Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Making a Murderer Making a Murderer

02-14-2016 , 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bank Making a Murderer
Lol, you still haven't answered me from days ago.
What's the question?

Others have chimed in that the majority of people in USA believe he's innocent so I accepted that.
02-14-2016 , 07:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalerobk2 Making a Murderer
I didn't think the first rape conviction was so much corruption as much as thorough incompetence.

As for motive, I'm not sure why people are so hung up on it. Plenty of sociopaths rape and murder people with seemingly no motive.

Also, there was a trial that lasted something like two months. There was a huge amount of evidence presented which we don't know about. Taking everything this film says without hearing the other side and being convinced this verdict is wrong seems a little silly to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostinthesaus Making a Murderer
Such as?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalerobk2 Making a Murderer
I have no idea. Do we have access to the trial records? It must be thousands of pages worth of reading, I'd guess.
hot damn this thread is a good read
02-14-2016 , 07:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoorSkillz Making a Murderer
All I see is a shining example of the effects an emotionally manipulative and deceptive documentary can have on people.


"It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled."
02-14-2016 , 09:14 PM
The law isn't about guilty or innocent. It's about who can manipulate 12 jurors the best. Bottom line...don't get arrested, ever.
02-14-2016 , 10:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smacc25 Making a Murderer
This one is really funny.

02-14-2016 , 10:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostinthesaus Making a Murderer

As I've stated before, I don't blame the SA = guilty camp for their great stretches of imagination to reach the "he must be guilty" verdict.
Lol, this is amazing.

Quote:
The alternative is a massive injustice executed with the highest evil purposes possible.
There is one other alternative. It's so obvious, perhaps you overlooked it in your quest to uncover a conspiracy.
02-14-2016 , 10:10 PM
02-14-2016 , 10:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by revots33 Making a Murderer
Lol, this is amazing.



There is one other alternative. It's so obvious, perhaps you overlooked it in your quest to uncover a conspiracy.
Its just a pity they didn't have an eyewitness too & some hair to match up then it would have been a solid case.... Ohh Thats right they did & SA WAS NOT GUILTY.

What do you think about this article revots33?

http://www.wtmj.com/news/open-record...pensation-bill
02-14-2016 , 10:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostinthesaus Making a Murderer
...sums up my sentiment towards the "SA = guilty" advocates applying false logic, irrelevant and fabricated circumstantial evidence...

...
Aside from wrestlingtationgate, including all the "evidence", I think I picked my best-in-show for most ridiculous. It was originally my dark horse longshot candidate but it became the champ due to its elegant simplicity. That is:

The car was found on SA's property.

Let's just preempt any possible planting of the car by LEOs/exBFs and preempt The Hand Of God leading the virtuous to its discovery, preempt the notion that SA would have simply crushed the car with the carcrusher, and simply define "SA's property".

The man lived on 40 acres of land. 40 acres of which the vast majority was a salvage yard for cars. 40 ****ING ACRES which was not fenced in or protected by dogs or bees or dogs that shoot bees out of their mouths, that had multiple entry roads and paths spread about (and if we consider the lack of fences and protection, an infinite amount of entry points) in which the car was found not buried (figuratively or literally) in the middle of this car graveyard/hospital but right near the edge, in a part (if my memory serves me correctly) that not only offered the easiest access but was furthest from the living domiciles and protected from lines of sight by a ridge.

Look, I like to play fast and loose with semantics, to run wild linguistically, so I know my kind when I see it, and to even define this as "the car was found on SA's property" is firing from the hip with both sixshooters. To be theoretically pedantic, OF COURSE IT WAS found on his property, but to be practically specific this description is meaningless. I imagine the prosecution just hoped this wasn't noticed. The defense certainly did.

And that is basically how these reality tunnels and reality bubbles work. The simple statement "the car was found on SA's property" is repeated and repeated and most don't stop to analyze it further; they just crudely extrapolate what it would mean for something to be found on their property.

I have a biggish backyard and could actually probably hide a car there, but it's still fenced in with only one entry point. Most don't have 40 acres of unfenced land. What if you live in an apartment? Sure, if a ****ing SUV was found just sitting in your dining room that would be pretty damning. What appears to be empirical evidence at face value turns out to be just a flimsy appeal to emotion. It's actually pretty clever and insidious.

Apologies if all this has already been mentioned, I'm still in the process of reading the thread through.
02-14-2016 , 10:41 PM
^^^ The point had been raised, but not as forcefully or as well as you have.

Indeed: If Steve Avery was "hiding" the car on his property, it appears the only one he was hiding it from in that spot was himself.
02-14-2016 , 10:44 PM
Gotta get that overtime...
02-14-2016 , 10:52 PM
5ive... here's a short drone view of the avery yard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RlGLTkSpVg

If someone could embed this video for me that would be great. Or direct me to where I can learn.

It was estimated to be that there are 8 different ways to drive onto the Avery property by dirt track's.

Last edited by smacc25; 02-14-2016 at 11:01 PM.
02-14-2016 , 11:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by revots33 Making a Murderer
Lol, this is amazing.



There is one other alternative. It's so obvious, perhaps you overlooked it in your quest to uncover a conspiracy.

I was just about to make a kinder, gentler reply to a different post of yours until you just went and REVVOOOTSed all over this page.

In my post right above I pointed out these foolish linguistic games that lead to these reality tunnels. I also made this post below, which I know you saw as it was the anchor of my quad posting the other night, the first of which you replied to:

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ive Making a Murderer
Real talk though, Wisconsin still ain't got nothing on my neck of the woods.

http://cookcountyrecord.com/stories/...-double-murder


Real talk take 2, you people who think these situations require some illuminatiesque grand conspiracy kinda half disgust me and half fill me with envy and wonderment at the innocent naivete, bright eyed and full of hope.
(bold added just now)

Basically, stop saying "uncover a conspiracy" and mainly "conspiracy" altogether. Everybody here, including yourself, is way too smart for these kiddie games. We're not small town wisconsin jurors.

I'd prefer if language kept its theoretical and technical purity but we live and use it in a practical world, and practical definitions get co-opted and shifted. Yes, police framing/evidence planting clearly qualifies as a conspiracy, but a great many things do as the natural definition of conspiracy is very broad. However, in 2016, on the internet, conspiracy is largely used to denote tinfoil-hat nuttiness (9/11, newton school shooting, etc, etc) X-file-Illuminati-style fiction, and the broad definition has been abandoned.

This is the reason you and others choose that word, for it's modern, practical weight of dismissiveness, and not any synonyms like "plot" or "series of devious skullduggeries and machinations". Everybody here knows this.
02-14-2016 , 11:07 PM
Woah
02-14-2016 , 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smacc25 Making a Murderer
5ive... here's a short drone view of the avery yard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RlGLTkSpVg

If someone could embed this video for me that would be great. Or direct me to where I can learn.

It was estimated to be that there are 8 different ways to drive onto the Avery property by dirt track's.
That's pretty neat...

The memory I was referencing was the aerial view used during Divine Intervention Lady's testimony.


(also, I don't know about embedding videos but I think only moderators can do it... at least I was a moderator years ago and could, and now I can't... but maybe I just dont know how to do it)
02-14-2016 , 11:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smacc25 Making a Murderer
Gotta get that overtime...
Nah, their story is that they didn't actually work the case like they weren't supposed to, they just falsified paperwork to steal from the county coffers. Although when Colburn and Lenk are on the stand defending this egregiously high amount of take-home-pay, it's gonna be pretty embarrassing when one of them slips up and says, "Planting evidence and framing people takes A LOT OF HOURS!"
02-14-2016 , 11:29 PM
Are you talking about a TV show, or practicing your creative writing? It's nearly impossible to tell.

Anyway the victim's car was found on his property. You can spend paragraphs of tl;dr and lots of ridiculously overdone prose describing the size of his lot, or the various access roads, and it doesn't change that fact one iota.
02-14-2016 , 11:37 PM
Lol revots
02-14-2016 , 11:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ive Making a Murderer

This is the reason you and others choose that word, for it's modern, practical weight of dismissiveness, and not any synonyms like "plot" or "series of devious skullduggeries and machinations". Everybody here knows this.
Because its not a plot when multiple individuals are allegedly conspiring.
02-14-2016 , 11:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by revots33 Making a Murderer
Are you talking about a TV show, or practicing your creative writing? It's nearly impossible to tell.
...

Creative writing, while not limited to fiction, usually strongly implies fiction.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ive Making a Murderer
...

...these foolish linguistic games...

...
UR DOIN IT AGAIN


Quote:

Anyway the victim's car was found on his property. You can spend paragraphs of tl;dr and lots of ridiculously overdone prose describing the size of his lot, or the various access roads, and it doesn't change that fact one iota.
Well, considering you don't get the point, apparently it's actually too short and not overdone enough. <--- Bonus points: Is this previous sentence logically airtight or fallacious?
02-14-2016 , 11:47 PM
5ive,

You can spend time saying "this could have happened this way" or "this doesn't mean he is guilty" all you want. The problem is not one piece of evidence, it is a collection of multiple things that point to SA. When you add all of those together, it is extremely unlikely he isn't guilty. So ya, its possible that someone put the car on his property.. Until you start looking at everything else.

Lets recap..

TH was with him sometime around 330.. No more phone calls were made from her phone around that time, she only received incoming calls. So we can easily deduce from that alone that something happened to her around that time.

Her car was found on his property, 40 acres is very large so someone could have planted the car there sure.. But remember we are looking at a collection of things here to draw a conclusion so at this point the person would have had to kill her shortly after she saw SA. Because that is her last phone call.

Inside her car is SA's blood and her blood. Now this has to be planted in order for him to be innocent. The patterns of blood would have also had to have been planted in such a way to either fool the blood splatter expert who testified for the state or the blood splatter expert is in on the conspiracy.

In a burn pit her bones were found. There are 5 people who say SA was using a burn pit that night. BD, Barb, Scott, bobby and the other dassey brother (name escapes me at the moment) so someone would have had to plant her bones after killing her in his burn pit. Or the police found her bones then moved them to his location to plant them.

Her cell phone and pda were located outside his door, within 20 ft of his house. These would have also had to be planted and without him noticing. This is also kind of silly, I mean why would someone plant something like that? The bones would have probably been enough to convict him, planting her stuff too just seems like overkill and an unnecessary step to get caught.

A bullet was found that was fired from a gun he keeps above his bed with her DNA on it. This means someone would have had to fire his gun or get a bullet that was fired from his gun grab TH DNA (not sure if this is even feasible) and plant it in his garage.

These are the biggest pieces of evidence in my opinion. A quick look over these and I don't see how you think your position is more logical than mine.
02-14-2016 , 11:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJacob Making a Murderer
Because its not a plot when multiple individuals are allegedly conspiring.
'Plot' and 'conspiracy' are hard synonyms, arguably pure synonyms depending on whom you ask, but I'm pretty sure you don't want to argue the minutiae of etymology and linguistics on your Sunday evening.
02-14-2016 , 11:51 PM
The Chicago Way..

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...212-story.html
Like you were saying earlier 5ive, sadly when ppl go down this rabbit hole some never come back.
02-14-2016 , 11:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ive Making a Murderer
'Plot' and 'conspiracy' are hard synonyms, arguably pure synonyms depending on whom you ask, but I'm pretty sure you don't want to argue the minutiae of etymology and linguistics on your Sunday evening.
p.s. The definition of 'plot' used in this context, I should add, lest your brain turn sideways and shoot out of your ear.

      
m