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Old 04-24-2017, 05:51 PM   #26
Controlling
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

i think everybody who has played over the last few years PLO can confirm that traffic is decreasing and not increasing. I can`t see any reason why PLO should boom. Most of the poker newbies lose their money on Holdem and most of the new players recognize very fast that it isn`t easy to make money at poker. And the players who think about transitioning to PLO recognize very fast that it is a lot of work to learn PLO. Nowadays the people also know that they have a clear disadvantage playing Poker, espacially PLO, against regs. For the tards it makes much more sense to play bingo, roulette or any online casino game because the payoutrate is much higher.
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Old 04-26-2017, 02:55 PM   #27
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

PLO is a more interesting game than hold em once you start to grasp the principles a bit. I think the young super nitty players killed hold em online and then they slowly moved into the casinos after Black Friday and mostly killed hold em there too. In 2007 when I left Vegas for work, good hold em games were running nightly at Bellagio but the last 10 years when I've been back the games are rarely good and aren't much fun from a social perspective either.

PLO has more swings and far fewer opportunities to get someone in an 80/20 spot which lends itself to larger pots, more incentive to draw, more multiway pots and generally a more fun atmosphere for recreational players. I'll be at the Aria playing PLO when I get free time.
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Old 05-01-2017, 02:24 PM   #28
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

JNandez has some good content/insights but I think he's out to lunch here and mainly just shilling for upswing poker.
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Old 05-01-2017, 04:15 PM   #29
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

I wish there was some type of prop bet I could make related to this
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Old 05-01-2017, 04:29 PM   #30
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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I wish there was some type of prop bet I could make related to this
What would you be betting on?
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Old 05-15-2017, 05:52 AM   #31
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

I created a thread of the youtube videos of JNandez in NVG, and short after i received a PM from the moderation that is not allowed because is kind of spam, and then they erased it.

Anyway, just like to say that i really like the new video format of moving up in stakes with "x" buyins.

This kind of quality material for sure will help the PLO boom that is was talking about.
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Old 05-19-2017, 09:17 AM   #32
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

I love JNandez' content. But there will never be a PLO boom like there was with NLHE. The reason NLHE caught on was because the game was "simple" - just 2 cards and 5 community. Even celebrities and supermodels could learn to play and have fun. I think if any game has a chance, it's 5 card draw, cuz they play it in those old Western movies!
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Old 05-19-2017, 10:16 AM   #33
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

NLH has made it like 15 years online, and the last 10+ years it has been the most popular form. PLO grew in popularity, but that trend has ended. Both are equally good/bad options.

I have only one argument in favour of plo and that is the folding nature of nlh and its more gto technical gaming. That is why I favour plo. I am well aware of the plo nits and the gto type of plo gaming also, but nlh is not the kind of poker I like to play compared to plo. Though I play both as well, but plo is all I will be playing in the future -- that leads to the joke that says that plo is still the game of the future.
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Old 05-19-2017, 12:27 PM   #34
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

Sorry to all you dreamers, but PLO is dying at a faster rate that it ever has before, no one is talking about a future "PLO boom" unless they are trying to sell you a product whose value is contingent upon being able to play PLO for reasonable stakes in the foreseeable future. A PLO "boom" would only happen if there was a large poker boom across the board which would only really happen if there was a large influx of players from China, India, and Indonesia and/or the reintroduction of USA residents being allowed to play with ROW players.

WCG saw little value in continuing to be a HUNL specialist in the current state of games so released a HUNL training course to maximize the value of his HUNL knowledge.
Jnandez ___________ so released a PLO training course to maximize the value of his PLO knowledge.

Btw huge difference between where each of them were in the power rankings for their selected game types.
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Old 05-19-2017, 01:01 PM   #35
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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Sorry to all you dreamers, but PLO is dying at a faster rate that it ever has before, no one is talking about a future "PLO boom" unless they are trying to sell you a product whose value is contingent upon being able to play PLO for reasonable stakes in the foreseeable future. A PLO "boom" would only happen if there was a large poker boom across the board which would only really happen if there was a large influx of players from China, India, and Indonesia and/or the reintroduction of USA residents being allowed to play with ROW players.

WCG saw little value in continuing to be a HUNL specialist in the current state of games so released a HUNL training course to maximize the value of his HUNL knowledge.
Jnandez ___________ so released a PLO training course to maximize the value of his PLO knowledge.

Btw huge difference between where each of them were in the power rankings for their selected game types.
I'm sure JNandez is a winning player but I can't seem to find any stats on him that shows he's at the level of a Doug and in fact when watching his videos he just folds everything that's not super super super nutted.

I haven't payed online in a long time and frankly prefer live since its much softer but are these things the way to play PLO in 2017 or just a super super super nitty way of playing PLO?

OPR has Nandez winning about 35k from PLO MTTs and ~850k in NLHE. Don't get me wrong, that's still a great amount of money won but it doesn't sound like he's won a lot in PLO, or at least how much their advertising claims he has won.

I fully agree with your assessment though. The games are somewhat dead so it makes sense to just make as much money of a training site as possible before that dies as well.

On a side note, you're KingOfThe$ea right? If you are, when you shoved over Nandez bet in the PLO Scoop (think it was 2k?) with AAxx on the turn when he had trip jacks and got there on the river with the nut flush was awesome btw.
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Old 05-19-2017, 06:38 PM   #36
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

Live PLO is growing and arguably even booming across America and in Europe. A few reasons it's doing so well:

- NLH games drying up, becoming nitfests
- NLH regs often unwilling to engage new players
- PLO tables much more jovial atmosphere, more conversations, less sunglasses/hoodie types, less berating of weak players
- More all-ins so even when not involved in pots, people stay engaged/interested
- Four cards are more fun than two
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Old 05-20-2017, 10:39 PM   #37
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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Originally Posted by SeaKing View Post
Sorry to all you dreamers, but PLO is dying at a faster rate that it ever has before, no one is talking about a future "PLO boom" unless they are trying to sell you a product whose value is contingent upon being able to play PLO for reasonable stakes in the foreseeable future. A PLO "boom" would only happen if there was a large poker boom across the board which would only really happen if there was a large influx of players from China, India, and Indonesia and/or the reintroduction of USA residents being allowed to play with ROW players.

WCG saw little value in continuing to be a HUNL specialist in the current state of games so released a HUNL training course to maximize the value of his HUNL knowledge.
Jnandez ___________ so released a PLO training course to maximize the value of his PLO knowledge.

Btw huge difference between where each of them were in the power rankings for their selected game types.
online maybe so but live plo is getting stronger and stronger.
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Old 05-20-2017, 10:40 PM   #38
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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Originally Posted by rumnchess View Post
Live PLO is growing and arguably even booming across America and in Europe. A few reasons it's doing so well:

- NLH games drying up, becoming nitfests
- NLH regs often unwilling to engage new players
- PLO tables much more jovial atmosphere, more conversations, less sunglasses/hoodie types, less berating of weak players
- More all-ins so even when not involved in pots, people stay engaged/interested
- Four cards are more fun than two
the bolded is dead on.
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Old 05-21-2017, 02:43 AM   #39
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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- PLO tables much more jovial atmosphere, more conversations, less sunglasses/hoodie types, less berating of weak players

Unless you're seated with someone with an auto-douche disorder.
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Old 05-25-2017, 02:47 AM   #40
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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Originally Posted by rumnchess View Post
Live PLO is growing and arguably even booming across America and in Europe. A few reasons it's doing so well:

- NLH games drying up, becoming nitfests
- NLH regs often unwilling to engage new players
- PLO tables much more jovial atmosphere, more conversations, less sunglasses/hoodie types, less berating of weak players
- More all-ins so even when not involved in pots, people stay engaged/interested
- Four cards are more fun than two
Confirmed live PLO is the nuts.

+ w/r/t jnandez, pretty sure his entire shtick is teaching you how to beat the loose players that you'd see in the Cardroom on a daily basis. Obviously against better players, you'll have to make cringe calls and light value jams and bluffs more often, or else you're cake to play against, but it's just not necessary to call the river with that 8 hi flush you backed into live.
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Old 05-25-2017, 02:09 PM   #41
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

PLO is getting much more popular over here in Europe. Not sure Id call this a boom but its nice.
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Old 06-10-2017, 10:03 AM   #42
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

PLO will never be as big as NLH because of the variance, and # hands/round.
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Old 06-15-2017, 10:52 PM   #43
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

It doesnt have to become as big as NLH. It never will but it is gaining ground which is great.
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Old 06-17-2017, 03:10 PM   #44
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

home games I play in go round by round, holdem/omey. by the end of the night we're always playing NLomey
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Old 06-18-2017, 12:21 AM   #45
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

10 handed PLO/PLO8 at home games is why seals get clubbed.
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Old 06-18-2017, 07:46 AM   #46
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

I don't think PLO will ever be as big as NLHE, but it is growing a lot lately, especially in live poker. When it comes to high stakes action, my observations have been that a lot of PLO games are still running, where it becomes harder to find any games at all at NL.

High Stakes PLO action can be really soft (not on Pokerstars) and 10bb/100 it clearly attainable at 6-max. If you mix in shorter formats like HU, 3 and 4 handed, win rates can be huge.

I'm continuously play PLO for a living and love it more than ever. I have no intention leaving the Poker Space or making coaching my main source of income. The reason I teach PLO and created products around it, is because I love it, and I always believed in my abilities as a coach. I helped real and genuine people to enjoy poker more than ever and build strong friendships trough my coaching. I don't regret any of it.

I'm not familiar with 2+2 and the community here, will give it a shot though. If you have any questions... I'll keep an eye on this tread. GG, Fernando
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Old 06-18-2017, 02:06 PM   #47
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

I moved mostly to nlh tourneys, as my regular plo site is too dead, and I think my way to live (plo) cash in Europe is unsure.

Live tourneys are a bonus, meaning bigger money for the same level of competition, with a higher juice, and slower games, and a holiday on the side perhaps, and maybe some better nlh live cash games on the side.

If plo would have the same popularity than nlh, and a lower rake, and speed perhaps, it would be the best pick, but that is not the case. It is my favourite of the popular games, but I play for the money; the fun being secondary.
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Old 06-19-2017, 03:39 PM   #48
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

This is just another, "POKER IS DIEING/DEAD" thread. And so, PLO will die with NL. Because it needs NL players to transition into PLO. Never do you attract players originally into PLO, they only transition from NL. Just my two cents
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Old 06-19-2017, 04:52 PM   #49
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

If anybody wants to be playing poker in 5 years time then playing PLO is a must. There is plenty of action in the live PLO cash games during WSOP compared to NL Holdem. The game plays like holdem did a few years ago with plenty of limping, mass multiway pots and people coming to gamble. My guess is that the hourly in a 1/2/5 PLO game is the same as the hourly in a 5/10 NL Holdem game. The level of competence required to beat 1/2/5 PLO is much lower than the level of competence to beat 5/10 NL.
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Old 06-20-2017, 02:08 AM   #50
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Re: PLO boom still to come according to JNandez

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If anybody wants to be playing poker in 5 years time then playing PLO is a must. There is plenty of action in the live PLO cash games during WSOP compared to NL Holdem. The game plays like holdem did a few years ago with plenty of limping, mass multiway pots and people coming to gamble. My guess is that the hourly in a 1/2/5 PLO game is the same as the hourly in a 5/10 NL Holdem game. The level of competence required to beat 1/2/5 PLO is much lower than the level of competence to beat 5/10 NL.
Ehh.. I'm pretty familiar with both these games (and the win rates of better nl players than me for the NL) portion and think 5/10 should still have a higher win rate under normal circumstances. Even in a pretty juicy 1/2/5 more than $75 hour is a bit optimistic. The better players should be$50+/hr in even the tougher nl lineups, and when the game is playing big there will just be much more cash on the table and potential winnings.

I will at least acknowledge that some of the 1/2/5 mississipi straddle plo games at rio have been decent but they also have a $500 capped buy in and no hand shufflers, so its not going to be worth it for many players unless they game select agressively.
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