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Old 12-26-2014, 12:39 PM   #1301
ThinkItThrough
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re: Bestpokercoaching.com. Coaching For Profits. From $50 to $100k in 9months. Publicly Documented.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunovd View Post
Hi Gordon

I saw on the previous posts you telling that the students are the real heros i just would like to add that you took a nl2 fish (whale) with a full time job that the only thing he had was the willing to work and desire to win, and that on my book qualify you as a SUPER HERO.
Merry Christmas and all the best.
Nuno
Thx Nuno! I appreciate your nice words and respect your hard work.

(@sodiumnitrat: this guy here moved up with me from NL2 to NL25. Our first NL25 shot was not successful, we are back at NL10. But that's business as usual, since we don't give up and will always win in the end )
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Old 01-06-2015, 05:03 AM   #1302
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I bought heads up mastermind, I have only watched the first few videos but I have to say I am very disappointed so far, Its all seems hugely outdated and some is just plain bad. Things with this sort of advertising are always BS, I guess I am the stupid one for falling for it. My guess is the people who make threads and have success are massively bumhunting(not saying thats bad, just that they don't need to be learning anything special). really can't believe I paid 497euro for this sh**. One funny thing, he talks about he sees some of his students folding some good hands in the sb or bb and then playing a worse one the next time and saying how stupid that is, then about 5 mins later he fold k8 in the bb to a raise, ie top 31% and then very soon after 3bets 75o ie bottom 25% of hands. Also says he sometimes would fold 66 in the bb to a raise.

I guess I will watch a few more videos but I am not very confident it will get better.
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Old 01-06-2015, 05:44 AM   #1303
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Meh this course is total dog sh** I am not even going to waste my time with anymore videos.
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Old 01-06-2015, 09:25 AM   #1304
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@Biggerboots:

I'm sorry to hear that you don't like the course.
It is also ok that you voice your thoughts and feelings here although i strongly disagree. It's an open place so you are free to say what you think.

My promise for Heads Up Mastermind still stands:
Somebody does the homework, shows them to me and if they are not improving their game/results, i will either refund them and/or give them a lot of free coaching.

Complaining like you did is your right. You are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

Let me explain in more detail and help you to get on the right track:

If the videos would say what you thought was right, then what would be the whole point of it? Unfortunately most people look for self-confirmation when learning.

They watch the conservative tv channel when they are conservative and the liberal version when they are liberal. And then they get confirmation how much "dog sh*t" and how "stupid" the others are.
I know this better than anyone because i am guilty of this myself . It humbled me a lot when realizing this about myself some time ago.

If a coach says something they disagree with, the coach is "wrong". The coach could have made millions and the student could be broke, but i had NL10 players upright judge a high stakes players (not me in specific, but generally speaking) with the certainty as if they (the NL10 guys!) were the best players out there and KNEW what is right.

Explanation of your critique:

This doesn't mean the coach is perfect and does everything right. There are many different layers to learning and different skills that make a player/coach great. The layer I excell at is to teach UNDERSTANDING and PSYCHOLOGY and ATTITUDE. I am super math based, but i teach and make a lot of exploitative plays which look "wrong" from a pure mathematical perspective, but are hugely +++++ EV because of the other factors involved.

You don't have to take my word for that. Other's have spoken.

I do think that it helps to be humble as a student and give a coach the benefit of the doubt. You have to fully emerge yourself into the thinking of the coach and realize that:

- This coach has repeatedly turned complete losing players into big winners and does this publicly (no other coach does this)

(some of which game select stronger than others...we always adjust this based on the players skill... however you can't have a 10bb winrate on 6max over a huge sample and make like 30k a month on small stakes playing super high volume...

Reference: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...egies-1385674/

- Has tons of positive and glowing reviews (like 99%) for the course

- Follow the course, do the homeworks as instructed even if you disagree because everybody* who has done it turned out to be a success

- Realize that good things are not easy and that the harder it is for you, the higher the rewards will be

Give it a full try and THEN you can really judge.

*Actually there were 2 people who were not...one of them had awesome results. Let's just say they were super special cases.




Does that mean it is always "your fault" ?

No. I wouldn't go so far. While i get so much positive feedback, i will still not go so far and say my coaching/courses are the solution for "everybody in the universe".
Indeed there are different ways to learn and you might as well be among the 1% of people who just don't connect with the way of learning i propose.

That's why i am willing to help somebody like you either way. And if we realize it's not "meant to be", you will get a refund.

For that to happen, i expect to see a different attitude from you. Do the homeworks, get in contact with me and we'll make you a huge HU success.

If you want to continue to call things dogsh*t that have helped people to make **** tons of money, go and do that. You can curse and use this as an excuse to not become the best version of yourself. You can blame whatever you want. But unless you give it a try, you will get 0,0 sympathy from me.

You know mate, that is not the nicest way, but i really wanna fight for and with you.

I could slime-ball you and give a "no questions asked refund" just to avoid a discussion. That's what most "marketing people" actually suggest. You can read it in every book. When i started to coach a few years ago, i offered refunds to anybody who wanted them.
Very very few asked for it, but i realized after a time that this is not in line with the attitude and philosophy i teach and live.

While the other way would be more "profitable" , my way is more fulfilling for me and gives a lot more value to those students who go that way.

Like mentioned above, i do things differently. I'm not afraid of any feedback because i have the confidence and results to back things up.

What i hope from you is that you have the "**** you Gordon, i'm gonna own you" attitude. Do the homeworks, work hard on your game and you can be assured that if you contact me in a respectful way, you will always be helped.

Always. I never let people down unless they let themselves down. You will be no exception.
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Old 01-06-2015, 10:21 AM   #1305
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Your first point, I mean I can understand what you are saying if I was some breakeven fish that has no clue, just so I have some credibility here is last years graph~



I may not be the best poker player but I have some idea and I know when something is completely illogical, you are a very good talker(thats why I bought the course) but even in the 6 videos I watched you completely contradict yourself, you say something then do something different right away and are able to make it seem logical, this is quite easy to do in poker, many things can sound good to people with no idea.

Your play in the videos is so standard for 2009, But even at 100nl regs wont let you get away with cbetting 85%, check raising 30% and 3betting(3betting completely randomly with no structure btw) 35%. No good regs play anything like what you suggest, and I know you will think that doesn't mean anything and you still seem to think you could crush but thats not very realistic.

I am not surprised your students do well, they play fish and I am sure for a lot of people your coaching with profits is a great idea if they have no other options. I just think that course is waaay over priced and not relevant against anyone but fish.

Anyway I don't want to argue with you too much because you are a much better talker than me. I just wanted to put my opinion down and maybe save someone from wasting their money like I did.
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Old 01-06-2015, 10:50 AM   #1306
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@biggerboots:

My offer stands. We can do all those things and you will see with how much you can get away with or not. You misunderstand the course when you claim that i advise cbetting x% or defending y%.
Please closely read again my previous post. It is about understanding.

On last thing to correct:

The people these days who starts with Coaching for Profits do NOT watch the HU Mastermind.Why?
=> It is made to take advantage of regs and not weaker players. There are close to no or very little examples of play vs fish in the whole course.

Like i said. I respect your right to have your own opinions, but not your own facts. I am very professional and passionate and don't like to see unsatisfied clients (like yourself).

On the other side i do understand life ain't perfect and one cannot make everybody happy. It is however my goal to get as close as possible to that perfection.

Other than that i wish you all the best. I wish you would take me up on my offer. It is a lot easier to help an accomplished player like yourself - if you are willing to.

If you want we can create a free video for the community here where i comment your play and where i will demonstrate why so many people love the HU Mastermind course.

If you want to leave things like they are, it is ok. I will have to defend incorrect criticism though.

But you should know that i don't take any of this personal. If you need anything, you can always come back as a friend and find an open line at support@bestpokercoaching.com

Gordon
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Old 01-06-2015, 11:06 AM   #1307
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@BiggerBoots You seem a bit like a troll just saying. ThinkItThrough just wrote he would personally help you be more successful if you put in the work and your response was basically no thanks.

Playing vs only fish is relative to what a fish is. If you were to play WCGRider he would consider you a fish. If your skill is much higher than the next guy then that player becomes the equivalent to a fish...

I don't play much HU but I have bought the course and I played who ever sat me and did pretty well when I played HU. I don't remember all of the content but from what I remember it had a lot to do with being observant and making adjustments to your opponents. I don't remember a section about 3betting 30% under all conditions or some of the other things you claim it instructs players to do.
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Old 01-06-2015, 12:30 PM   #1308
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re: Bestpokercoaching.com. Coaching For Profits. From $50 to $100k in 9months. Publicly Documented.

Hello, is the no bs6max book still available?When I buy it do I still recieve the videos or that was just a limited offer?
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Old 01-06-2015, 01:14 PM   #1309
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Hello, is the no bs6max book still available?When I buy it do I still recieve the videos or that was just a limited offer?
Yes, still available + videos. 47 Euro.

www.bestpokercoaching.com/ , then click on poker course and you will find it.

I can't directly link, because when creating the title no-bull**** 6max , it goes through the profanity filter of 2p2 as you see. Hence the link would not show up correctly
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Old 01-07-2015, 04:20 AM   #1310
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Originally Posted by shipitholla View Post
@BiggerBoots You seem a bit like a troll just saying. ThinkItThrough just wrote he would personally help you be more successful if you put in the work and your response was basically no thanks.

Playing vs only fish is relative to what a fish is. If you were to play WCGRider he would consider you a fish. If your skill is much higher than the next guy then that player becomes the equivalent to a fish...

I don't play much HU but I have bought the course and I played who ever sat me and did pretty well when I played HU. I don't remember all of the content but from what I remember it had a lot to do with being observant and making adjustments to your opponents. I don't remember a section about 3betting 30% under all conditions or some of the other things you claim it instructs players to do.
This entire post is completely retarded. The guy gave an honest review of the product. All you can say is 'well he offered to help you so it's ok'. Is Gordon going to do this with every person who buys the course and is unsatisfied? I bought the no BS course and have similar feelings. Maybe pre 2009 it would yield better results, but unless you are table selecting religiously, it's hard to see it working. Fwiw, I implemented the strategy in no BS for 200k hands and achieved -1bb/100 at 25NL zoom.
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Old 01-07-2015, 10:04 AM   #1311
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post your db here and let all the sherlocks point out the tens of thousands of mistake you made jimmy

Reading a book and thinking you implemented it does not mean you did.

if you are -1bb @ 25nl you are just not cut out for this game as playing 18/16 and folding to any kind of raise will win up to 25 pretty much anywhere
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Old 01-07-2015, 10:12 AM   #1312
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@Jimmy: Btw,NL25 zoom is probably one of the toughest fields out there. I do not recommend to play it. You have (relatively) high rake there + a lot tougher competition on averge.
I shouldn't say this, but i'm pretty sure -1bb there is not that "bad". You're probably top 20% (not sure, just assuming). Still bad that you lose before RB, i don't wanna get into the habit of praising that. If you played 8tlbs zoom, you're not bad in my book.
You should always do better of course, no doubt. Try normal tables until your BR grows further. NL100 has again a better rake/winrate ratio.

On the topic:
Let's not call each other words. Shipit posted his opinion, i appreciate that. I don't think biggerboots is a troll. He is honest, but factual he is not correct in what he says. It's imo not very mature to watch a few videos, go on a huge rant and call things dog**** that made tons of people tons of money. That doesn't sound like a fair and rational feedback to me. I checked some of his posting history. He is not a very positive person. He does not encourage people, his goal is not to help others. Looks like he is an ok-ish player tho. If he did all the homework, asked questions and then saw no progress, then it's a different story. But just going on a rant because you don't "like" a video is just that.

(although that has NEVER* happened... and there is a reason why. If you take a high quality program and combine it with hard work, there is only one logical result)

I have yet to see anybody who watches/reads a course, regularly works on their game and does not win. People can post for free on BPC and receive tons of help.

The truth is that nobody watches a video course and becomes a huge winner overnight. I always mention to regularly post in forums, ask questions, learn the exceptions...
We have enough people who just use the no-bs and have tremendous results. (just in this thread alone...and i didn't ask them to post)
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Old 01-07-2015, 10:13 AM   #1313
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post your db here and let all the sherlocks point out the tens of thousands of mistake you made jimmy

Reading a book and thinking you implemented it does not mean you did.

if you are -1bb @ 25nl you are just not cut out for this game as playing 18/16 and folding to any kind of raise will win up to 25 pretty much anywhere
I think that's good advice.

I don't totally agree with the last paragraph, but asking for help and continually improving is a big portion of success.
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Old 01-07-2015, 10:42 AM   #1314
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This entire post is completely retarded.
I almost forgot why I only had about 60 post in here the last 6 years, Love this community!

My response to that player wasn't about his original post because everyone is entitled to an opinion but it was in response to him feeling he wasn't getting much out of the course and being offered personal help and saying no thanks. So to me it feels like his interest was to be malicious rather than give feedback. What emphasized that to me as well is that the guy made around 100k last year so what is he doing buying a beginner-intermediate course anyway?

I also read no-bs and think it works great upto 100nl but everyone adds their own playing style to what they learn rather than becoming robots so people will have different levels of success.
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Old 01-07-2015, 02:01 PM   #1315
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re: Bestpokercoaching.com. Coaching For Profits. From $50 to $100k in 9months. Publicly Documented.

I believe Gordon's book works. I believe that Gordon knows poker well and he's right with his approach.

However, the biggest problem I found is that the sites he recommends playing on have terrible software. Can you make a big winner on CFP on Stars?
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Old 01-07-2015, 10:53 PM   #1316
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Originally Posted by ThinkItThrough View Post
@Jimmy: Btw,NL25 zoom is probably one of the toughest fields out there. I do not recommend to play it. You have (relatively) high rake there + a lot tougher competition on averge.
I shouldn't say this, but i'm pretty sure -1bb there is not that "bad". You're probably top 20% (not sure, just assuming).
In that case, what game(s) on Stars do you recommend for people using your materials/books for someone with a 500-1k bankroll?
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Old 01-08-2015, 07:05 AM   #1317
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In that case, what game(s) on Stars do you recommend for people using your materials/books for someone with a 500-1k bankroll?
Reg tables.
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Old 01-08-2015, 11:00 AM   #1318
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Zoom up to NL10 seems fine to play.

Like JPE23 said, regular tables are good alternative.

Just make sure to not blame zoom vs regular tables for "bad play". Improving your game is still the most important part.
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Old 01-08-2015, 11:28 AM   #1319
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re: Bestpokercoaching.com. Coaching For Profits. From $50 to $100k in 9months. Publicly Documented.

Hey Gordon,
Just wanted to stop by and wish you a delayed holidays.....
Hope 2015 is a killer year for BCP ( im sure it will be)
Cheers!
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Old 01-08-2015, 06:39 PM   #1320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyjesus View Post
Hi.

Would the no BS course be appropriate for zoom games on stars?

Thanks


Quote:
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Yes. Definitely.
Funny, you did not mention that 10NL was the highest level of zoom the no BS course would be effective for when asked.
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Old 01-08-2015, 08:54 PM   #1321
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Funny, you did not mention that 10NL was the highest level of zoom the no BS course would be effective for when asked.
Jimmy, it would help if you'd assume the best of people and give them the benefit of the doubt.
You could ask nicely (or read my answers in more detail) and then you will be helped.

Let me help explain to you in more detail what i have already said in short above:

Microstakes can in theory be HARDER to beat than small stakes. Why?

Example 1:

* The rake on microstakes can easily be 20bb/100 (not exact numbers, but simplified for understanding) . If you beat the field for 25bb/100 pre-rake, then you still have a 5bb "real" winrate

* If you beat the field for 17bb you will be a net -3bb/100 losing player

Example 2:

* The rake at small stakes is lets say 10bb/100 . If you beat the field for 25bb, you have a net 15bb winrate (compare that to the 5bb winrate at micros!!!)

* If you beat the field for 17bb, you are STILL a 7bb/100 winner


Conclusion: Move up where they respect your raises.... NOT


There is a little "mistake" in my example. Of course you wont beat small stakes at the same rate as micro stakes.
However, if you take away the black-white thinking it is VERY possible that a player looses at NL25, but is a slight winner at NL50.

Practise:
It seems like NL25 zoom on stars is tough (relatively) and the rake/winrate ratio sucks hard there that it is a lot harder to beat than NL50 for somebody who has only slightly more skill.

However, NL50 zoom and NL100 zoom are a lot easier to beat (relatively speaking!). Don't quote me and say that i think NL100 is easier than NL25.

This is also the reason why i advise a very aggressive Bankroll management on microstakes.


Lesson to be learnt:

I mention in my videos/courses that part of being professional at this game is to CONSTANTLY watch those things.
The field in zoom is always tougher and favors the stronger players even more (generally). If you are among those (like my student Hansthegreat) then you can simply kill because nobody can avoid you.

Everything i say can change in one year or even 6months. You have to constantly keep an eye on things.

Most of the time the hard truth for bad results however is that a player simply sucks. Working on your game is always the easiest way to improve.
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Old 01-08-2015, 08:55 PM   #1322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DddogKILLAh View Post
Hey Gordon,
Just wanted to stop by and wish you a delayed holidays.....
Hope 2015 is a killer year for BCP ( im sure it will be)
Cheers!
Thanks a lot man! A great 2015 for you as well!
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Old 01-08-2015, 09:12 PM   #1323
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Quote:
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Jimmy, it would help if you'd assume the best of people and give them the benefit of the doubt.
You could ask nicely (or read my answers in more detail) and then you will be helped.

Let me help explain to you in more detail what i have already said in short above:

Microstakes can in theory be HARDER to beat than small stakes. Why?

Example 1:

* The rake on microstakes can easily be 20bb/100 (not exact numbers, but simplified for understanding) . If you beat the field for 25bb/100 pre-rake, then you still have a 5bb "real" winrate

* If you beat the field for 17bb you will be a net -3bb/100 losing player

Example 2:

* The rake at small stakes is lets say 10bb/100 . If you beat the field for 25bb, you have a net 15bb winrate (compare that to the 5bb winrate at micros!!!)

* If you beat the field for 17bb, you are STILL a 7bb/100 winner


Conclusion: Move up where they respect your raises.... NOT


There is a little "mistake" in my example. Of course you wont beat small stakes at the same rate as micro stakes.
However, if you take away the black-white thinking it is VERY possible that a player looses at NL25, but is a slight winner at NL50.

Practise:
It seems like NL25 zoom on stars is tough (relatively) and the rake/winrate ratio sucks hard there that it is a lot harder to beat than NL50 for somebody who has only slightly more skill.

However, NL50 zoom and NL100 zoom are a lot easier to beat (relatively speaking!). Don't quote me and say that i think NL100 is easier than NL25.

This is also the reason why i advise a very aggressive Bankroll management on microstakes.


Lesson to be learnt:

I mention in my videos/courses that part of being professional at this game is to CONSTANTLY watch those things.
The field in zoom is always tougher and favors the stronger players even more (generally). If you are among those (like my student Hansthegreat) then you can simply kill because nobody can avoid you.

Everything i say can change in one year or even 6months. You have to constantly keep an eye on things.

Most of the time the hard truth for bad results however is that a player simply sucks. Working on your game is always the easiest way to improve.

I mean you kind of have a habit of constructing replies with content which is irrelevant to the initial argument. I asked you quite clearly, before I purchased, if the course would be suitable for Zoom games. You replied with a definitive 'Yes'. Now you're telling me that 10NL is the highest stake at which this could be effective. So, although your opinion on 25NL zoom may be valid, it is irrelevant as you did not point this out when questioned before I purchased.

Seems kind of douchey/dishonest imo.
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Old 01-08-2015, 10:32 PM   #1324
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Hi.

Would the no BS course be appropriate for zoom games on stars?

Thanks
3 weeks later:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyjesus View Post
Fwiw, I implemented the strategy in no BS for 200k hands and achieved -1bb/100 at 25NL zoom.
Sorry, but I think you're lying. Are you saying you fully read and learnt the course and then you played 200k hands in just 3 weeks?

Also, you should define what you mean by "effective" and "suitable". Are you expecting to win at a winrate that nobody can achieve with any strategy? It's a poker course, not witchcraft.
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Old 01-09-2015, 02:22 AM   #1325
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re: Bestpokercoaching.com. Coaching For Profits. From $50 to $100k in 9months. Publicly Documented.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypersphere View Post
3 weeks later:



Sorry, but I think you're lying. Are you saying you fully read and learnt the course and then you played 200k hands in just 3 weeks?

Also, you should define what you mean by "effective" and "suitable". Are you expecting to win at a winrate that nobody can achieve with any strategy? It's a poker course, not witchcraft.
No need to apologise, I really don't care whether or not you believe me.

Again, kind of away from the point I am making. OP did not state (when asked) that the course would be unsuitable for anything above 10NL zoom. As somebody who plays 25NL zoom, I find this decidedly inconvenient and will be requesting a refund from the seller.
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