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Old 03-15-2019, 04:39 PM   #1
SocraticGambler
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5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Frst-time poster, long-time lurker

Looking forward to getting some input from the many skilled players around here (and catching some flak as well lol).

Had a hand where I played super-loose pre (Fold PRE, I know, I know) and got into an interesting spot, wanted thoughts on the post-flop spot.

Playing in a 5/5 PLO/BigO Mix game that frequently has a straddle so is playing as a 5/5/10 mostly. Game is pretty passive pre-flop, most raises pre are absolute monsters (AAxx or AKJ10 in PLO, A23xx or AAxxx whatever in BigO), but I've seen some people over-value hands like AAKK7 during BigO already. There are a few gamblers there for sure, especially the guy to my right who I've seen over-value marginal hands and call very loose pre even when OOP.

Bought in for $1K total, stack is around $850 at the moment (was down to $600 running like ass but caught a few nice hands right before this and won a few pots to get some momentum going after being card-dead for an hour, which is probably why I chose to call Pre).

******

Table is pretty friendly (lot of regulars that know each other), guy to my left convinces me to straddle because most of the table is doing it and I'm a sucker that is easy to convince apparently.

Hero is in the straddle and is dealt 24569

Folds to the Button who opens for $40, SB calls, BB Calls, and I call (typically I would fold this pre since it's marginal, but for some reason I just felt like getting saucy in a multi-way pot as the last caller...right after I called I even told myself "that was too loose, you need to tighten up." But the **** happened, so now I've got to play the hand!).

They all cover me (Button has $2500, SB $1500, BB $1000+).

Flop is A36

SB checks, BB (guy to my right who likes to gamble) leads for $125, I flat with the nut-low + the wrap (though not the best one, could've used the 7 instead of the 6 there, but at least I have a blocker on a full-house if CO does have AA).

CO thinks for a few seconds and bets $600, SB folds, BB thinks for 10 seconds then goes all-in for $1K+

At this point there is $2K in the pot (that I could win) and I've put in $165 which is like 20% of my stack. Now I have to put in the last $685 to go All-In (getting 3:1 to stack off).

Read on Button is he definitely has AA, but I have no clue what BB could be doing this with (could be something like 444566, could be A66XX, could be the other 24 though that seems like a bold move to lead out from the SB with the nut-low when you know the CO is going to CB with AA on that board).

Is this an automatic ship as played on this flop?

***To reiterate - I know the ultimate answer to this situation is Fold Pre to avoid these spots where you have low equity and need to outdraw multiple opponents OOP***
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:32 PM   #2
Vanhaomena
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

My thought before running the sim: wtf get it in you have 50% 3ways

My thought after running the sim:

board: Ad3c6s

2s4s5c6c9d 50.46%
AA 29.11%
42, 33, 66 20.43%
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Old 03-15-2019, 06:25 PM   #3
SocraticGambler
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanhaomena View Post
My thought before running the sim: wtf get it in you have 50% 3ways

My thought after running the sim:

board: Ad3c6s

2s4s5c6c9d 50.46%
AA 29.11%
42, 33, 66 20.43%
That was my first thought as well, but what if the guy with AA has AA24x or AA45x?

I figured that if he is raising AA he is likely to have either a low-wrap on top of it (i.e. AA234 or AA457) or some kind of disjointed one that scoops the high more often (i.e. AAJ103 or AAKQ2).

Seeing those sim numbers does seem to make it pretty clear though that once I've made the mistake of not folding Pre I have to go with it on that flop.
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Old 03-15-2019, 09:12 PM   #4
PokerPlayingGamble
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

go all in
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Old 03-16-2019, 02:13 AM   #5
smoothcriminal99
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Do people really even think about folding here... I don’t think you can pick 2 exact hands for them where you don’t have 25% equity
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Old 03-16-2019, 08:17 AM   #6
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothcriminal99 View Post
Do people really even think about folding here... I donít think you can pick 2 exact hands for them where you donít have 25% equity

challenge accepted

5-Card Omaha Hi/Lo Simulation ?
600,000 trials (Randomized)
board: Ad3c6s
Hand Equity Scoops Wins Hi Ties Hi Wins Lo Ties Lo
2s4s5c6c9d 21.56% 0 36,555 66,568 0 600,000
AA245 52.37% 0 406,225 66,568 0 600,000
24578 26.07% 0 90,652 66,568 0 600,000
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Old 03-16-2019, 08:17 AM   #7
PokerPlayingGamble
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

5-Card Omaha Hi/Lo Simulation ?
80,784 trials (Exhaustive)
board: Ad3c6s
Hand Equity Scoops Wins Hi Ties Hi Wins Lo Ties Lo
2s4s5c6c9d 19.38% 0 1,248 9,392 0 80,784
AsA245s 53.78% 0 56,840 9,392 0 80,784
2457c8c 26.84% 0 13,304 9,392 0 80,784
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Old 03-16-2019, 12:19 PM   #8
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Once you are in pre, this is a call and pray.
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Old 03-16-2019, 02:05 PM   #9
AllInNTheDark
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

This is the flop you needed, how can one even consider not GII, esp. when so short?
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Old 03-16-2019, 04:59 PM   #10
smoothcriminal99
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble View Post
5-Card Omaha Hi/Lo Simulation ?
80,784 trials (Exhaustive)
board: Ad3c6s
Hand Equity Scoops Wins Hi Ties Hi Wins Lo Ties Lo
2s4s5c6c9d 19.38% 0 1,248 9,392 0 80,784
AsA245s 53.78% 0 56,840 9,392 0 80,784
2457c8c 26.84% 0 13,304 9,392 0 80,784
Got me
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Old 03-16-2019, 06:23 PM   #11
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Folding flop would be beyond terrible
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Old 03-16-2019, 07:01 PM   #12
SocraticGambler
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

Ok thanks for the feedback everyone, it seems pretty obvious after seeing the simulations.

Even in the worst case scenario I still have 20% equity and I can't always give them credit for the nut hands (though there was a hand 5 minutes before where 3 guys got it all in for a pot of over $3K on a board of 77532 getting bet the whole way; guy leading from the blind had 775A4 while the other guys had 784A10 and AK234).

Spoiler:

Last edited by SocraticGambler; 03-16-2019 at 07:06 PM.
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Old 03-27-2019, 11:37 PM   #13
that_pope
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

I think you have some suits and cards wrong.
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Old 03-28-2019, 11:06 PM   #14
agnostia
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Re: 5/5/10 PLO/BigO Mix Game - Call Off w/Nut Low 3-way All-In???

This is basically the nut flop for your hand. Pile the money in.
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