I love seeing Benjamin and Friedel both win as black today, just because 8 players within half a point of first with three rounds to go means things are looking promising for an awesome super exciting finish! Great tourney so far!

ehhh i dunno mayybe. I had it like 20-18% not some convincing advantage where I want to start betting on it. I think Naka always has an edge in tiebreakers against everyone, which counts for something, although maybe not as much so in the tiebreakers for this event.

Does Curtains posting ITT mean that today's recap video is finished? And will be on the site soon? *crosses fingers*

Wow.. great coverage curtains loved the videos. I never followed chess before and still found this very entertaining.

Ah okay now I remember that -- dragondorf is familiar.

(not)shirov crush!

What exactly are the tiebreakers for this event? It's looking like there's a decent chance it will end up mattering, I can't find them anywhere on the official website, and you mentioned in your latest video that you helped devise them so I was hoping you could fill us in

I'll mention them in detail in my next video hopefully, if I remember.

Basically it's none of this endless series of blitz games crap that you usually see, however it'll still be controversial, although will at least be a "real" chess game that the fans always claim to want to see.

Basically assume its a 2 way tie (there are other systems for bigger ties but I'm going to stick with this one for now since it's simplest). The two players play one game of 45+5, so it's a pretty slow time control. The catch is that black gets draw odds.

Now you've probably seen this scenario a million times in which a bunch of bumbling organizers decide that they know what the fairest time odds are and so they just randomly decide that some time is fair (usually this number changes from year to year), randomly assign one color to one of the players, and then invariably someone bitches about how it's unfair to be white or unfair to be black or whatever etc etc.

So the format here is as follows: Both players make one sealed bid in which they bid on how much time they are willing to give away in order to choose their color.

So if it's Kamsky vs Nakamura for example in the tiebreak, Let's say Kamsky is willing to start with 35 minutes to choose his color, while Nakamura is willing to start with 30. This would mean that Nakamura bid the lowest time, so he would get 30 minutes, Kamsky would get 45 minutes, and Nakamura could either choose to have white or take black and draw odds.

The upsides:

1. The game is a relatively real chess game with no ridiculous time scrambles happening on move 15.
2. For media it's great because it's known that by the end of the game, the champion will be determined. There won't be 10 more blitz games going back and forth, and there won't be the final armageddon blitz game which is really super random looking.
3. It's completely fair to all parties. No one has an inherent advantage. No one can complain that they were cheated by the rules being shaded towards one color.
4. There will be a financial bonus if you win, so that even though black gets the title on a draw, there will be a few thousand dollars riding on them winning the game, so if they are totally winning they aren't always going to just accept a draw immediately, and so the actual real chess part of the game will be more legitimate than if black has absolutely no reason to win.
5. Please note that the entire tiebreak has to last a maximum of 2 hours, due to timing involving closing ceremony and etc. This format allows for this, even with a 3-4 player tie.

The downsides:

1. Of course I hate someone winning something on a draw, however I also hate all other tiebreak systems I've seen. The nonstop blitz games are annoying, and while G 45 isn't 40/2 SD 1, the chance of a well played game, worthy of the US Championship, goes way up.
2. It could be considered confusing, however the players have known about it for months and have had ample time to consider the ramifications of what their bids should be.
3. The one thing that really bugs me is there is no provision for 5+ players if there is a tie. Right now they just eliminate everyone under 4th place on tiebreaks. This is one aspect of this system that I disagree with and I think it'd be pretty easy to allow for more players, but the organizers didn't want to deal with. Fortunately it's unlikely that more than 4 players will tie for first, but I've certainly seen crazier things.

Anyway I like the system personally, and it was shown to some top players/ tournament participants on the committee and they passed it. However I'm almost 100% certain there will be huge criticism if this tiebreak occurs Ideally I'd like to use this system but make the time control much slower and make sure the incentive for black to win is still very significant (I'm not sure if it's quite as significant as I'd have liked), but due to time constraints it's not possible.

Excellent tiebreak description.

I had been wondering what the tiebreaks would be also and couldn't find anything with a preliminary search.

Thanks curtains.

what if they both bid the same number? then just assigning the colours randomly wouldn't be fair, I think.

If they both bid the same number then Lawton wins the US Champ. by default.

nakamura if he gets there will just bid 5 mins no? :P

imo if there is a tie they should play PAM against each other to see who wins

If they bid the same it is random and it is fair IMO. They both said that a particular amount of time is fair, and so it theoretically shouldn't matter to them what color they get, or else they should have bid even less.

lol I was thinking the same thing actually. I could def. see Nakamura bidding 5 minutes for 3 reasons:

1. He doesn't really need much time at all. If he chooses 5 minutes, his opponent will most likely not use all of the 45 minutes, and think in something close to 5 mins (10-15 minutes I guess).

2. For psychological reasons. "Woah he bid 5 minutes!"

3. For choice of color.

Here it is below in more detail. First a few points:

1. If there is a 3 way tie you can certainly say that the tiebreak procedures aren't 100% fair to everyone, but I think the effort was good. It's an interesting scenario at least, because I think black really does have a significant advantage at 25+5 with draw odds, not sure what it is but probably black wins that matchup at least 60% of the time, so it's kind of annoying to face that in the end if you take the bye in the first match, although I suspect everyone will do so.

2. I forget my other points Main objection on my end is that they don't just play some super fast blitz game to determine the four finalists if there should be more than 4 tied, but whatever, hopefully this won't happen. It just feels kinda lame for someone to tie for first and not get to even play the tiebreak, I mean freaking European Champs had an 11 way tiebreak with no problems.

Anyway official rules are below:

6. Playoff Procedures:
If the 2009 U.S. Championships ends in a tie for first, all tied players up to a total of four players will contest a playoff match for the title of 2009 U.S. Champion and for the $5000 Jackpot Bonus. If there are more than four players tied for first the following tie-breaks will be used to determine four players to contest tiebreak C below: (1) Modified median, (2) Solkoff, (3) Cumulative, (4) Cumulative of Opposition, (5) Most Blacks, (6) Score against other Tied Players (7) Most Wins. In all cases, the main prize pool will be split equally.

A. Two Players:
If two players tie for first, they will enter a tiebreak that begins at 5:00 pm or no earlier than an hour after the conclusion of either Player’s final round.

The base time for the game is 45 minutes+ 5 second increment. It will be a draw odds game (Black wins on a draw.) The players will both bid on the amount of time (minutes and seconds, a number equal or less to 45:00) that they are willing to play with in order to choose their color. The player who bid the lower number of time chooses his or her color and gets the amount of time they wrote down; the other side always receives 45:00. If both players pick exactly the same number, the chief arbiter will flip a coin to determine who shall choose their color.

If either player wins, he or she gets the title of U.S. Champion and the $5,000 Jackpot Bonus. If the game is a draw, Black wins the title of U.S. Champion, but the Jackpot Bonus will be split equally.

B. Three players:
The Playoff for three players or more begins at 5 pm on May 17, 2009. If there are three players tied for first, the player with the highest tie-breaks in the math tie-breaks will choose between a.) getting a bye into the first round or b.) playing the preliminary round. If he or she chooses b.), the bye into the final round will be passed on to the next player by tiebreak, and if the second player by tiebreak also refuses the bye, it will be forced on to the final player by tiebreak.

Preliminary round:
Players ranked 2 and 3 by math tie-breaks will contest a bidding draw odds game like the one above except instead of 45 minutes base time the base time will be 25 minutes+ 5 second increment.

Final round:
After a ten minute break, the winner of the preliminary round will play the player with a bye in another 25+5 increment draw odds game. This will not be a bidding game. The player who won the preliminary round will chose whether he prefers White or Black and draw odds. The Jackpot Bonus will be awarded to the players in the final match as described above.

C. Four players:
The Playoff begins at 5 pm.

Preliminary round
Math tie-breaks will determine which Players are paired for play: 1 plays 4 and 2 plays 3. They will contest two preliminary 25+5 bidding match tiebreak matches.

Final round
After a ten-minute break, the winner of each of the preliminaries will contest a final 25+5 draw odds bidding game. The title of U.S. Champion will be determined by this game, and the Jackpot Bonus will be awarded as described above.
Time Control: 40/2, G/1

If they both bid the same amount of time, why not simply have them bid again? Bidding ends when they bid different amounts of time, or they both repeat their bids twice in a row (at which case then it becomes clear they are both content playing either color and random makes more sense).

Also, is it logical to have an increment in this sort of game? It seems that black has a massive edge in this sort of game already with his only handicap being the time odds. The increment just helps to further mitigate the relevance of this handicap.

Increment is necessary IMO for a lot of reasons, playing poker now though will give thoughts later. Anyway it's silly, the players know about the increment so can take it into account in their bids. Also if they tie it's totally fair, they had the chance to bid lower and they didn't take it, and were aware that on a tied bid that a coin is flipped.

would naka have the edge in a HU NL tiebreak match with 30 BBs?

30 BBs is kinda short Jon.

Bump it to 50 BBs and I can say def. edge

If Naka wins maybe he should enter the WSOP ME

Wow, some really fun games today and the tournament remains super tight at the top. Both of the leaders after yesterday lost and now, with 5 points, there is a 4-way tie for first between Kamsky, Naka, Onischuk and Hess. Naka and Hess have played all the others tied for first so presumably we'll get to see Onischuk-Kamsky tomorrow. Shulman and Akobian are .5 behind the leaders and 5 people are bunched up with 4 points. The pairings for Sat should be really interesting since there are several groups of players who have all played each other (or nearly all) who have the same score. I'm pumped. Oh, and well done Naka! To hell with the french.

today was a great round indeed!!! Go hess imo

Wow indeed swingdoc!

Naka crushed the French and Akobian! Absolutely great game and effort by Naka. A real crowd pleaser! It's really great to see Naka crush the French when it's played by one of the "French experts" Akobian.

The last two rounds should be incredibly interesting with all the bunching at the top.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Nakamura is gonna take the momentum of that great win and ride it all the way to the Championship.

He certainly got the best of it in the round 8 pairings:
I'm really rooting for Brooks to get a GM norm, but that game has to be by far the most lopsided matchup among the players still in contention. Now we just have to wait and hope Naka doesn't go berzerker crazy with some ridiculous opening I'm predicting a draw on the first 2 boards, 0-1 for Naka and 1-0 for Akobian.

how can Brooks get a GM norm in an all-USA tournament? He should have to play some foreign players imo.

I'm not convinced this is true. Suppose Nakamura is in the tiebreak against Kamsky, he thinks he would have a good shot with 10 minutes + draw odds but he doesn't think Kamsky would bid lower than 20, then he should still prefer to bid 15 over 10. So the game isn't quite set up to incentivize players to bid their true equilibrium time amount. I guess one can't say it's not "fair" when it's randomly determined, but you could say that about any Armageddon tiebreak. I think swingdoc's suggestion of a second round of bidding is slightly better.

AFAIK there's an exception that allows for 1 national championship/year to circumvene the international opposition norm criterium.

Predictions for this round anyone?

I think (and hope!) Onischuk will hold a draw on board one. Kamsky doesn't have any special motivation to overpress against the player he probably considers the second strongest in the tournament after himself.

Shulman continues to play strong, and from what I've seen is quite fearsome with black. Hess is playing amazing and has been great to watch (and very good for American chess!). I'm a bit too lazy to do potential pairing calculations for the next round, but with a draw and all the incest at the top Shulman will probbably have to play someone quite strong in the last round whether or not he wins or draws, so he may consider this his last chance and try to press hard. I am not sure how Hess will approach this game, but I am guessing he won't push too hard this close to the end knowing that if he draws he most likely will still be tied for the lead. I'm hoping this will be an exciting game.

Nakamuuuura. Brooks is playing well of course but I don't think he has much of a chance unless smallville makes some dubious premoves in the opening.

Akobian - Benjamin should be a good fighting game as both players are looking to position themselves for the last round. That said, Akobian with white seems like a clear favorite.

Rounding out the top 5 boards I'm really hoping Josh can get over the demoralizing performances from the last few rounds to finish strong. He definately has good chances with white, so hopefully this will be another exciting game.