So there was a second burn pit at the quarry? I didn't recall that detail just the bones found. I need to pay closer attention. Kills my animal theory.

What's the roommate's story? Seems that TH's mother called to report her missing on Nov. 3rd. TH may have been planning to party on Halloween night, but she doesn't seem like the one-night stand type, nor someone who wouldn't let a roommate know if she was going to be gone for a few days. Why didn't the roommate contact anyone prior to Nov. 3rd? Or if he did, who/when did he contact?

Why strip the car? SA is not going to sell the parts he strips lol So it takes 30 sec to load & unload them another 30 sec to 1min to put the crushed car in the smelter. Job done.
There's a reason every mafia boss had a friend in the business & it was not cheap parts.

Yeah... I think I'm gonna with the explanation of a redditor who actually worked for a scrap company over your first hit in youtube for the search term car crusher.

A day might be stretching it, but I highly doubt the whole process is done in 10 minutes.

the bones in the firepit i feel are the only really solid evidence they had against avery. all the other evidence (key and blood in rav4 coulda easily been put there to frame). i think hes innocent based solely on the fact they found no blood or dna of theresa in his trailor or a garage esp. if her throat was sliced on his bed and shot in the garage. even someone trained with how to clean up would have a difficult time cleaning up with how messy everything was

All this car crusher talk is hilarious.

Assuming SA is guilty, he would have had ~5 days to get rid of the car.

Yes, scrap yards typically remove the engine first. Using that car crusher is likely a daily/weekly thing.

There's a scrap yard right next to my work, they don't have a crusher and I watch him flatted cars all the time. He picks it up with his claw, drops it from ~15-20 feet repeatedly until the engine falls out, then grabs a big piece of metal, and drops it onto the car again and again.

His whole process takes maybe 15mins.

If you guys don't think SA, a guy who's lived at the scrap yard his whole life couldn't strip and crush a car in like an hour, I don't know what to say.

I love how his video seemingly involves 2 people too, on top of being noisy as hell.

I've realized it's best to just ignore quite a few of the posters in this thread.

Unfortunately he probably used those 5 days to remove all of TH's DNA, blood, flesh and hair from everywhere else on the property while carefully preserving his own DNA and animal blood/DNA. Takes a real long time to separate her DNA from his own when it's deep down in those cracks. Also, removing every single bit of blood spatter from the room, oh wait, I mean garage, and everything in the garage could have been very time consuming. That's why he left the bones in the pit 20 feet from his door as well. Just not enough time.

Just finished ep 10.

I think that Tadych did it and the police framed the evidence to ensure Avery was convicted. Possible Brendan witnessed something and that Brendans brother had something to do with it aswell

Tadych openly disliked Avery and the placing of the car and bones along with mudering someone who was known to be visiting Avery probably too sophisticated for the Dassey Brothers

Kratz*? Effectively said to the jury something along the lines of 'Even if the key was planted does it really matter when Avery is the killer'? Lol

Griesbach is a weirdo. Very few people claim Avery is a hero. His standing on Avery's exoneration is irrelevant. He is a (former) Wisconsin Prosecutor who keeps saying shady stuff.

I think quoting him and referring to Reddit all the time (lol Reddit) is funny as one's primary sources of information.

Also someone in this thread still doesn't know what reasonable doubt is.

If I can find a place that rents car crushers I will very happily prop bet, for the right amount, that I can crush a car by myself in 30 min. Forklift is obviously easy to rent.

Hey mark, I guess you're referring to me.

First of all, I'm pretty sure Griesbach is still a Manitowoc ADA. He was even in the news just a few days ago! http://fox6now.com/2016/01/05/manito...threats-daily/

Can you provide any info otherwise?

You call him a "weirdo" too, but it already seems you know very little about the man. I guess you attack his character because you don't like what he's said about Avery. I understand.

Regarding "primary sources", I'm not writing a dissertation here. I often refer to reddit because it's a convenient summary, like referring to wikipedia. The posts I link to often include opinions from people who work in a certain field or provide sources from articles/trial transcripts/etc. It seems at least a few people are interested in them, and that's why I do it.

But if you prefer masturbating to the latest theory about how Scott's the murderer, I won't judge you.

Also, for anyone who would like to see Michael Griesbach discussing Avery's 1985 wrongful conviction:

Watched 2 eps thursday, 2 eps friday, and 6 today.

Incredibly frustrating to watch. Unfortunately it is one sided, but definitely leaves the viewer thinking Avery/Dassey are innocent.

The Dassey ruling is mind boggling.

Lenk, Colburn, Willis, Kachinsky are all terrible. I really have no idea how Willis makes the orders he does.

This should be available on her Cingular phone records.

He said he doesn't think he did. It's entirely possible he did delete them, unknowingly and just doesn't remember.

If I had to suggest an alternate killer it would be Tadych.

I was also tilted at Kratz' closing when he said to the jury that if you believe the sheriffs planted evidence then you ALSO have to believe the sheriffs killed TH...this is not required!

So I ask you poorskills would you have convicted SA on the evidence provided in the Doc.

1. The Car Key. Obv it is a spare/valet key with no DNA except for SA, since it was found in SA place and it had fallen from the back of a set of drawers.(give how unclean the place was I.E DNA everywhere)found on the 7th search & MC PD needed another search warrent issued.
2. The bullet in the garage with only SA DNA on it, considering it was as unclean as the outside yard & also full of SA DNA, so if planted or thrown in it would collect some DNA.
(found after 5/6 search & also needed a new search warrant & the crime lab messed the test up by getting her own DNA mixed in with the solution while showing new employees to correct procedures) & every Lab in the counrty would have disallowed the results & a note on it to produce a result that would put the bullet in SA garage.)
3. The bones that were found in 3 different places & not excavated correctly(MC Crime lab said in court) & given the testimony of the expert that in no way can you say that the body was burned here with any credibility.

4. The blood in TH car, that could have easily been SA since he did have a cut finger when TH arrived.(She could have asked him to reach in the car to do/get something).

5. Items that were TH personal property(camera ect) found in burn barrel.

I'm leaving out the hood latch as this evidence was not used in this case.
And since the jeans were also never produced I'll leave them out to but white spots on jeans does not mean bleach it could have been brake fluid from playing/ walking around a scrap cars.

So All key evidence is either suspect(found after multiple searches) or was wrongly collected/tested by Crime Lab.(bones, bullet), Or both.

After all this poorskills can you still say that you would convict SA without any reasonable doubt?

if this was the case i think we would have heard steve mention it. "ya she came by and was taking photos and asked me to grab the auto trader magazine from her car so i did"

SA never took the stand. Maybe he did want to say it but his lawyers said NO its speculation/trying to cover.

I believe he told the news the first night she was reported missing that she opened the door and he took an auto trader magazine from her before she left but that wouldn't get blood over by the ignition anyway.

PoorSkillz seems more biased than anyone in this thread IMO. Looks like he/she hadn't posted on 2p2 in over 2 years before popping up ITT, reminds me of 239 in the Knox thread a while back.

My apologies to those who don't like reddit posts, but here's a must read:

Summary of Bryan Dassey Interview 02-27-2006 (exhibit 89)

https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurd...06_exhibit_89/

A couple choice passages:

This makes no sense. Something about being angry about business and having a bad temper --> transition to "He could kill someone and get away with it." ???

The second statement is totally non-sequitur. Is Bryan saying what he heard Charles say? The actual document you provided states that they were up north with Steven building the cabin (but he wasnt feeling good and had a headache and decided to lie down) when Charles overheard on a scanner that Marinette County was coming and then Steven gets in the truck and goes up north again.

Non of this makes sense.

Luckily, there's a law that police interviews need to be recorded now. That way we can make sense of who said what and hopefully figure out what they are trying to say.

Nah, I think I'm might be more biased in the opposite direction. Maybe "biased" isnt the right word, but definitely convinced.

It was a good documentary that was very thought provoking. Probably a good reason to look for forums to discuss, even after 2 years.

Sorry smacc25 but all of your points have already been addressed pretty thoroghly with good counter theories or ideas by PoorSkillz. It's a long thread, but its all there.

I think PoorSkillz is just convinced that SA is guilty, not that it was correct that he was found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

Also, SA DNA not found on the bullet.

Hood latch was used in this case, just not shown in the documentary as Mr. Kratz has pointed out whenever he gets a chance. A few others including myself have stated why this bit of evidence is so ridiculous that it should possibly be used for the defense. Just read the thread.

I've been reading Mr. Griesbach's book and it's a doozy:

Facepalm.