To put it short:

1. We agree to 2k flip on 10/20 PLO 5 card table, he has a stack of 5,5k, I cover
2. He makes it 2,7k pre and shoves the flop

The incident happened about a week ago. He was clearly playing badly, possibly while being intoxicated. He proposed a flip, and I agreed to it. At least he didn't have a premium holding but still, I got angled pretty hard. I don't have all the possible screenshots etc, but at least LuckyEVEver, NeverFoldYou and NinoPino saw the incident. I saw him at the tables once a few days back, but he had no intention of giving any money back. All I got was a bunch of arrogance, and that was that.

I am 100% aware of the risks involved when agreeing to a flip against anyone who is not a friend of mine, but the tiny (in the long run at least.....) amount of EV lost vs keeping a donk happy is worth the risk in my opinion, so don't judge me on taking the flip. Additionally, at least he was a decently well known player. + it's 5 card omaha so even smaller amount of EV lost against a cheater.



The HH conversion did not work, so I will post it as a text

PokerStars Hand #187870599433: 5 Card Omaha Pot Limit ($10/$20 USD) - 2018/06/21 15:06:35 EET [2018/06/21 8:06:35 ET]
Table 'Tristan II' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 3: Aku1206 ($17640.54 in chips)
Seat 5: MITS 304 ($5638.54 in chips)
MITS 304: posts small blind $10
Aku1206: posts big blind $20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Aku1206 [7d 4d Qs 5h 8d]
MITS 304: raises $40 to $60
Aku1206: raises $120 to $180
MITS 304: raises $360 to $540
Aku1206: raises $360 to $900
MITS 304: raises $1800 to $2700
Aku1206 said, "wtf"
Aku1206 said, "this was supposed to be 2k"
MITS 304 said, "2700"
MITS 304 said, "ok"
Aku1206 said, "hey"
Aku1206 said, "this is not right"
MITS 304 said, "ok"
Aku1206 said, "winner sends 700 usd back"
MITS 304 said, "2700"
Aku1206 said, "ok then. 2700"
Aku1206: calls $1800
*** FLOP *** [7h 4c 9c]
Aku1206: checks
MITS 304: bets $2938.54 and is all-in
Aku1206 said, "wtf"
Aku1206: calls $2938.54
*** TURN *** [7h 4c 9c] [As]
NeverFoldYou joins the table at seat #6
*** RIVER *** [7h 4c 9c As] [3s]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Aku1206: shows [7d 4d Qs 5h 8d] (two pair, Sevens and Fours)
MITS 304: shows [4s Td 3d Kh 9h] (two pair, Nines and Fours)
MITS 304 collected $11275.33 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $11277.08 | Rake $1.75
Board [7h 4c 9c As 3s]
Seat 3: Aku1206 (big blind) showed [7d 4d Qs 5h 8d] and lost with two pair, Sevens and Fours
Seat 5: MITS 304 (button) (small blind) showed [4s Td 3d Kh 9h] and won ($11275.33) with two pair, Nines and Fours


I am aware that this proof itself is not perfect, but I will get the HH from the hand before if someone really needs it. There was a lot of action going on, and I failed to catch the hand. Obviously I did not lose 5,5k of EV, but in my opinion he owes me that for being a disrespectful tool. Also, I don't expect to get anything back, but this is a case that needs to become public.

You didn't show the convo "agreeing" to the flip, and you didn't show your hand, so everything you just said could all be BS.

Even if you are telling the truth, it's not shocking that people have scrupulous morals with 5K on the line.

Seriously though, he has a 5.5K stack, nothing is stopping him from putting it in. Consider this is a life lesson for yourself.

Based on the exchange in dialogue, I'm not sure your opponent knows what a "flip" really is, or he is just playing dumb.

I guess the lesson is to do the flip at a new table with only 2k stack.

People lie all the time in poker. I don’t think he cheated you, it’s safer to say he tricked you. There is a “bet” button, and he’s allowed to click it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

All I got from this thread is that OP was born yesterday.

Wow so many idiots itt, it's actually pretty common in mid-highstake for players to agree to flips. It's def not the norm for people to scam you in them, but it's for sure possible. You only get away with it once though.

OP was aware that this guy could cheat and took a small risk, he wasn't asking for sympathy he was simply warning the community.

Honestly I don't care if it's common - it's just straight up a dumb thing to do online unless you are 100% sure they won't scam you. I don't think there's anywhere enough ev to be gained from keeping them happy because I'm not sure their happiness is all that relevant in them being able to do a flip with you. They're probably going to continue playing the game regardless.

This short-sighted thinking is why you'll never make it to highstakes.

fwiw he's getting scammed for a lot less then you think he is. He still has a lot of equity, esp in 5card plo

This is a common theme in poker... people talking w their egos and then never backing up a single word.

It would be nice if people could keep their word ever. It seems like the whole honor system in today’s society has been lost.

It comes down to the golden rule. Treat others like you would want to be treated. I’ve never stuffed a bet I made and I’ve always kept my word for gambling. It’s important we emphasize to the community that this be the norm.

It actually happens more at low stakes... usually at high stakes people aren’t so short sided and realize their reputation is going to be worth way more than 5k.

I still think it’s probably a bad idea to do flips online when you don’t know someone. So for that op tis tis.

Could have been an honest misunderstanding of the whole blind 2k flip thing.

I always err on the side of caution and never did flips online. I do occassional tilt flips in my live games but that's usually fine cause all the regs know each other pretty well.

good thing he flopped very strong

post in NVG probably. I don't think anyone who plays HSPLO nowadays actually reads this forum or posts here, just here putting off chores myself

This ^ and also, the first few posts are the reason why people don't have the guts to call someone out in the first place.

I do understand the critique of not giving 100% foolproof evidence, I asked Stars about the first HH, haven't gotten a response yet.

It was 100% certain that there was no misunderstanding, the guy is a reg with at least half decent English and knew what he was doing.

Most surprising part of the post was finding out you actually do chores, when not putting them off.

MITS 304 is a pretty arrogant guy in general. Bit shocked to read this though. I won't be flipping with him any time soon. Normally sit out if he wants someone HU out of respect. Seems a bit out of character that he's done this. I do think he plays drunk or stupidly sometimes but can't confirm.

Pure scum. Shaun deeb did this to me back in the day and I’ll never forget it. Supposed to be a 5k flip, he ends up shoving his 10k stack in after a few raises. The irony is I won the hand. Insta karma one might say

this is poor by mits, he does kmow for sure what 2 k flips is.

Sorry to hear that aku, sucks pretty hard.

Anyone that has played vs him would obviously know it wasn't a mistake on MIT's part, he knew what he was doing. Even before this, it was clear that he was scum and I'd be more careful flipping with randoms in future.