You strike me as the type to prefer Alec Torelli's videos on live reads so I can't say I'm surprised

Would it be possible to make a hand converter tool to enable pokersnowie to upload pokerstars tournament hand histories ?
Since it can do scenarios and challenges with antes now , would it be able to analyse a tournament HH if it was made to look like a cash HH ? i.e if blinds are 800/1600/100 then a 40k stack is converted to a $2500 stack in a $50/100/12.5 cash game (high stakes so rake is not a factor)

Hello there, this is my first post and I have a question. I opened QdTd from the button in a 3-way scenario, the SB folded and the Big called. The Flop comes Kd7h9c and the program says I should bet as I did, but it says the size is sub-optimal. So far, so good, but looking at the EV on the sizes, Snowie suggests I use a size that has less EV than the one I used. Why is that? Here are the screenshots for better visualization. Thanks!

Snowie is using a sizing that is best for your range, rather than your individual hand. In spots like this where you have a range advantage over the OOP player solvers tend to prefer betting frequently using a smaller sizing.

I was hoping you were joking but I fear not since I don’t see any more posts by you

If that’s the case thanks for all of your insightful posts and all the time you took to answer questions from newbies that were too lazy to use search.

Good luck!

Yeah but now it preferred bigger bet.Snowie's EV calculations sometimes r different than what solver will calculate. The difference is not big but it is fine to mention.The truth is EV can't be calculate precise.

What is the point you are trying to make?

Not trying to make a point.I was not sure did u look at Snowie as a solver.

Just had a look at Snowies preflop advice.
UTG open raises and faces a 3bet.

Snowie recommends we call the 3bet with hands we don’t even open with (open range obtained from Snowie preflop advisor). WTF?

I played around with it a bit but I'm not using it as a solver.

it just shows which hands are +EV to call.

The very fact that we don't open those hands, may actually be one of the main reasons why they're +EV as calls vs 3b.

You mean the smartphone app? ya it will be different...

I checked both ranges from the same mobile device and I doubt the ranges would be different whether I was using mobile or desktop.

Bit of a **** preflop advisor then. I thought preflop and flop advice was the strong point of Snowie

Also the second part of Zkesic’s reply makes zero sense.

It's +EV to call those hands vs 3bet, because opponent doesn't expect us to ever have those hands in our range.

For example, opponent will overplay 55x, 66x, 56x, 347... boards, because he knows we don't ever have 56 in this spot. However, that's also a reason why 56s may be +EV call vs 3b.

Snowie pre flop advisor it is a good starting point to balance your play.It is different from subscribe section because Snowies advice is different also in its different training levels.Preflop advisor is some balanced general version for 0.5pot open from every position and defense against 3bb or 2.5bb open.It covers a lot spots or situations that occur preflop.It is more effective against better players than the weaker ones.

I don’t have a subscription, I used the online free preflop advisor to look at the open range UTG, which only shows advice for 0.5bb which I’m not sure is either a minraise or at least less than 2.5bb pre right?

The SAME advisor tells me to call with hands I don’t open with facing a 3bet.

I did want to use Snowie to deduce on how to construct my preflop ranges; e.g how much does suitedness matter, suited aces vs suited connectors, etc.

But if it’s not consistent how can I trust it?

Quoted from pokersnowie FAQ on their webpage

"PokerSnowie seems to show inconsistent hand ranges – why is that?
In some situations there may be an inconsistency between PokerSnowie's advice and the opponent's hand range. For example, PokerSnowie advises to call a bet on the river, while the opponent's hand range doesn't offer the right odds to call. How can there be such an inconsistency?

First of all it has to be noted, that the evaluation (the move advice) is NOT based on the hand range of the opponent. The evaluation is the output of a neural network and has evolved during training. The neural network has been trained over trillions of hands, against various counter-strategies. Therefore these evaluations are very robust and can be trusted most.

The hand range, however, is a calculation based on the evaluations of the same neural network. All legal hole cards are considered and the evaluations are used to decide which hole cards PokerSnowie would possibly hold in a certain situation.

As a consequence, the evaluation may be different than a conclusion based on the hand range of the opponent.

This, unfortunately, cannot be avoided; the problem would only vanish if the neural net was a perfect calculation of the game (and not an estimation based on pattern recognition).

The hand range can be very sensitive to small changes in a previous round. Two very similar situations on the flop may lead to quite different hand ranges on the river, if a group of hands falls out of the range due to a small EV difference on the flop. Similarly, two slightly different neural nets that play almost identically may have significantly different hand ranges.

Therefore:

a) the right action cannot be concluded from the opponent's hand range
b)the evaluations are robust whereas the hand range is sensitive
c)the hand range should only be used as an indication of which hands are possible holdings"

It is 0.5 pot size open(or 2.25bb if u wish calculated in bb).It was said that Snowie levels r created accordingly to Pokerstars rake scheme which is 4.15% i think for micro levels and almost vanishing at NL10000.It prefers different ranges(tighter)for micro levels and almost optimal ranges for rake free levels.Also range advice is different accordingly to your opening size(Snowie gives advice for 4 different sizing open 0.25pot,0.5pot,1pot,2pot).But its advice is based on the very first starting decision and than acts accordingly.

Thanks for the quote but it's completely irrelevant to this discussion which is about standard open and face 3bet spots.

@Toilet I'm largely confused by your post.

No idea what you're on about here. My preflop advisor has Hero opening UTG for 2.5bb and facing a pot sized 3bet.
Please specify which position 3bets and an example of a hand that doesn't get opened but does call the 3bet so I can check if my preflop advisor agrees.

Ok thanks for the replies all.

Just to be clear this is the source I’m using to see preflop Open as UTG and preflop defend vs 3bet as UTG (after raising). https://www.pokersnowie.com/preflop-advisor.html

Youll see above that if you ask Snowie what to Open UTG, and then see what Snowie calls 3bets with after opening UTG, the latter range has hands that Snowie didn’t even open with UTG. Maybe it is this way because it is the free version? Don’t see how rake is a factor when there is no option to adjust it there


The FAQ doesn’t seem to address my Q - the FAQ is talking about Snowies advice vs opponents hand range. My issue is with Snowies advice re preflop Open, and then the advice re calling a 3bet after preflop Open. I did not look at any opponent range.

I know that some people have really strong negative opions of snowie becuase they claimed to be GTO and it isn't. If we forget marketing for a minute: is Snowie a decent platform for refining strategies and working on balancing range? I was pretty stoked to find a tool like this. But it reccomends some things thing that don't seem right. For example, I'm working my way through applications of NLHE by Janda, and he talks about defending against a three bet, in position, with aces by calling rather than four betting. It keep V's range wider and a few other things. This specific spot came up, so I raised, got 3B by an early position V, and I flatted. Snowie was like "don't do that."

So, is it a decent tool if we accept some flaws, is it pretty wonderful barre none, or is it not so great? Thanks guys.

You should use new book by Janda.It explains some Snowie and PIO solver decisions.Preflop play in Applications it's already confirmed by Janda that is wrong.

And why is this wrong?

https://gyazo.com/a5e71892b9c588cc818e693ee94c3a99

50bb deep it flats half the time . I play tourneys so I use antes and shorter stacks usually on snowie

It does flat without antes also with shorter stacks . At 100bb it prefers 4b for value

Yes snowie probably does have flaws but also some of the things that players believe are flaws may just be things that humans aren't very good at doing .
People that say it's bad like if they only want it to do things that they believe to be "good" then why use any program ? If you already know the correct play in every spot ? Having said that , consider snowie as a coach not a poker god . Coaches can be wrong but they are paid to help you develop YOUR game not to copy theirs . Ok in these days of gto there is considered to be one correct way to play but gto calcs can't currently simulate a full 6max cashgame so snowie is an inaccurate but highly usable alternative . The usefulness is that it can show you its range in every spot and this can help you redefine your own ranges and give you ideas about areas your ranges might be too value heavy or too capped etc . You can't emulate it ingame so theres no point trying to copy it's play . Although if you believe some of it's ranges to be correct then you can of course copy them for yourself . Keep thinking whilst you're using it and it's a great tool

Snowie is a useful tool as long as you understand how it derives it's strategy, the limitations of it's betting abstractions and that the majority of players you'll make your money from play very differently. And yes the preflop stuff from Applications is outdated and should be ignored. As far as preflop advice for ring games goes, Snowie is about the best it gets at the moment.