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can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it?

02-24-2010 , 07:57 AM
is this possible? or could you provide an accurate estimate?
can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? Quote
02-24-2010 , 11:46 AM
Quantify how? What do you define as a "poker strategy"?

Certainly there are some things you can quantify, if you can estimate what your opponent's response to your actions will be. For example, if you're considering what to do when it folds to you on the button, before you've seen your cards, you can estimate based on SB and BB's tendencies how much a steal raise is worth.
can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? Quote
02-24-2010 , 12:01 PM
Theoretically yes. Practically, no. Poker is an incredibly complex game with billions of variables and situations that it would be too hard to solve theoretically by any human or computer.
can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? Quote
02-24-2010 , 01:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stryd0r
Theoretically yes. Practically, no. Poker is an incredibly complex game with billions of variables and situations that it would be too hard to solve theoretically by any human or computer.
well said 'chap

You can but its not worth the effort or risk.
can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? Quote
02-24-2010 , 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by runitback
is this possible? or could you provide an accurate estimate?
that is what game theory is all about.

And no, you can't really quantify everything at the poker table as you play, not very easily at least.

But when you analyze the game away from the table, that is when you can quantify poker, and apply it to similar situations when you are at the table.
can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? Quote
02-25-2010 , 08:47 AM
Of course you can quantify simple things fairly reliably like what hands to shove from UTG when you have 10bb left or 20bb left etc. You can even try to establish fairly convincingly what hands are a fold from UTG 100bb cash game vs 8-9 even generalize it to be right for many different styles of opponents . I mean you can prove for example that raising 3bb with QTo is wrong from that position. You do not need to go out and play it to see if its true . It will be true in almost any table. You may want to do it for other game theoretical reasons but seen individually its a negative EV idea and this is fairly easy to establish and anticipate that any experiment will verify.


You can even establish theoretically up to what size raises to call from BB when you have small pocket pairs vs n others. These will be true in most tables too.

You can theorize so many different things really before you even go to play and anticipate to be proven right with confidence. Most of the time these things will derive their validity from purely statistical arguments like how often better hands appear in the desirable range of opponents etc and also due to a fairly stable behavior of the outcome when seen as a function of others' ranges.

You can do the same with raising preflop hands like AK and hitting nothing on flop. You can study in advance all kinds of flops and know already which are the friendlier ones and which are the riskier ones when you miss so that you can treat your cbetting accordingly etc.

This forum exists often mostly so that people can study such simple cases and derive intuition how to play better. In time they can build on these simple things and get even more complex and interesting appreciation for the game. Yes the game may be hard to impossible to solve vs many opponents when real deep but that doesnt mean that certain common aspects/occurences of it are not mathematically tractable. To the contrary a great deal of poker can be solved technically or at least hlp produce intuition that you can use live in action to adjust towards preferable directions of behavior when the style of others at the spot becomes the variable. You can adjust differently on how you play certain flops for example based on the range of the opponent. Some ranges are wide enough that you can enjoy a far greater equity and knowing how this changes with their range in advance helps a lot.

The list of theoretical models to study real situations that can be "solved" before even playing is really long and limited only by our creative imagination.
can you quantify a poker strategy theoretically before you ever play it? Quote

      
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