Wijk aan Zee 2011 - Page 2 - Chess and Board Game Strategy

Agree, interesting ending. Looking at it quickly with my underqualified opinion, I'd think it will end up in a draw but Giri is in as good of a position as he can be for this type of endgame. 4v3 rook endings are notoriously tough to win unless the side with the extra pawn has another advantage as well, either a more active rook or king. In this case both rooks are active but black's king is stuck on the back rank, so white definitely has an advantage. Is it enough to convert to a win? That remains to be seen.

What are the commentators thinking?

Same as you. Probably theoretically drawn but maybe not but even then lots of practical chances for white to win.

But the commentary apparently ends even if the game is still going

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01-18-2011 , 02:39 PM

#28

Do it Right

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 3,890

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ortho

What a mindbending game this is after about 42...Bxd5. I totally have no idea what's going on, ever, until black resigns.

Hahaha, +1. That game is just an absolute mind bender. Incredibly creative play from both players.

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01-19-2011 , 07:22 AM

#29

einkillahertz

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 103

wow, Nepomnyashchiy lost in 8 moves! 8... cd is a losing novelty. The point is that after 10... Nbd7 there is 11 c5! and white Q escapes

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01-19-2011 , 07:56 AM

#30

Cadaz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 6,088

8 move loss. Reminds me of myself!

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01-20-2011 , 09:46 AM

#31

Uitje

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 654

Nepomniachtchi - Shirov blitzing out like 40 moves in a spanish game, appears to be a draw.

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01-20-2011 , 09:50 AM

#32

Noir_Desir

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2,333

they're now at move 55 while Kramnik-Aronian on the neighbouring board is at move 12.

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01-20-2011 , 10:08 AM

#33

smilingbill

2011 2+2 Chess Champion

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,458

Nice prep by shirov, he will likely improve to 0,5/3 with the neo-archangel in the tournament. No db handy but I'd guess a previous Shirov game was followed up to at least move 25?

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01-20-2011 , 10:10 AM

#34

Noir_Desir

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White deviated at move 23 from Smeets-Shirov (round 1).

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01-20-2011 , 10:39 AM

#35

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 49,707

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noir_Desir

they're now at move 55 while Kramnik-Aronian on the neighbouring board is at move 12.

lmao nize thats nize

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01-20-2011 , 03:33 PM

#36

HungryHippo

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 4,383

lol at the carlsen-l'ami ending. Sucks that l'ami swindled the draw, the magnus swindled the win.

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01-20-2011 , 03:37 PM

#37

Mog

centurion

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 136

Quote:

Originally Posted by HungryHippo

lol at the carlsen-l'ami ending. Sucks that l'ami swindled the draw, the magnus swindled the win.

I wonder if l'Ami was in major time trouble or something.

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01-20-2011 , 03:54 PM

#38

Do it Right

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 3,890

Wijk has a 30 second increment past move 60. It looks to me like its just another example of a 2600+ being unfamiliar with an elementary 'textbook' ending.

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01-20-2011 , 04:28 PM

#39

smilingbill

2011 2+2 Chess Champion

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,458

Wow the game looked really terrible all over. The little boy's nerves didn't stand up to the heat in the end, part of growing up

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01-20-2011 , 04:55 PM

#40

Uitje

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 654

He's not that little afaik.

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01-20-2011 , 05:20 PM

#41

smilingbill

2011 2+2 Chess Champion

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,458

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uitje

He's not that little afaik.

oops l'ami not giri, disregard the last part

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01-20-2011 , 05:23 PM

#42

Noir_Desir

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Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by Do it Right

Wijk has a 30 second increment past move 60. It looks to me like its just another example of a 2600+ being unfamiliar with an elementary 'textbook' ending.

there are not really textbooks on this ending, and it comes up like never. And maybe he was just a little tired after playing such a difficult game against carlsen for 70+ moves.

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01-20-2011 , 05:32 PM

#43

smilingbill

2011 2+2 Chess Champion

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,458

All I know about the ending is that it can be defended with the same Cochrane plan as R vs R+B and it should be easy

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01-20-2011 , 05:44 PM

#44

HungryHippo

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Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 4,383

they were both playing on the increment at the end, after 7 hours of play too. I think l'ami wanted to avoid putting his king on the edge and instinctively just played his king away from the edge, into the trap.

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01-20-2011 , 07:46 PM

#45

einkillahertz

centurion

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 103

Quote:

Originally Posted by Do it Right

Wijk has a 30 second increment past move 60. It looks to me like its just another example of a 2600+ being unfamiliar with an elementary 'textbook' ending.

Ive never seen this position in any endgame book. Its an easy draw and you dont really need to know any "theory" of this endgame.

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01-20-2011 , 11:07 PM

#46

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 49,707

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mog

I wonder if l'Ami was in major time trouble or something.

lmaoooooooooooooo

This is hilarious.

Anand is such a G for winning his game.

So simple for him I bet too, just sack the exchange for positional compensation and then own own own.

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01-20-2011 , 11:36 PM

#47

DaMaGor

journeyman

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 243

Quote:

Originally Posted by einkillahertz

Ive never seen this position in any endgame book. Its an easy draw and you dont really need to know any "theory" of this endgame.

Of course it's easy. So easy that a grandmaster lost it.

Chess is a very hard game.

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01-21-2011 , 01:22 AM

#48

Do it Right

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 3,890

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noir_Desir

there are not really textbooks on this ending, and it comes up like never. And maybe he was just a little tired after playing such a difficult game against carlsen for 70+ moves.

eg- Basic Chess Endings. Chapter VII, Section V, Subsection E. Page 489 in the revised version.

I've never seen a single endgame manual that didn't cover this ending in some detail. In fact, for a bit of trivia, Rook vs Knight was actually the topic of the very first recorded and released endgame study from 842AD!

This ending is not terribly frequent but it does come up. It also fairly recently occurred in high level chess in Karjakin-Shirov, 2007, for instance.

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01-21-2011 , 02:01 AM

#49

couriermike

adept

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 897

Apparently Kasparov beat Polgar R+N vs R. FCE says a win is possible if the defending king is trapped on the edge, and a win is probable if you can get him in the corner.

unrelated thought..
Anand is the master.

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01-21-2011 , 04:02 AM

#50

smilingbill

2011 2+2 Chess Champion

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,458

Yeah if I remember right, it's also covered in the excellent Fundamental Chess Endings (Müller&Lamprecht), giving some example of defense using the Cochrane idea (roughly: pin the minor piece from behind/give checks if king tries to get out of cover/run your king to the opposite direction the enemy king goes). Then a couple of cases where the beginner starts off in a tangle and loses are given as exercises, one of them being Polgar-Kaspy.

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