Agreed.

Looking back, I don't think it was that he chose them as children because he personally selected them at that age. He simply saw them come back from the future and reside on the island in 1974-1977 so he knew there was something special about these people and once he found them back in the real world, he had to lead them to the island...both because they were going to be candidates that he valued but also to maintain "whatever happened, happened."

this was sent to me:

This is an email that one of my friends here at DW got from his pal over at Bad Robot. He's been on the production team of Lost since the beginning so he's "in the know."


Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2010 11:51 AM
Subject: from Bad Robot

First ...
The Island:

It was real. Everything that happened on the island that we saw throughout the 6 seasons was real. Forget the final image of the plane crash, it was put in purposely to f*&k with people's heads and show how far the show had come. They really crashed. They really survived. They really discovered Dharma and the Others. The Island keeps the balance of good and evil in the world. It always has and always will perform that role. And the Island will always need a "Protector". Jacob wasn't the first, Hurley won't be the last. However, Jacob had to deal with a malevolent force (MIB) that his mother, nor Hurley had to deal with. He created the devil and had to find a way to kill him -- even though the rules prevented him from actually doing so.

Thus began Jacob's plan to bring candidates to the Island to do the one thing he couldn't do. Kill the MIB. He had a huge list of candidates that spanned generations. Yet everytime he brought people there, the MIB corrupted them and caused them to kill one another. That was until Richard came along and helped Jacob understand that if he didn't take a more active role, then his plan would never work.

Enter Dharma -- which I'm not sure why John is having such a hard time grasping. Dharma, like the countless scores of people that were brought to the island before, were brought there by Jacob as part of his plan to kill the MIB. However, the MIB was aware of this plan and interferred by "corrupting" Ben. Making Ben believe he was doing the work of Jacob when in reality he was doing the work of the MIB. This carried over into all of Ben's "off-island" activities. He was the leader. He spoke for Jacob as far as they were concerned. So the "Others" killed Dharma and later were actively trying to kill Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley and all the candidates because that's what the MIB wanted. And what he couldn't do for himself.

Dharma was originally brought in to be good. But was turned bad by MIB's corruption and eventually destroyed by his pawn Ben. Now, was Dharma only brought there to help Jack and the other Canditates on their overall quest to kill Smokey? Or did Jacob have another list of Canidates from the Dharma group that we were never aware of? That's a question that is purposley not answered because whatever answer the writers came up with would be worse than the one you come up with for yourself. Still ... Dharma's purpose is not "pointless" or even vague. Hell, it's pretty blantent.

Still, despite his grand plan, Jacob wanted to give his "candidates" (our Lostaways) the one thing he, nor his brother, were ever afforded: free will. Hence him bringing a host of "candidates" through the decades and letting them "choose" which one would actually do the job in the end. Maybe he knew Jack would be the one to kill Flocke and that Hurley would be the protector in the end. Maybe he didn't. But that was always the key question of the show: Fate vs Free-will. Science vs Faith. Personally I think Jacob knew from the beginning what was going to happen and that everyone played a part over 6 seasons in helping Jack get to the point where he needed to be to kill Smokey and make Hurley the protector -- I know that's how a lot of the writers viewed it. But again, they won't answer that (nor should they) because that ruins the fun.

In the end, Jack got to do what he always wanted to do from the very first episode of the show: Save his fellow Lostaways. He got Kate and Sawyer off the island and he gave Hurley the purpose in life he'd always been missing. And, in Sideways world (which we'll get to next) he in fact saved everyone by helping them all move on ...

Now...

Sideways World:

Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soulmates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us duing "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduisim with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix.

The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soulmates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spirtual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving.

It's a really cool and spirtual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character backstory, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment.

How much you want to extrapolate from that is up to you as the viewer. Think about season 1 when we first found the Hatch. Everyone thought that's THE answer! Whatever is down there is the answer! Then, as we discovered it was just one station of many. One link in a very long chain that kept revealing more, and more of a larger mosiac.

But the writer's took it even further this season by contrasting this Sideways "purgatory" with the Island itself. Remember when Michael appeared to Hurley, he said he was not allowed to leave the Island. Just like the MIB. He wasn't allowed into this sideways world and thus, was not afforded the opportunity to move on. Why? Because he had proven himself to be unworthy with his actions on the Island. He failed the test. The others, passed. They made it into Sideways world when they died -- some before Jack, some years later. In Hurley's case, maybe centuries later. They exist in this sideways world until they are "awakened" and they can only move on TOGETHER because they are linked. They are destined to be together for eternity. That was their destiny.

They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the chuch -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soulmates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's parnter, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc).

A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to attone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me.

But, from a more "behind the scenes" note: the reason Ben's not in the church, and the reason no one is in the church but for Season 1 people is because they wrote the ending to the show after writing the pilot. And never changed it. The writers always said (and many didn't believe them) that they knew their ending from the very first episode. I applaud them for that. It's pretty fantastic. Originally Ben was supposed to have a 3 episode arc and be done. But he became a big part of the show. They could have easily changed their ending and put him in the church -- but instead they problem solved it. Gave him a BRILLIANT moment with Locke outside the church ... and then that was it. I loved that. For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it.


In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spirtual questions that most shows don't touch. And to me, they never once waivered from their core story -- even with all the sci-fi elements they mixed in. To walk that long and daunting of a creative tightrope and survive is simply astounding.

That would mean they originally crashed on the island by chance though right? Doesn't seem right. The only reason the survivors survived the plane crash I'm pretty sure is because they were candidates that were now protected by the island.

Didn't that email already get posted?

yeah some guy on a Bill's message board forum made it all up

I think it's the weird causal loop thing with time travel. They crashed there, survived etc. because Jacob intervened, Jacob intervened because he saw them there after they went back in time.

If the above is true, I really think you should avoid watching all heavily serialized shows. Cuz I'd say half are gonna end in ways that disappoint you.
LOST wasn't just about getting to the end of the road.

And you don't just take a road trip to get some place better than where you were when you started. The ride to the destination is often 10x more enjoyable than the actual destination.

That's the reason given in the pseudo-writer's email. It sounds like they just wanted to keep the core group as Desmond + original flight survivors.

I think people are reading way too much into 'who is in the church' Ben said that he wasn't ready yet, which suggests that he can enter after he has spent more time with Alex+R.

Ben chose not to enter, the fact this happened after he nearly broke down crying in regards to Alex leads one to believe he still has some issues to deal with.

The only real wtf with the sideways world is Artz. Who the **** is going to wake him up...and if it is no one, then why is he working at the same school as Ben, Locke, Alex and if he isn't going to wake up then are some people in sideways world imaginary even if they were on the island

and TC might also avoid the Odyssey part of the Trojan War; it's just about the ride home.

No, one could argue they were indeed fated to crash on the island. And for the Oceanic 6, that they were fated to go back. But once the time loop closes, one could also argue they started to get choice back in their lives...particularly at the time when Jacob tells them all that he wants them to have a choice.

Also it's like Eloise says in the hospital after Desmond's been shot. "For the first time, I don't know what is about to happen." The time loop has closed. Do they now have choice? Are they still fated to a particular destiny? That's for the viewer to decide I guess.

Just out of curiosity how long was JJ on the show and what exactly did he do? Write? Direct?

Id take that with a strong pinch of salt. If that scene was written years in advance they would have publicy stated it. I mean it was known when JK wrote the last chapter of the Potter book series and Lost would have publicised the fact the same way.

They probably had the framework laid out from the end of season 3 and the eye shutting stuff mirroring the opening scene was probably planned pretty early but they were rewriting the entire pilot whilst in Hawaii and long after casting a few of the roles.

isn't it literally HIS show? i thought he was the creator.

It's funny that you bring up the Odyssey because a couple times I started writing up a contrast between Lost and the Odyssey to show problems I have with the way the show went and how it was the first few seasons.

The Odyssey is obviously a fantastic story. You might say it was epic. If you went back in time and asked Homer about it, I'm sure he'd tell you that it's primarily about the characters as evidenced by the start:
The massive difference between the two is that in the Odyssey the individual parts of the journey were incredible. If you think about it at all, it's obvious that those battles were character-development vehicles but if you completely ignore that they stand on their own. With Lost that isn't the case, or at least many of us don't think so.

Throughout the series it seemed like it was true when we were watching it; first the Others then Widmore seemed to have some evil-genius diabolical **** going on that we would learn more about later. We later learned that this wasn't the case and that the battles were just well made, somewhat generic, action scenes.

Put another way, with the Odyssey the journey is compelling because a lot of very interesting stuff happens to him along the way, plus we see his character evolve and the worst of man in his crew at various stages. With Lost we have that character-development stuff and see the evil in people in various characters but the journey the characters take isn't all that interesting - kidnapping and murder because of greed/corruption/stupidity is pretty standard stuff you see on 90% of TV dramas. The journey the viewers took was, but that was largely because of the implication that more was going on than actually was the case.

For me that's mainly a criticism of the first four seasons. I thought the time-travel stuff was great and an example of the plot itself actually being interesting enough to stand on its own. The same could actually be said of the last season, except the purgatory bit LDO, but going the direction they went revealed the flaws of the first four seasons in hindsight.

He was the producer as far as im aware and probably had a bit of a hand in early planning. Which basically means he put the co-creators (Cuse and Lindelhof) i with his in company writing team at Bad Robot and he will have set them up with the network. He would be instrumental with getting the budget they had but likely had little to no actual creative input in the show past the pilot, if that.

wait a minute - that email is fake? it seemed pretty good for a fake... more details please!!

Yeah, I pretty much have no interest in watching serial dramas again. At least not take them seriously. That was my biggest problem with Lost. They did such a good job making me think they had it figured out that I believed them.

Even though the ride will always be more enjoyable, this destination was just unacceptable.

IIRC, Abrams left midway through the first season to start on "Mission Impossible 3" which was released in 2006. He probably did some consulting but he makes a habit of creating a show and letting someone else run it. (Alias, Lost, Fringe) His name is on every episode as an executive producer and creator but the only episode he directed was the pilot and the only episodes he wrote were the pilot and the season 3 premiere "A Tale of Two Cities".

Lindelof is listed as an executive producer on "Star Trek" but I'm guessing he didn't do anything and that's Abrams way of saying thank you for making him a ****load of money from Lost.

JaredL, you turned the key and triggered another Op=Ed.

I think that is a question of personal taste. The time travel storyline felt like they were trying to be Star Trek, which was fine with me but it alienated the segment of their audience who will never enjoy a minute of sci-fi.
Season 3-4-5 were so detached from the first two that it could be almost treated as a start of a second show.

Some of Odyssey's conflicts are self contained as were a few of them on Lost. Ulysses had the single goal of getting home that controlled the story. Lost started with that but then they try to leave home and get back for a second half.

I think they handled that middle part clumsily and changed their mind more than once. The kidnapping and murder etc. was at times just to fill a season and not integral to the plot. But for me those interludes were never boring.

Thankfully in the final season they got back to basics of the human experience which had mad the show great to begin with. The Jacob v. MiB was revealed as the driving force behind the earlier seasons plots. Was that the best choice? Maybe not. But it wasn't bad either and it wasn't the thing that made the show compelling.

They survived because of the island, not Jacob, imo. I don't think one has to be a candidate to be healed/protected by the island.

Also, in terms of freewill, I've never believed that just because an outside observer knows the choice you'll make it means you didn't make it freely.

Let's say I have freewill and I choose to type "xyz". Why can't some omnipotent being (or being with certain abilities) know I was going to type that?

no it didn't. seemed like typical fanboy speculation with some obvious flaws.

The contradiction to free will isn't in the being's omnipotence, it's in the being's infallibility.

(This wouldn't be a prob w/ Jacob btw. Jacob was wrong/uncertain about a number of things - i.e. he wasn't sure whether Ben was going to kill him or not until he did)

If an infallible being says you will do X and it's impossible that the being is wrong, then you must do X - accordingly it cannot be said that you choose to do X, because it is impossible for you to do otherwise. If every alternative is impossible, there is no choice.

Season 6 doesn't really change how much I've loved LOST, but even though I'm fine with it and enjoyed it doesn't mean they didn't blow Season 6. I don't mean plot, I've watched every episode of the entire series multiple times and it's all fine to me.

They blew the anticipation they created for certain things. I've boiled it down to two that could have set up such a great season 6 while still keeping the entire deadflashes/alt/purgatory storyline. Think of the purgatory storyline as our characters escaping their own egyptian book of the dead for a second. And I don't mean change it, leave the same as it is, just condense it a little (as others have said already).

Each season they pulled the curtain back a little bit, and we expected them to yank it wide open. If you are truly satisfied with Season 6, awesome. I find myself with the others who have said they feel like they should be more upset than they are, because after the end I still love LOST.

The first thing they blew was the beginning of the island (and this leads into S6 pace and how weak the Jacob/MIB story felt because it came so late - this also leads into me thinking if it wasn't Christian(ity) dominated then why didn't we see anything before two thousand years ago in a place that is seemingly timeless?). The beginning is such an easy thing to show happen and still leave quite ambiguous. We needed to see it though. Just my thoughts.

S6 E2

Title: A Long Time Ago

Scene: A beach in a protected cove. Neanderthals at the end of the beach collecting some sort of mollusks from the rocks. Skilled laborers who know exactly what they are doing. They are loading up either a rudimentary cart or travois. They live near here, but not on the beach. Perhaps they are preserving their food with some sort of salt. The amazing thing to us is there is so much bounty they are just taking a small amount of what is there.

One of them looks up and notices something in the sky. It's bigger than a star, smaller than the moon, not even especially bright, but it is daytime after all. Let's throw in a purple tinge. They take their mental notes and we see them finish up and begin their journey home. Scene fade.

New day. Same beach. Same cove, but you can tell the seasons have changed a little. We watch the neanderthals arrive and they are looking at our object in the sky (OITS) as soon as it is within sight. Show a little of our characters, but not enough to make us feel invested in them, just them evolving the methods of their catch. Something we can all relate to. Learning.

Repeat this same scene, but this time our OITS is larger. Our neanderthals are visibly concerned.

The fourth time we see them arrive, we come in on our neanderthals when they are within the sounds of the beach, but not within sight. A high pitched scream is audible. Our group comes up over a rise and is stunned at the sight of the sky on fire. The high pitch scream is rising and the sky turns from a meteor is entering the atmosphere redfire to purple oh hell I love LOST and **** yeah it's the beginning of S6. It could be just something from the outer reaches of space with some exotic matter, or it could be a crashing spaceship, you can play around with all of it, but the point is we are seeing it. What it actually is is the thing you don't need to answer.

(Don't worry about the details because as writers it's only the middle of season 4 and we've realized we've captivated and begun interacting with this great fanbase on this show that has an excellent chance to go down as the best thing that ever graced a television set, so we've got three coked out string theorist grad students in one room hashing it out right now and we're waiting to hear back from the archeologists we're gonna grill that are on a dig at the moment and we have been harassing the history department at Princeton for months now, because, after all, you trust us.)

As Assani said, how hard is that? You could take it a number of different ways from there. You could go tidal wave and we never see our neanderthals again. You could go opposite and have a scene and sound that suggest an implosion of sorts and then we see dead bloody noses being found by the women after they come to look. You could actually just watch the island appear and just sort of flex it's barrier into place. Whatever.

The second thing they blew was the Egyptians/hieroglyphs. My computer already told me I unlocked my microbob after the sixth paragraph so no need to write it out, but the storyline is running through my head. Epic curtain opening. That's all we wanted.

Across The Sea, as late as it came, just didn't cut it.

Which brings me to one more point. The reason all of these things were so anticipated was not only the way they edited the show for us from S1-S4. It was the way they started revealing answers in S5. Through time travel. Which I was totally on board with and love. But once they introduced that we were getting answers by literally going right to them in the past, they dropped the ball by not realizing that once we started going into the past we wanted to go all the way.