Would you say it's a fair assumption that the flop is the hardest street to play since misplaying the turn and river essentially stems from not properly constructing your range on the flop? So if your range is properly constructed on the flop that should theoretically make it easier to construct your turn range which should make it even easier to construct your river range?

river is most important for very obvious reasons

"Most crucial" and "hardest" are entirely different things. But I don't think the flop is either one. Certainly not the hardest. And crucial is kind of ambiguous so it depends what you mean.

i tend to think flop is the hardest. the flop dictates the trajectory of the hand overall, play it well and you are set up for T/R. on flop hero is confronted with an enormous amount of possibilities and variables, the game tree is still going to explode on the next two streets. ranges are still wide, hero must account for all the future run-outs, etc.

understanding how to react on all the various textures, and how ranges perform on these textures is also very complex.

by the river hero/villains distribution are more condensed, they have both acted multiple times, there are no more streets to account for.

i mean solvers can spit out solutions for river quick and easy, but running preF, and flop sims take time (case in point

OP your assumptions are correct, accept that misplaying the turn/river can come from other factors besides poor range construction on the flop. but you are correct: poor range construction on early streets has a snowball effect, and many people never trace turn/river problems back to their preF and flop choices

thanks for the replies

by this, I'm assuming you mean because there's more BB's involved and we can get away with more mistakes on the flop.

What I'm referring to, and trying to receive opinions on, is if you agree that river decisions become more obvious (we're more polarized and have much fewer combos to analyze) and you will generally make less overall mistakes than the number of mistakes you're making on former streets.

You do have an argument there with that if we're regularly making big mistakes on the river it can cost us more than if we're making even more mistakes on the flop due to the SPR. But in terms of the number of mistakes is it fair to assume that players are making a lot more mistakes with range construction on the flop than the turn and river? What about turn vs river?

semantics..... interpret it however you want then

I think by river he means bet sizing but also the fact that there aren't as many variables (implied odds) if you played the river perfectly every time you would be profitable even with significant leaks on other streets. I would agree that flop is the most important, not just because of your action, but because the fine line between winners and losers is the plan that stems from that action. Breakevens and slight losers can make the correct flop decision, but winners make that decision with a plan for future streets.

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It's kind of a philosophical question. In one sense yes, because the huge ev mistakes you see on rivers are a direct result of poor range construction on earlier streets. It's really hard to make big mistakes on the river if you get there with a well constructed range and it's most challenging to have a well constructed range when distributions are at their widest.

Here's a relevant quote from MoP

For me the turn is the most crucial if I know nothing else about my opponent.

Many people will play the turn straight (bet if they want to build a pot with a good hand or check if they want to get to showdown with a mediocre one). Floats are in most people's arsenal these days but not employed often enough to worry about unduly. (and if they start to float you a lot then you can abuse that by sandbagging with a monster)

Waiting until the river for a decison on whether you want to go with the hand or not is just too costly. Conversely always folding on the flop when you don't connect is too easily visible (i.e. exploitable)...so I take the turn a middle ground as my decision point in marginal spots with regards to information received vs. investment made.