This hand happened at a home game. Game was 5/10 NL and 5/5 PLO with consistent straddles/re-straddles between $20-100. You can straddle from any position. Stacks are anywhere from 1k-8k with the average being around 2k. The usual 25/50 table was not going so a couple of the bigger players were sitting at the table. Table was 6-9 handed throughout the night and I believe there were 8 players at the table for the hand in question.

Hero (SB): On my 2nd $1k bullet. I start the hand with about 3200. I'm 22, and viewed mainly as an aggressive hold'em player. I am fairly new at PLO and most of the table probably knows this. I'm probably seen as somewhat scared money playing this deep in PLO.

Villian (UTG+1): Regular at the 25/50 and plays bigger games(100/200+). Sat down with about $8k and covers everyone. 30 years old and retired from working for a hedge fund company. The guy is very rich and definitely not sweating the money.

Hero is dealt A A 4 7

Villian straddles $20 UTG+1. MP calls. LP calls. BU calls. Hero raises to $120. Villian calls. MP calls. LP folds. BU calls.

Flop: (~$500)
5 8 3

Hero bets $280. Villian quickly pots to ~$1300. Folds back to Hero.

What should I do?

Did you consider flatting the first time? I think it's worth while. It's unlike you will get reraised so all you are doing is building a big pot out of position. This is actually one of the better flops for you.

I'd just fold. We've got zero outs to the nuts, we got raised with three players left to act behind us, and even if he does have a combo draw, we're not getting it in very good. There's just no way shoving is good against his range, and while calling for non-diamonds is semi-reasonable if you really wanna gamble for some reason, it's not likely to turn a profit overall.

+1 iggymcfly Even though this isn't a bad flop for you, it isn't a good one either. I would fold. Next time, I would check out of position, then determine on the turn how big you want the pot to be. To beat the guy who has no value for money is to make him play your game, not play his. He just wants to get it all in and see what happens. He can easily afford to rebuy, but you cannot. Use your skill and patience and slowly but surely, you'll be stacking all his rebuys next to the other ones you just took!

I ended up jamming on him after spending about 2 minutes in the tank. He snap folded...

I was almost certain that he was getting out of line here and making a move. Hes not sweating the money, but he is still a thinking player and a winner in the big games. My thinking was that he knew I had aces and knew he would be putting me in a tough spot by potting the flop. I was pretty close to folding but I still have decent equity against 2-pairs and sets. Can't ever be drawing that thin here unless he has like 6 7 8 8, 4 5 7 8, 3 4 7 8 or something.

Just a few examples of how your equity looks against different hands:

board: 5d 8d 3c
Hand Equity Wins Ties
Jh 8c 8s Th 63.29% 519 0
Ac As 4c 7h 36.71% 301 0

board: 5d 8d 3c
Hand Equity Wins Ties
Kd 9d 8h 7s 64.63% 530 0
Ac As 4c 7h 35.37% 290 0

board: 5d 8d 3c
Hand Equity Wins Ties
4d 9d 6c 7c 72.20% 592 0
Ac As 4c 7h 27.80% 228 0

board: 5d 8d 3c
Hand Equity Wins Ties
5c 9d 8s 7d 78.17% 641 0
Ac As 4c 7h 21.83% 179 0

I mean, obviously if he has something that he can raise/fold in his range, you're in decent shape, but that's an absolutely terrible play by him when there are still multiple people behind that can pick him off if they flopped good, and the board's super coordinated. Even for a recreational player, I certainly wouldn't expect to see him raise/folding ever here with 4 players still in the hand. Would be completely different if he was last to act.

My error. I thought you started the hand with 1k, not 3200. For some reason I zoned that out. I was thinking he was putting you all in. As it played out, I believe you just bought it. I could see him thinking you had some sort of AA w/ Ax diamond draw or combo draw. He's the loose player, and your the tight player, so I am sure this worked out to your favor. I personally think he threw away med flush draw and nothing to go with it because that makes sense to me.

well then, why you asking dawg?

I am new to PLO and was just wondering how sketchy it is to be shoving there. My friend who was playing in the game said he would've folded.

this is a ridiculously easy fold and don't 3bet pre, and don't bet flop

You gotta realize I'm playing at a home game with drunk rich people. Straddler is very likely to 3-bet/get it in with a mediocre hand. If I just call and he pots it, its a lot harder for me to get my stack in pre. However, I do understand that raising pre-flop puts me in a tough spot if I don't get reraised. I'm still learning so my theories could be way off...

Pretty good reason to wait for the nuts...

well anytime u can define ur hand with 6 spr vs 3 ppl oop u gotta do it

This is silly. You're trying to say that we need to limp in with aces to avoid "defining our hand" when a 3-bet will set us up perfectly to get stacks in? Craziness IMO. There's no reason this has to define anything if we're playing even reasonably aggressive poker.

if the op had 3bet from the blinds with pretty crappy aces, i would agree, but in this hand he's making the first raise, which still commands a wide range.

in general though, playing big(ger) pots OOP is a recipe for disaster in plo.

Exactly. You're not trying to get jiggy at the 2+2 WSOP party. IMHO, the only reason not to sit back and wait for the nuts is the meta-game concern that if you're not seen offering action you won't be invited back.

Modulo that, drunk rich people will give you their money when you have the nuts; why splash around?

Regards, Lee

Just cause you can sit around and wait for the nuts playing mercy of the deck poker, doesn't mean it's the most profitable way to play. If straddler will likely 3 bet then raise is fine. But it sounds like the table views you as tight, so will straddler 3bet you with the same consistency as normal?

A lot of these home/underground games allow running it twice. Does this one? If so, I would be more likely to get it in with aces, doublegutter, and BDFD on this flop because people play their draws even more aggresively when they can run it twice.