Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Commercial Software Discussion of commercial gambling-related / poker software & commercial graphics modifications

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-05-2016, 07:28 AM   #5251
MiguelPicard
journeyman
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 330
Re: CardRunnersEV

I would like to reproduce what someone did in another thread: http://prntscr.com/bagdl2

I can't find the equity realization option, when I get to the flop I can only fold, check or bet, or some advanced option like checkdown, but this guy have found a way to put BB 70%eq, how the hell did he do it?
MiguelPicard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2016, 02:31 AM   #5252
SenseiCRO
stranger
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 1
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hello,

I hope that this is the right place to post my question.
I use licensed version 3.2.6. of CREV.
By using the equilibrium solver I am trying to achieve results of Nash tables.
The setup is: heads up, SB stack 500, BB stack 500, blinds 10/20/0, SB push with all hands, BB calls with all hands. Target dEV in the equilibrium tool is 0.00000001. After equilibrium calculation, which lasts less than one second, I do the EV Run Monte Carlo 1.000.000 situations. When the math finishes I get the +EV table which is completely different than Nash table for 20 BBs push and fold.
I get:
20 BBs push with: 22+, A2+, K2+, Q4+, Q2s+, J7+, J4s+, T8+, T7s+, 97s+,
and
20 BBs call with: 22+, A2+, K2+, Q3+, Q2s+, J7+, J3s+, T8+, T6s+, 98, 97s+.

Now, what am I doing wrong, or Nash tables are wrong (which I don't believe)?

Cheers,
Dean
SenseiCRO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2016, 03:42 AM   #5253
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hi Everyone,

My apologies for my late reply.
I usually receive a notification e-mail from 2+2 when a post has been made, however it appears that for the latest posts I either overlooked this mail or didn't receive it.

Scylla
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2016, 03:42 AM   #5254
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRC View Post
Hi scylla,

I would like to request the inclusion of the drawing hand: "backdoor 8 out straight draw" in the draws options (like when you have 8x in a flop T9x). I always knew that this kind of draw were relevant, and your new equilibrium solver just proved that (as you can check in many situations).

Cheers
Ok, I'll see what I can do.
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2016, 03:46 AM   #5255
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by MiguelPicard View Post
I would like to reproduce what someone did in another thread: http://prntscr.com/bagdl2

I can't find the equity realization option, when I get to the flop I can only fold, check or bet, or some advanced option like checkdown, but this guy have found a way to put BB 70%eq, how the hell did he do it?
When adding the checkdown, enter "70" in the % field and select "BB" from the dropdown to select which player is the one to realize this % of equity. Finally, select "his equity".



If a checkdown has already been added then you can edit these parameters by double-clicking the action.
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2016, 03:53 AM   #5256
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by SenseiCRO View Post
Hello,

I hope that this is the right place to post my question.
I use licensed version 3.2.6. of CREV.
By using the equilibrium solver I am trying to achieve results of Nash tables.
The setup is: heads up, SB stack 500, BB stack 500, blinds 10/20/0, SB push with all hands, BB calls with all hands. Target dEV in the equilibrium tool is 0.00000001. After equilibrium calculation, which lasts less than one second, I do the EV Run Monte Carlo 1.000.000 situations. When the math finishes I get the +EV table which is completely different than Nash table for 20 BBs push and fold.
I get:
20 BBs push with: 22+, A2+, K2+, Q4+, Q2s+, J7+, J4s+, T8+, T7s+, 97s+,
and
20 BBs call with: 22+, A2+, K2+, Q3+, Q2s+, J7+, J3s+, T8+, T6s+, 98, 97s+.

Now, what am I doing wrong, or Nash tables are wrong (which I don't believe)?

Cheers,
Dean
Can you send a savefile to support please? I just checked and the results seem to match just fine, so it sounds like possibly your tree does not match the description you gave.

Last edited by scylla; 06-09-2016 at 04:04 AM.
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2016, 06:04 PM   #5257
romakhokhlov
stranger
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 13
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hi there
How can i export my ranges to another pc?
romakhokhlov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2016, 06:24 PM   #5258
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by romakhokhlov View Post
Hi there
How can i export my ranges to another pc?
Hi,

Your ranges are stored in the file newdefs2.txt.
You can even import/export this file from/to Flopzilla.

Cheers,

Scylla
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2016, 08:37 AM   #5259
4-Star General
adept
 
4-Star General's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,012
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hi, sry for the dumb question, but I'm on vacation and I can't check on my own.
Flopzilla and CREV can work together? I mean, let's say I want to study a simple spot.

Swallow stacks, Villain opens , Hero 3bets big and Villain calls. Hero shoves any flop, and Hero calls when he flops TP+ and draws.
Now, in Flopzilla I can enter my hand and the Villain's range and see how he flops, which are basically the frequencies how he's folding and calling on the flop.
How can I use the frequencies in CREV?
4-Star General is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2016, 04:26 AM   #5260
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4-Star General View Post
Hi, sry for the dumb question, but I'm on vacation and I can't check on my own.
Flopzilla and CREV can work together? I mean, let's say I want to study a simple spot.

Swallow stacks, Villain opens , Hero 3bets big and Villain calls. Hero shoves any flop, and Hero calls when he flops TP+ and draws.
Now, in Flopzilla I can enter my hand and the Villain's range and see how he flops, which are basically the frequencies how he's folding and calling on the flop.
How can I use the frequencies in CREV?
If you want to do the same thing in CardRunnersEV then you should probably just let villain call with TP+ and draws as well. The frequencies themselves do not contain enough information to be used as input.
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2016, 02:13 PM   #5261
JYamada
journeyman
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Thailand
Posts: 261
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hi can I use and download CREV on to an Mac?
JYamada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2016, 05:46 PM   #5262
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by JYamada View Post
Hi can I use and download CREV on to an Mac?
CardRunnersEV is software for Windows, so it won't work on a Mac.
You can use software like CrossOver to get it to run though.

Cheers,

Scylla
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2016, 12:46 AM   #5263
nzrod
centurion
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 113
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by scylla View Post
If you want to do the same thing in CardRunnersEV then you should probably just let villain call with TP+ and draws as well. The frequencies themselves do not contain enough information to be used as input.
I thought on CREV TP+ included draws? I guess not - one has to enter both?

Sent from my SM-G900I using 2+2 Forums
nzrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2016, 05:02 AM   #5264
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by nzrod View Post
I thought on CREV TP+ included draws? I guess not - one has to enter both?

Sent from my SM-G900I using 2+2 Forums
">=top pair" only refers to made hands.
If you want to include draws as well, then you'll need to include them separately.
Like for example in the tree below:



You will need to enter the conditions below each other so that they are listed separately (this means ">=tp OR fd OR oesd" as opposed to AND). Should this not be clear to you, then please go to "Help->Video manual" and watch the videos "The postflop condition editor" and "How actions+conditions are processed" in the section "The basics".

Last edited by scylla; 06-21-2016 at 05:08 AM.
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2016, 03:05 PM   #5265
JYamada
journeyman
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Thailand
Posts: 261
Re: CardRunnersEV

sorry but its not working through crossover...do u have any other suggestions for programs that would run CREV?
JYamada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2016, 04:21 AM   #5266
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by JYamada View Post
sorry but its not working through crossover...do u have any other suggestions for programs that would run CREV?
There are other similar programs, however, CrossOver is really the one to go for. I have really never heard of anyone having issues with CrossOver. If you need help with setting anything up you can always send an e-mail to their support. Or make a post in the software forum here.
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2016, 07:35 AM   #5267
nzrod
centurion
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 113
Re: CardRunnersEV

Thanks Scylla. I often find the condition All Hands is automatically added to the bottom of the list on the lower left in the post flop editor. Eg I will put in >tp, save and close then when I go back in i see All Hands had been added below it. I will watch the video again but it is unusual.




Sent from my SM-G900I using 2+2 Forums
nzrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2016, 11:42 AM   #5268
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by nzrod View Post
Thanks Scylla. I often find the condition All Hands is automatically added to the bottom of the list on the lower left in the post flop editor. Eg I will put in >tp, save and close then when I go back in i see All Hands had been added below it. I will watch the video again but it is unusual.

Sent from my SM-G900I using 2+2 Forums
Do you mean that you click on "edit conditions" when you re-enter the menu? If you double-click on of the conditions then this will not happen. That being said, adding "all hands" when a user clicks on "edit conditions" made sense at the time when the code was written, but I can see how it's a bit confusing. I'll remove the auto-adding of "all hands" for the next release.

Thank you for the feedback,

Scylla
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2016, 11:50 PM   #5269
MRC
stranger
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 3
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hi scylla,

Would be possible to implement an equilibrium solver were I could define a minimum frequency of X% that a particular action should be taken with a given hand in order for it to be maintained in the final approximated equilibrium solution?

I mean, is useless (for humans) to include in the equilibrium an action that should be taken like 2% of the time. It would be much more useful a solution approximated, but were no action is taken less than 10% of the time, e.g.

Is there a way to implement something similar to this in the current CREV version?

Cheers
MRC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2016, 03:46 AM   #5270
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRC View Post
Hi scylla,

Would be possible to implement an equilibrium solver were I could define a minimum frequency of X% that a particular action should be taken with a given hand in order for it to be maintained in the final approximated equilibrium solution?

I mean, is useless (for humans) to include in the equilibrium an action that should be taken like 2% of the time. It would be much more useful a solution approximated, but were no action is taken less than 10% of the time, e.g.

Is there a way to implement something similar to this in the current CREV version?

Cheers
If an action is taken only 2% of the time then you can basically for yourself just consider it as not being taken. If you really want to force the action at 0% though, then you can edit it to change its condition to, for example, "0%-all hands", lock it and then re-run the solver. Should you need an explanation of how to lock hands, then please watch the second video here: http://www.cardrunnersev.com/equilibrium.html
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2016, 04:14 AM   #5271
idn07
stranger
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 14
Re: CardRunnersEV

Hi scylla, I find building full trees for solver quite hard to do manually, there are so many branches.

Wizard doesn't help that much, because usually it build nice tree just for 1 street, on later streets it use checkdowns or weird sizes (i guess because we dont enter % of the pot size, but just sizes for current street). Any chance you could improve wizard, so it build correct trees from flop to river (like simplepostlop for example, using % betsizes)?
idn07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2016, 06:36 AM   #5272
Foosa
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 71
Re: CardRunnersEV

Does the equilibrium solver have the same functionality as PioSOLVER? What do I accomplish by throwing $249 at PioSOLVER rather than $100 at CREV?
Foosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2016, 06:38 AM   #5273
Foosa
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 71
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by idn07 View Post
Hi scylla, I find building full trees for solver quite hard to do manually, there are so many branches.

Wizard doesn't help that much, because usually it build nice tree just for 1 street, on later streets it use checkdowns or weird sizes (i guess because we dont enter % of the pot size, but just sizes for current street). Any chance you could improve wizard, so it build correct trees from flop to river (like simplepostlop for example, using % betsizes)?
This sounds like a good idea. I would be much more tempted to buy CREV if trees can be semi-automated. Is it possible to save trees and then change the flop each time you load the tree?
Foosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2016, 02:29 PM   #5274
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by idn07 View Post
Hi scylla, I find building full trees for solver quite hard to do manually, there are so many branches.

Wizard doesn't help that much, because usually it build nice tree just for 1 street, on later streets it use checkdowns or weird sizes (i guess because we dont enter % of the pot size, but just sizes for current street). Any chance you could improve wizard, so it build correct trees from flop to river (like simplepostlop for example, using % betsizes)?
Currently the tree building wizard goes up to 3 bets. If a player is not all in yet after that it will check down. I'm not aware of sizes being "weird" though. Can you maybe give an example so that I have a better idea of what you're referring to?
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2016, 02:37 PM   #5275
scylla
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
scylla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 6,266
Re: CardRunnersEV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foosa View Post
Does the equilibrium solver have the same functionality as PioSOLVER? What do I accomplish by throwing $249 at PioSOLVER rather than $100 at CREV?
At the moment for postflop play the maximum number of bets is 3 (bet, raise, 3bet all-in) with all possible bet/call/check/fold combinations. This includes play on the unknown turns/rivers.

So right now the example file /equilibrium_sample_files/flop/flop_3bet.stx is the largest flop tree that can be built with the tree wizard (for what it's worth, just in case it isn't clear, play does continue on the turn and river in this tree, however, in order to keep the tree easy to work with the play on the turn/river is minimized; press the + icon to expand).
scylla is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive