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Old 10-11-2014, 10:26 PM   #76
David Sklansky
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

Whether or not Mosconi was the best, his record was partially math. If the top 100 players were paid $5000 a week and a ten million dollar prize to break his record on the same table and all they did everyday was attempt to do it, it would certainly be broken in ten years.
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Old 10-12-2014, 12:05 AM   #77
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

that is certainly true. but the reason it probably wont be broken or wasnt in the past is that almost all straight pool games are to 100 or 150 points. so the game is over. only in exhibitions would the player really get to continue on.

mosconi gave lots of them as he worked for brunswick and gave an exhibition every time a new pool room opened with their tables. and also traveled and gave exhibitions in hotels and centers.

still out of the many top straight pool players not many have a run over 250 balls.
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Old 10-12-2014, 12:34 AM   #78
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

Quote:
Originally Posted by ligastar View Post
i didn't want to start a new thread for this simple question so i hope it is ok that i put it here.

i'm watching this video of a world 9-ball championship match and there is a thin metallic looking thing below the balls during the break. after the break, the referee removes it from the table. what is this and what is its purpose? thx ahead of time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkbhCnT9bDg
It's the rack. Something like this...

http://www.pooldawg.com/product/8-9-ball-magic-rack

It's an easier way of freezing all of the balls together. Less movement on the nine-ball is just a result of getting the balls frozen. If one of the balls surrounding the nine is not frozen to it, the nine has a better chance of flying out of the pack.
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Old 10-12-2014, 06:07 AM   #79
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

^^^

thx
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Old 09-21-2015, 01:55 AM   #80
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Originally Posted by 4 of a KINDBUD View Post
Sorry but I dont think so. Mosconi V Reyes would be a hell of a match. Mosconi played all games not just str8 pool. Even though he is famous for his str8 pool run of 526 balls. WHICH BTW if you didnt know, he didnt miss the 527th ball, after 526 he just put his stick down and said "that'll be enough to hold the record"!!!!

How freakin awesome is that!
Efren Reyes undoubtedly was the best ever. He did something else that no American did which was revolutionizing the game of pool with his signature safety plays and precision kick shots. Making balls and running out the table is just secondary which any top rated player could do like Strickland, Van Boening, Imonen and the rest but when the balls oftentimes get clustered as in one pocket, 15-ball rotation and sometimes in 8 ball, that where his advantage comes in and this draws the line between him and the rest. He is also the best ever I have seen playing opposite hand. The popular pool commentators/players as Billy, Freddy and Danny all agreed that he is the best ever they have seen and some top players too agreed as Johnny, Rodney and Ralph. If you were to play him any pool game all day, in the long run, he will beat you, whether golf, snooker, balkline or 3 cushion billiards. Unfortunately, nature has finally caught up with age and deteriorating eyesight.
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Old 09-24-2015, 01:02 PM   #81
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeShot View Post
It's the rack. Something like this...

http://www.pooldawg.com/product/8-9-ball-magic-rack

It's an easier way of freezing all of the balls together. Less movement on the nine-ball is just a result of getting the balls frozen. If one of the balls surrounding the nine is not frozen to it, the nine has a better chance of flying out of the pack.
I thought that with the more perfect systems for racking, it led to more 9 balls being made on the break. And that that is why some leagues changed the rack position, with the 9 ball, not the 1 ball, on the spot. No?

Edit: Well doing a little more reading it looks like the rack is moved up to keep other balls from sinking, not the 9. So there is typically less 9 ball action on a tighter rack?
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Old 09-24-2015, 03:19 PM   #82
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Edit: Well doing a little more reading it looks like the rack is moved up to keep other balls from sinking, not the 9. So there is typically less 9 ball action on a tighter rack?
Correct. One ball on the spot = make the wing ball every time in the corner or the one ball in the side if you know what you're doing. If the rack is perfectly tight, the 9 won't move as much. Most players prefer to not count the 9 on the break as a win anymore anyway.
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Old 09-24-2015, 10:44 PM   #83
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

the racking and breaking has ruined the game of nine ball.
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Old 10-10-2015, 06:26 AM   #84
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger13579 View Post
Efren Reyes undoubtedly was the best ever. He did something else that no American did which was revolutionizing the game of pool with his signature safety plays and precision kick shots. Making balls and running out the table is just secondary which any top rated player could do like Strickland, Van Boening, Imonen and the rest but when the balls oftentimes get clustered as in one pocket, 15-ball rotation and sometimes in 8 ball, that where his advantage comes in and this draws the line between him and the rest. He is also the best ever I have seen playing opposite hand. The popular pool commentators/players as Billy, Freddy and Danny all agreed that he is the best ever they have seen and some top players too agreed as Johnny, Rodney and Ralph. If you were to play him any pool game all day, in the long run, he will beat you, whether golf, snooker, balkline or 3 cushion billiards. Unfortunately, nature has finally caught up with age and deteriorating eyesight.
He had lasik a few years ago re: eyes.... and he did win the accu-stats 1p invitational with svb, frost, alex, hall, and danny smith. svb and efren played 1p race to 11 a few years ago and it was amazing to watch. didnt break like they do today with the rack knowledge, and he doesn't care to learn, which is fine for him....he's got some titles left in him, maybe even a derby all-around.....
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Old 12-16-2015, 08:40 PM   #85
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Originally Posted by RichGangi View Post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IocXrswOU1o
'All I can tell you is, if I shot that ball, I probably woulda had a heart attack.'
I can't think of a player who can beat this Mr.Reyes at his prime.. his like Michael Jordan in a pool table
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:43 AM   #86
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Originally Posted by 4 of a KINDBUD View Post
Sorry but I dont think so. Mosconi V Reyes would be a hell of a match. Mosconi played all games not just str8 pool. Even though he is famous for his str8 pool run of 526 balls. WHICH BTW if you didnt know, he didnt miss the 527th ball, after 526 he just put his stick down and said "that'll be enough to hold the record"!!!!
That's false, Mosconi did miss to end his run. He later made up the story that he didn't miss.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:45 AM   #87
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

I don't know if anyone has mentioned Harold Worst yet, but he is usually the other player mentioned in the all-around discussion with Reyes.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:48 AM   #88
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Originally Posted by Malemute Kid View Post
Reyes pays 8 and 9 ball extremely well. Obviously must be a fine (at least) banks player; not sure about "Straight" or One Pocket.
Reyes is almost unanimously considered the greatest one-pocket player ever. He's also probably the best rotation player ever and the best 8-ball player ever. The only thing that holds him back in the discussion when it comes to 9-ball is his break, which wasn't as powerful as some of the other top players of all time, but it was good enough to beat Earl Strickland in two long races at 9-ball, the most famous of which was "the color of money" race to 120 in 1996:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GgEfN4HsEs
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:50 AM   #89
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Originally Posted by David Sklansky View Post
Whether or not Mosconi was the best, his record was partially math. If the top 100 players were paid $5000 a week and a ten million dollar prize to break his record on the same table and all they did everyday was attempt to do it, it would certainly be broken in ten years.
I think it would be broken much sooner than that, by one of the top 20 players in the world.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:53 AM   #90
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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Originally Posted by Wamy Einehouse View Post
Grunch.

The best cash player is the man who won the most in their life on the felt at cash games. This is probably Archie Karas from the little reliable info that filters through about nosebleed pool, although there are a few other solid claimants and this could easily be totally wrong.
No, in all likelihood that would be Jack Cooney.
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Old 08-29-2016, 09:46 AM   #91
dex 1
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

[QUOTE=GarthAlgar;33153879]Efren Reyes.....

2011 US Open One Pocket Championship[16]
2010 UPA International Ten-ball Championships
2010 Hard Times Billiards, 3rd Annual Chuck Markulis Memorial Tournament
2010 Predator Ten-ball International Championship[17]
2010 Derby City Classic Master of the Table[18]
2010 Derby City Classic Fatboy Challenge 10-ball[19]
2010 Derby City Classic Nine-ball[20]
2009 World Mixed Doubles Classic (with Rubilen Amit)[21]
2009 Galveston Classic One Pocket[22]
2009 World Cup of Pool (with Django Bustamante)
2007 Derby City Classic Master of the Table
2007 Derby City Classic One-Pocket
2007 Pool & Billiard Magazine Top 20 Favorite Players (number 2)
2006 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Jakarta Leg)
2006 IPT World Open Eight-ball Championship
2006 World Cup of Pool (with Django Bustamante)
2006 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Vietnam Leg)
2006 Derby City Classic One-Pocket
2005 IPT King of the Hill Eight-ball Shootout
2005 Derby City Nine-ball Championship
2005 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Jakarta Leg)
2005 Japan Open
2005 Derby City Classic Master of the Table
2005 Derby City Classic Nine-ball
2005 Derby City Classic One-Pocket
2004 WPA World Eight-ball Championship
2004 On Cue 3: Intercontinental Conquest
2004 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Singapore Leg)
2004 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Vietnam Leg)
2004 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Taiwan Leg)
2004 Derby City Classic Master of the Table
2004 Derby City Classic One-Pocket
2003 Billiard Congress of America Hall of Fame
2003 World Classic Billiards Tournament
2003 Las Vegas Nine-ball Open
2003 WPA Asian Nine-ball Tour (Manila Leg)
2003 Mid-Atlantic Nine-ball Championship
2003 All Japan Championship
2002 Asian Games Eight-ball singles (bronze)
2002 World Pool League
2002 Asian Eight-ball Tournament
2002 Cafe Puro Challenge of the Masters
2002 Shooters Labor Day Weekend Open Nine-ball
2002 International Challenge of Champions
2001 World Pool League
2001 Tokyo Nine-ball Event
2001 US Masters Nine-ball
2001 International Billiard Tournament
2001 Accu-Stats Eight-ball Invitational
2001 The Color of Money II Challenge Match (vs Earl Strickland)
2000 U.S. Open One-Pocket Championship
2000 PBT World Eight-ball Championship
2000 Camel Pro Eight-ball Championship
2000 Pennsylvania State Nine-ball Championship
2000 USA Billards Challenger Event 2
1999 ESPN Ultimate Nine-ball Challenge
1999 ESPN Ultimate Shootout
1999 Sands Regency Open 29 Nine-ball Championship
1999 WPA World Nine-ball Championship (Cardiff, Wales)
1999 Derby City Classic Master of the Table
1999 Derby City Classic One-Pocket
1998 World Eight-Ball Championship
1998 Camel South Jersey Ten-Ball Open
1997 PCA Shooters Challenge
1997 PCA Treasure Island Resort Event
1996 The Color of Money (vs Earl Strickland)
1996 PBT World Eight-ball Championship
1996 PBT Legends of Nine-ball Championship
1996 Camel World Nine-ball Championship
1996 PBT Western Open
1996 PBT Florida Flare Up III
1995 Sands Regency Open 21 Nine-ball Championship
1995 PBT World Eight-ball Championship
1995 Pro Tour Nine-ball Championship
1995 Maine 14.1 Event
1995 Bicycle Club VII
1994 U.S. Open Nine-Ball Championships
1994 PBT Bicycle Club Invitational
1992 International Nine-ball Classic
1992 World Nine-ball Open (Tokyo)
1990 World Cup (Taipei)
1988 PBA McDermott Masters Nine-ball
1986 Sands Regency Nine-ball Championship
1985 Sands Regency Nine-ball Championship
1985 Red's Nine-ball Open
1985 Tar Heel Open
1985 Willard's Open
1985 Chicago Billiard Cafe Open


MEH..[/QUOTE

A few thoughts. Pool players (including snooker & billiards) & bowlers just don't make much money....unless u can find 2 players with big time stake horses in pool maybe.

How much money do u think Reyes made for winning all the above tourneys?

Two games I enjoy watching the women play more than the men. Tennis & Pool. I doubt if this woman is on top anymore, just because she was for so long & everybody ages & runs out of gas & skill.

But for many years when I was channel surfing & landed on ESPN & it was the finals of a 9-ball tourney....one of the players was almost always this English (I think) player named Alison somebody. Everybody knows the best players are the ones who leave themselves good position for their next shot.

Or (as in 9-ball) leave their opponent in bad position with tough decisions to make.

And lastly, the shot where the cue ball is on the rail near a corner pocket, only the 9-ball is left and its just a touch too far down the table to try to cut it in a side....that is a tough shot to make to win a tourney.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:01 PM   #92
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

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No, in all likelihood that would be Jack Cooney.
Well Jack never made a game where he didn't have two or three balls the best of it, so that probably helped him with the nerves of playing for high stakes.
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Old 08-29-2016, 02:16 PM   #93
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Re: All time Best all around player? - $

thats why he was a long term winner. but not as much as people give credit for.

if it wasnt for the rack in detroit most would not ever had a decent score that could tide them through a year.
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