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Problem of the week 27 Problem of the week 27

02-17-2011 , 09:12 AM
So I met up with UK high stakes cash player Jackal69 after he PM'ed me and we went and had some drinks and a medium length pool match in a spit and sawdust East End pub. This problem is taken from our match, and he is currently 6-1 down in an unlimited race for pride.

The table is dead in places, with very tight pockets, and we are playing blackball rules. You are a solid amateur, capable of running out in most spots other than hard, long runs of balls, and with a solid safety repetoire. Your opponent is skilled and playing hyper aggressive, is yet to play a safety shot, and has won most of the frames so far in one or two visits.

You are yellows, and are near dead straight on the lower yellow.



Best shot and why?

Solution:
Spoiler:
So in problem of the week 27 we are in a nasty spot at the money end of a game of UK 8 ball. We have very little angle to play with on the shot we have, and with the tightness of UK pockets there is very little we can do with the cue-ball if we want to have any real chance of potting the ball.

To add to this, we have a nasty yellow up-table, stuck to the rail and not looking pretty. We also have the black in open play, and a very skilled opponent who so far seems to be able to pot most things from most parts of the table. We are also 6-1 down, and despite being a casual game, getting beat badly is never nice.

Not a great situation.

However, just like in poker and backgammon, in pool we are always trying to maximise what equity we do have, and in this case we have two plausible options:

1. Roll the yellow nearest to us over the pocket, leave a hard black for our opponent, hope he misses and try and run out.

2. Sink our yellow, then try and bank the far yellow into the same pocket the black is over. Low percentage shot on such a table, but one that wins us the game if we make it, and that carries an OK extra safety shot if the yellow rattles and stays over the pocket.

Option one has the obvious and very real problem of letting the opponent back to the table. Banks are one of the strongest areas of any good pool players game, and this shot is probably 70% to go in if not more when such a player goes for it. Not great equity. We are also not guaranteed to get on the final ball even if everything goes to plan – accurate table length screw shots and position off rail shots are never easy on random tables for amateurs, and we may not win the game even if our opponent misses.

Option two also has an obvious flaw – if we miss the very hard table bank even slightly, we leave a gimme for the game. It has a bonus that option one does not though (albeit a slim one) – you can win without the dangerous opponent getting back to the table, which is always a massive priority against good players.

So we have a pretty simple equity calculation – compare the odds that you think you will cover the pocket or sink the table bank against what you think the chances of the opponent are of making the double and you running out if/when they miss.

However, in this case, this equity calculation is probably pretty similar. The chances of a good amateur with decent positional play getting the bank close to or in the pocket is probably about 70%, and there is not much in the rough equities involved. So is there anything else to consider? Well, yes, and in this case it is the score.

Good players thrive off of big leads, and your key priority here is to desperately try and get some frames on the board and get back in the game. Just like when being run over in poker, in pool at some point you have to make a stand, and taking a stand in pool involves either getting much more aggressive and trying to take the game away a little and shake up your opponent, or slowing them down with lots of safety play. There is no solid safety option here really (certainly not one that will slow up an aggressive player with a big lead), and for this reason, in a spot such as this where the equities are all relatively similar, I think I always err towards playing the aggressive option – sink the yellow and try and table bank to other win the game or cover the pocket.

Solution – go for the aggressive shot. Sink the yellow nearest the cue ball and try the table bank/double at pocket speed/dead weight to either sink it and win the game, or cover the pocket.


In this actual situation, Jackal69 rolled the yellow over the bottom right corner, and I sunk the double. However, this game seemed to tilt him a little into opening his game up a lot. He won the next three with some very daring and aggressive play (often successfully taking on spots much harder than the one here), which shook me up enough to force me to roll in my game a bit and start playing tactically astute pool rather than the potting blitzkrieg I had been employing up to then.

Playing a more advanced and balanced game, and with the alcohol affecting him a bit more than it was me, I won all of the games after his mini-comeback, finishing the match at 15-4; although had he got aggressive here and got it back to 6-2 rather than 7-1 before his comeback, the match may have played out quite differently.

Last edited by RayPowers; 02-24-2011 at 11:00 AM. Reason: Solution Added
02-17-2011 , 12:06 PM
kind of like dropping the straightish yellow in, with the intention of doubling the other one, either potting it or covering the black if we don't.

which end is baulk? just thinking in terms of where he'd be if we fouled
02-17-2011 , 12:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour

which end is baulk? just thinking in terms of where he'd be if we fouled
Baulk is the far end of the table, nearest the window in the picture.
02-17-2011 , 06:18 PM
full disclosure - i'm probably the worst pool player in this forum. also i'm just assuming that you have to hit in the two yellows then the black.

i've had shots like this and i just try to pot the nearest yellow with crazy backspin bringing the cue to the other end of the table for a chance at the other yellow. knowing you will run out if we miss, we have to go for this right?

sorry for making you read my post.
02-17-2011 , 07:39 PM
my first though was that i dont like the pot the first yellow and attempt the double. with the table being a pub table (more then likely have nice big damaged patches were a pint has been spilt on it, and very overly abused rails which will give a very unexpected bounce), the table length double is very hard to judge speed and directionally, even a more complex cross double in to the middle would be hard. i also think even if we get our table length double close it leaves the black on enough times and will move the cue ball down the table towards the black.

so with no easy run out option i would look to move one of our yellows in to the middle of the table and make sure the white is tight to a rail leaving him little or no attacking shots, if we get the cue ball tight to the bottom rail we leave him a double to the middle. with the added risk of the in off (not sure if that's just the angle of the picture though). if he gets it fair play, if he misses we now have one yellow in the middle of the table and a good chance to run out.
02-17-2011 , 10:42 PM
leave yellow over pocket and white on the cushion leaving you a hard double (do you make those a lot?) then hopefully win when you miss would be my play
02-18-2011 , 01:11 PM
I can only see two sensible options; rolling the yellow over the pocket, or potting the yellow and doubling the other yellow over/in the 'black' pocket.

Which is more likely; the opponent doubling the black in the centre if we take the first option, or us failing to at least block off the black if we take the second? We also have to consider that on a poor table with very tight pockets, it's not 100% that we can clear up if he misses the double.

Given that this player is good and aggressive, I think he will really fancy the double, so I think the pot and then double over/in the corner is the best option.
02-19-2011 , 12:10 AM
I'd really love to pot the near yellow then cross corner the far yellow into the pocket near the black. However, the table isn't exactly in great shape (as stipulated by Wamy) so I wouldn't trust myself on the long range shots, much less long range bank shot. Even if the it is a brand new, top quality table, it looks like the 8 ball might interfere with the cross corner. What I'd do is move the yellow over the bottom right pocket and try to leave the cue ball so it's touching, or atleast very close, to the yellow. That way, villain's only option is the cross side which would be made harder if the cueball's really close to the yellow.
02-19-2011 , 02:12 AM
Is it a foul to knock in a yellow if you're the player on the eight? If so then I'd roll the yellow over the hole and let him enjoy himself banking the eight.

If however he's allowed to knock in my yellow ball then I don't like that option because he could counter it by clipping the eight up towards the baulk pocket and playing the billiard to knock in my yellow. Then I'd be in really bad position. I think in that case I go ahead and either stroke my brains out to make my ball and walk the cue ball up to the baulk cushion or cinch my first shot and play the bank to the lower left pocket on the second shot, hoping to plug the hole for his eight if I miss.
02-19-2011 , 04:28 AM
rail first with mid bottom-right..stroke it so the object ball has left spin rolling toward the pocket -> cue deflects down toward top left corner
02-19-2011 , 05:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dinopoker
Is it a foul to knock in a yellow if you're the player on the eight? If so then I'd roll the yellow over the hole and let him enjoy himself banking the eight.

If however he's allowed to knock in my yellow ball then I don't like that option because he could counter it by clipping the eight up towards the baulk pocket and playing the billiard to knock in my yellow. Then I'd be in really bad position. I think in that case I go ahead and either stroke my brains out to make my ball and walk the cue ball up to the baulk cushion or cinch my first shot and play the bank to the lower left pocket on the second shot, hoping to plug the hole for his eight if I miss.
Yeah under blackball rules it would be a foul if I potted his yellow without sinking one of my balls on the same visit.
02-19-2011 , 10:20 PM
i'd be rolling the yellow over the pockey and letting him shoot at the double. Seems like the highest percentage shot
02-21-2011 , 10:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixfour
kind of like dropping the straightish yellow in, with the intention of doubling the other one, either potting it or covering the black if we don't.

which end is baulk? just thinking in terms of where he'd be if we fouled
I think this is the best situation I've seen yet with a genuine split of opinion between leaving the double on/not potting or potting and then double the yellow down the table.

Wamy is going to be close to 50:50 for the double and in any event he'll be able to leave the white in such a way that position on the top yellow is not guaranteed even with accurate deep screw. Personally, I like the double back down the table after potting the yellow, covering the black pocket. But we must have our hand on the table for this shot or at least be able to get full contact on the cue ball. Therefore I am forcing this first yellow a bit but I can't quite make the angle out. I am probably using some top and bouncing off. I'm 65%+ to cover the black with my hand on the table although it is possible this is a better shot for me than Jackal as I played exclusively world rules all through uni.
02-24-2011 , 11:00 AM
Bump for solution added.
02-25-2011 , 09:26 AM
Cheers for the bump. 'Twas a good answer
02-25-2011 , 12:46 PM
Astyanax will play pool for monies in the London area!

      
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