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Old 03-08-2016, 06:28 PM   #2201
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

ESPN article on conference:
Future of DFS in Nevada still cloudy

Quote:
LAS VEGAS -- Some of the most powerful decision-makers in the gambling world -- the governor of Nevada, executives from the state's largest sportsbooks, officials from gaming control and the CEOs of the two leading daily fantasy sports operators -- were in the same room for over four hours Monday at Las Vegas City Hall.

While no definitive agreements came out of the gather, one thing was clear: The outdated gambling laws in the United States don't make a lot of sense at this point....
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:05 PM   #2202
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Professionalpoker View Post
ESPN article on conference:
Future of DFS in Nevada still cloudy
The reporter forgot to mention that Joe Tall was in the room also.

Also, failed to report the discussion by Chris Grove, to the effect that the industry spent 3X its gross revenue last year .... which opened a few eyes on the Committee.

Instead, we got a fashion report ..... nice reporting.

FWIW, a fair summary comment by the Governor:

"I don't know if I'd call it a stalemate," Sandoval said. "I think there was a lot of agreement in terms of their willingness to cooperate moving forward. As I mentioned, is there a regime under our current regulatory framework or is there a type of licensure that we need to consider for this new innovation in gaming?"

My personal take is that FD seemed way smarter politically than DK and will be more productive in communicating and resolving the categorization of their product under Nevada law ..... assuming that PASPA is not tossed out by the 3d Circuit before the next scheduled meeting in August.
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:33 AM   #2203
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Gzesh View Post
The reporter forgot to mention that Joe Tall was in the room also.
Are we reading the same article?



Quote:

Also, failed to report the discussion by Chris Grove, to the effect that the industry spent 3X its gross revenue last year .... which opened a few eyes on the Committee.
Well, this is marketing money, how the spend/manage their money is their issue, the entire "DFS is not profitable", with allusion to it being bad, is kinda a silly point. They chose to do business this way. Granted the carpet-bombing of the ad explosion blew up in their face, but that's another issue.



Quote:
FWIW, a fair summary comment by the Governor:

"I don't know if I'd call it a stalemate," Sandoval said. "I think there was a lot of agreement in terms of their willingness to cooperate moving forward. As I mentioned, is there a regime under our current regulatory framework or is there a type of licensure that we need to consider for this new innovation in gaming?"
Wow, he reads wesrwood's comments on 2p2 also?

Quote:

My personal take is that FD seemed way smarter politically than DK and will be more productive in communicating and resolving the categorization of their product under Nevada law ..... assuming that PASPA is not tossed out by the 3d Circuit before the next scheduled meeting in August.
100% agreed about FD.
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:50 AM   #2204
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

I think it was edited after I tweeted Gzesh's post.
https://twitter.com/propoker/status/707373434456580096
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:51 AM   #2205
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Joe Tall View Post
Are we reading the same article?











Well, this is marketing money, how the spend/manage their money is their issue, the entire "DFS is not profitable", with allusion to it being bad, is kinda a silly point. They chose to do business this way. Granted the carpet-bombing of the ad explosion blew up in their face, but that's another issue.











Wow, he reads wesrwood's comments on 2p2 also?







100% agreed about FD.

I'm obviously a very important man
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:41 PM   #2206
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Professionalpoker View Post
I think it was edited after I tweeted Gzesh's post.
https://twitter.com/propoker/status/707373434456580096
Lol, Joe now owes me a lunch. .....
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:50 PM   #2207
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

Wow, DK is bailing out FantasyHub
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Old 03-11-2016, 12:31 AM   #2208
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Wow, DK is bailing out FantasyHub
I dont know the size of this one, but this is not the first time this has happened, more like the 4th.
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Old 03-11-2016, 02:49 AM   #2209
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Joe Tall View Post
I dont know the size of this one, but this is not the first time this has happened, more like the 4th.
And presumably the scammers that squandered player deposits will receive no punishmemt.
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Old 03-11-2016, 10:30 AM   #2210
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Pokeraddict View Post
And presumably the scammers that squandered player deposits will receive no punishmemt.
No idea if there has been local court cases filed vs former owners or not. I know there was a group formed for FantasyUp but then iTeam took over and made the players whole. Clear need for regulation though, which is coming but slow.

Last edited by Joe Tall; 03-11-2016 at 10:37 AM.
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Old 03-12-2016, 06:25 PM   #2211
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Tall View Post
No idea if there has been local court cases filed vs former owners or not. I know there was a group formed for FantasyUp but then iTeam took over and made the players whole. Clear need for regulation though, which is coming but slow.
The DK bailout eliminates the victims so that would seem to prevent civil or criminal action. That is a great deal for the people that helped themselves to player deposits.
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Old 03-12-2016, 07:12 PM   #2212
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Pokeraddict View Post
The DK bailout eliminates the victims so that would seem to prevent civil or criminal action. That is a great deal for the people that helped themselves to player deposits.
An acquisition in online gaming often involves an assumption of outstanding player liabilities, especially so when it resolves the fate of an operation which needs to scale up to survive and has faced operating losses.

I take it from your post that the "player balances" were fully restored, so, ask yourself..... "Are you a cop or someone different, i.e interested in seeing players made whole ?"

Bottom line, a bailout of player liabilities " is a great deal" for the otherwise affected players.
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Old 03-13-2016, 04:03 AM   #2213
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Geezer Soze View Post
An acquisition in online gaming often involves an assumption of outstanding player liabilities, especially so when it resolves the fate of an operation which needs to scale up to survive and has faced operating losses.

I take it from your post that the "player balances" were fully restored, so, ask yourself..... "Are you a cop or someone different, i.e interested in seeing players made whole ?"

Bottom line, a bailout of player liabilities " is a great deal" for the otherwise affected players.
Sure, it is great for players in a very short term mindset. Since there were no consequences for what seems apparent was a misappropriation of player funds, these people are free to just open another DFS site and do the same thing. They may even get licensed one day.

This mentality is why UltimateBet people are getting licensed in online poker. DFS is repeating all of the same mistakes online poker did.
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Old 03-13-2016, 12:56 PM   #2214
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Pokeraddict View Post
Sure, it is great for players in a very short term mindset. Since there were no consequences for what seems apparent was a misappropriation of player funds, these people are free to just open another DFS site and do the same thing. They may even get licensed one day.

This mentality is why UltimateBet people are getting licensed in online poker. DFS is repeating all of the same mistakes online poker did.
Well said.

The guys running that **** show lied about donating to charity and robbed players with no consequences. I'm glad that people got their money back, but the DK bailout is already doing more harm than good. DK is perpetuating a broken system and this situation will unfortunately repeat itself.
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Old 03-13-2016, 07:51 PM   #2215
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

So DFS is failing in very similar ways that online poker did in the US?
Shocking.
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Old 03-14-2016, 12:34 AM   #2216
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by lerz View Post
Well said.

The guys running that **** show lied about donating to charity and robbed players with no consequences. I'm glad that people got their money back, but the DK bailout is already doing more harm than good. DK is perpetuating a broken system and this situation will unfortunately repeat itself.
Like I said earlier in the thread, this is the 4th time this has happened, could be more like 6th.
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Old 03-14-2016, 12:35 AM   #2217
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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So DFS is failing in very similar ways that online poker did in the US?
Shocking.
Legislation is moving much faster and looking much more positive than poker.
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Old 03-14-2016, 04:02 AM   #2218
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

I mean I hope DFS survives, but if it does become regulated what will be left?

Just seems like the owners of all these sites went into it either incredibly naive, or just poorly prepared for the inevitable.
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Old 03-14-2016, 11:33 AM   #2219
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokeraddict View Post
Sure, it is great for players in a very short term mindset. Since there were no consequences for what seems apparent was a misappropriation of player funds, these people are free to just open another DFS site and do the same thing. They may even get licensed one day.

This mentality is why UltimateBet people are getting licensed in online poker. DFS is repeating all of the same mistakes online poker did.
I see, it is a "short-termed mindset" to focus on the fact that players got paid. Moreover, that is apparently the same "mentality" behind UB "people" getting licensed.

Sorry, sonny, but you are confused. Of course there is a "short-term" mindset and result in getting players paid. You perhaps prefer some other result, like players not getting paid ?

By all means, prosecute, draw and quarter and behead operators who default on player payments if you wish to extract punishment, Mr. Spanish Inquisition. However, you do not see how such a vengeful legal system MIGHT discourage operators who can leverage their branding, database, et etera assets to secure payment for the very players you would stiff in the name of crime and punishment.

I'll put it bluntly, allowing defaulting operators to arrange a sale where players DO get paid is GOOD for players. If you would prefer that every defaulting operator gets pilloried, regardless of the effect on player recoveries, you do NOT have player interests in mind, however much you posture about the "long-term" vision you pursue.

You don't like defaulting operators who arrange for full player payments to get licensed, great .... oppose their future licensing in an effective manner, instead of lumping all your grievances into a jumbled mess of outrage.

I have had no role in the outcome you are whining about, nor any involvement with either operator, but I think that players being paid or at minimum their unfunded liability being assumed, should be viewed as good thing in both the short-term and long term. (But why such payment maybe a long-term benefit for online gaming is another topic, too much of a tangent for this thread.)
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Old 03-14-2016, 11:42 AM   #2220
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by lerz View Post
Well said.

The guys running that **** show lied about donating to charity and robbed players with no consequences. I'm glad that people got their money back, but the DK bailout is already doing more harm than good. DK is perpetuating a broken system and this situation will unfortunately repeat itself.
OMG, what a horror !!! Sites launch, some fail, some succeed, and the players of those which fail are sometimes made whole by those operators who succeed.

What a nightmare !!!!

The "broken system" you are in shock over is called a free market system.... which places some risk on players to choose their providers and manage their balances carefully.

Ask the poker players in 47 States how they like playing online under a prohibition/regulation system, then get back to me ? Okay ?
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Old 03-14-2016, 12:39 PM   #2221
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Joe Tall View Post

Yea, but what about the skill game laws?
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Old 03-14-2016, 08:40 PM   #2222
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Awesemo View Post
Yea, but what about the skill game laws?
There was some skill game discussion, via Gamblit. (That is how we learned that the the Chairman of the Gaming Commission is big into playing esports.)

There will be additional policy committee meetings this year, likely in May and August, with DFS pegged for August.

So, look to May ?
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Old 03-21-2016, 12:18 PM   #2223
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

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Old 03-21-2016, 01:11 PM   #2224
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

So that statement says New York residents what about other people traveling into New York ?
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Old 03-21-2016, 01:25 PM   #2225
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Re: DFS Industry Discussion Thread

Can't sign in from NY period.They must be awful confident in the pending legislation if they're willing to give up the baseball season.
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