07-04-2020 , 10:13 AM
hammer,
You need to update to a newer GTO. You can tell IPs actions in response to OOPs actions by clicking the blue box corresponding to OOP Actions. The blue boxes will be right next to the aggregate tab. If you do not see blue boxes representing you need to update GTO and rerun the sims so they calculate this data.
GTO+/CardRunnersEV? Quote
07-04-2020 , 10:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BigOT
hammer,
You need to update to a newer GTO. You can tell IPs actions in response to OOPs actions by clicking the blue box corresponding to OOP Actions. The blue boxes will be right next to the aggregate tab. If you do not see blue boxes representing you need to update GTO and rerun the sims so they calculate this data.
Finally I saw it, for me it was a huge problem. It's a pity that I will have to recalculate the entire database, in any case, thanks a lot.
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