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Positional Opening Repertoire? Positional Opening Repertoire?

08-14-2009 , 09:10 PM
3. .. b5 is actually the most popular move after 3. d5

And yeah, I play it as my main weapon against 2. Nf3.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-14-2009 , 09:35 PM
Interesting. I'd guess that other moves tend to transpose which is why they always struck me as being more popular and probably just the randomness of my experience. I'll have to take a look one of these days.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-15-2009 , 02:49 AM
I just wanted to say that I've been playing the Bb5 Sicilian in 5-min on ICC (yes, I got an account) and it's been working brilliantly so far even though I don't really know the theory behind it. In several games already I've been able to give Black a bad dark-squared bishop (with my center pawns advanced and on light squares, of course, since my LSB is gone!), leading to a lasting power-play situation.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-15-2009 , 08:20 AM
It is to note that Kasparov found it psychologically annoying to play against Bb5 Sicilian in comparison to the main line with d4.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-17-2009 , 05:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dire
1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 c5 3. d5 b5!

The point. Black has now already made his thematic 'break' as there is no c4 pawn covering b5. White's best attempt for an edge is most likely now Bg5 when you can say good bye to quiet positional play.

Even attempts to get a benko can be met with 4. c4 Bb7
I recall a game Kasparov-Miles from 1986 that developed into a really wild hacking...

Code:
[Event "Basel"]
[Site "It"]
[Date "1986.??.??"]
[EventDate "?"]
[Round "?"]
[Result "1-0"]
[White "Garry Kasparov"]
[Black "Anthony Miles"]
[ECO "A46"]
[WhiteElo "?"]
[BlackElo "?"]
[PlyCount "61"]

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 c5 3.d5 b5 4.Bg5 Ne4 5.Bh4 Qa5+ 6.Nbd2 Bb7 7.a4
Bxd5 8.axb5 Qc7 9.Ra4 Qb7 10.c4 Nxd2 11.cxd5 Nxf1 12.Qd3 d6
13.e4 Nd7 14.Qxf1 h6 15.Qe2 g5 16.Bg3 Bg7 17.e5 O-O 18.h4 Qxd5
19.hxg5 Nxe5 20.Bxe5 dxe5 21.gxh6 Bf6 22.Rh5 Qe6 23.Nxe5 Qb3
24.Ra3 Qb4+ 25.Kf1 Rad8 26.Nc6 Qxb2 27.Qxb2 Bxb2 28.Rxa7 Rc8
29.Rxe7 c4 30.Ke2 c3 31.Kd3 1-0
But for what it's worth, 4.c4 is absolutely standard. E.g. Palliser recommends this line against the Benkö as part of his 1.d4 repertoire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by All-inMcLovin
It is to note that Kasparov found it psychologically annoying to play against Bb5 Sicilian in comparison to the main line with d4.
I effin' hate the Rossolimo as Black and have struggled all my life to find something to my taste against it. Part of the problem surely is that I used to play it with White back in my 1.e4 days...
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-17-2009 , 01:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viikatemies
I effin' hate the Rossolimo as Black and have struggled all my life to find something to my taste against it. Part of the problem surely is that I used to play it with White back in my 1.e4 days...
Funny, I used to hate it pretty badly, but once I started playing it as White the problem dissolved. Now I even have multiple lines I like playing as Black against the Rossolimo.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-22-2009 , 08:36 AM
French/Nimzo Indian as basic repertoire for black is ok.

As for white you may take a look into 1.Nf3 and games by Ulf Andersson. That is as rock solid positional as it gets. Petrosian is another candidate for positional play.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-24-2009 , 08:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sholar
Yes. Dire, I don't understand. I agree that White gives up the ability to play f3 or f4 systems as I acknowledged, and also a little bit of flexibility with move orders, but I don't find the f4 positions very appealing (or positional for that matter) and the f3 systems are not particularly to my liking.

I think White has many decent options with an early Nf3 against the Benoni, and I'd definitely enter those lines (and not play c3 etc). I'm not sure I'd consider the closed sicilian systems to be any more ambitious than white playing Nf3 in the Benoni...I know you like to be controversial for its own sake, but calling Nf3 systems risky seems like a stretch to me.
1./2. Nf3 avoids the Grünfeld and Benko systems at the cost of not being able to play the exchange QGD for an advantage. Calling it risky does sound funny, at any rate 4. Nf3 is considered a valid challenge to the Benko, so 3. ...b5 isn't really that big of a problem.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-24-2009 , 11:24 AM
While I'm not an expert on the 4. Nf3 Benko Gambit 'declined' theory, I do know it leads to very wild and unique positions. I wouldn't touch the benko as black, but I am very happy to get a Nf3 benko declined by transposition. On the same note, I've also picked up 4. Nf3 as my main weapon against the benko as white!

I just love the positions. They are crazy and dynamic and there's also tons of unexplored territory quite early in the opening. And attempts by white to calm down the position with moves like 5. a4 are simply good for black. So I don't think it's hyperbole to say it's kind of risky just tossing out 1. d4 Nf3 2. Nf3 hoping for a quiet maneuvering struggle when you can be basically forced into the exact opposite sort of position which can go very bad very fast for white if he's not prepared.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-25-2009 , 09:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Discipline
RoundTower, my openings are hodge-podge at the moment. For a long time I played the KID without knowing much of the theory, and I read a book on the Dragon and played that. I believe that playing the Dragon in particular stunted my growth as a player. I play crappy sidelines as White with 1. e4 to avoid theory.
I can see why you're looking to change your repertoire...the KID and Dragon are two of the most analyzed and tactical openings there are...strange choices for someone who's looking for a quiet positional battle.

I am a big fan of devoting your study time to the middlegame and endgame and basically just playing random nonsense in the opening. I'm an FM but I don't play seriously anymore, just an occasional tournament for fun. I just wing it in the opening because I don't keep up with theory, but I find I get at least as good positions out of the opening as when I used to study more. Once you're used to solving problems on your own in the opening, you can go off the beaten path. Many opponents will spaz out in unfamiliar positions. Even someone as strong as Nakamura has had a lot of success playing very weird openings.

I usually play 1. e4 and just aim for a playable middlegame. Against the Sicilian the Rossolimo is fine, as are the various setups with Nc3 and f4. Against 1. e5 I play 2. Bc4 and after 2. ... Nf6 3. d3 you often transpose to an Italian Game. I think the Ruy Lopez sidelines that avoid the Marshal are also quite good practically. Or, you could just play something like 1. b3. I don't think it's worth it to fight for a tiny theoretical advantage. Just get playable positions and play chess.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-29-2009 , 03:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by willage
I am a big fan of devoting your study time to the middlegame and endgame and basically just playing random nonsense in the opening. I'm an FM but I don't play seriously anymore, just an occasional tournament for fun.
This approch is ridiculous! Playing random nonsense in the opening might have prevented you from becoming IM. Maybe this is the reason why you don't play seriously anymore. In fact you never were...

In chess everything is linked together. If your openings are random nonsense, your middlegame positions will be random nonsense too and it is very tough to get things going with such kind of handicap.

You should read this book: http://www.amazon.com/Questions-Mode.../dp/1906552037 and rethink your approach.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
08-29-2009 , 12:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shandrax
This approch is ridiculous! Playing random nonsense in the opening might have prevented you from becoming IM. Maybe this is the reason why you don't play seriously anymore. In fact you never were...

In chess everything is linked together. If your openings are random nonsense, your middlegame positions will be random nonsense too and it is very tough to get things going with such kind of handicap.

You should read this book: http://www.amazon.com/Questions-Mode.../dp/1906552037 and rethink your approach.
I guess it's a matter of perspective. Compared to most tournament players, I was quite serious. Compared to a GM, no, I wasn't a serious player.

Maybe the phrase "random nonsense" was misleading. I'm not suggesting you play completely randomly for the first 10 moves or something. I'm just saying I think it's a good practical decision for most players to avoid the main theoretical lines. Getting a playable position that you're comfortable with is much more important than striving for some tiny theoretical advantage.
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08-30-2009 , 05:26 AM
Ok, we are back on the same page again.

The reason I wrote about that is that we have an IM on our team who always arrives late and his preparation against GM competition with black consists of something like 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Qe7 "and go from there". He has no trouble keeping his Elo around 2450 this way and his ICC blitz rating is 3000+. I mean just think about what could happen if the guy took chess any serious. He has obvious GM potential, but he simply doesn't care.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-01-2009 , 10:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viikatemies
Discipline,

I have four sentences for you:

1) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 1
2) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 2
3) Mihael Marin, A Spanish Repertoire for Black
4) Mihael Marin, Beating the open games
Strongly agree with this suggestions, but what about with Black vs d4, or flankopenings what books is on a par with the 4 you mention here?
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-02-2009 , 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokerpun
Strongly agree with this suggestions, but what about with Black vs d4, or flankopenings what books is on a par with the 4 you mention here?
There are a lot of awesome books but the question is which opening to recommend. The best would probably some Queen's Gambit variation, because it's easier to learn and play than the Nimzo/Queen's Indian complex.

Going from there:
  • Mathew Sadler: The Queen's Gambit Declined
  • Harald Keilhack: The Tarrasch Defence

These two would give you enough to also have a repertoire against the Reti, the Catalan and the English:

1.c4 e6 and now 2.Nc3 d5 or 2.Nf3 d5 3.b3 Nf6 4.g3 Be7 5.Bg2 0-0 6.0-0 c5.
Also 1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.g3 c5.

Keilhack explains Catalan and Reti style positions and Avruch discusses the Catalan/Tarrasch positions from the White perspective.

Now except for the Marin books (1.e4 e5) I have recommended my own repertoire. Against 1.e4 I still stick to the Sicilian (Sveshnikov).
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-02-2009 , 04:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viikatemies
Discipline,

I have four sentences for you:

1) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 1
2) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 2
3) Mihael Marin, A Spanish Repertoire for Black
4) Mihael Marin, Beating the open games
Which openings and lines do they cover?

BTW, accelerated dragon migth not be that bad for you, since you already playing the dragon.
Terrible vs weaker players though. There is no way you can play for a win with black.

KID is a very broad opening. You migth find some solid positional lines there.
Otherwise you can try Q gambit accepted. There is not as much necessary theory as there are in other openings.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-02-2009 , 05:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paymenoworlater
Which openings and lines do they cover?
1) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 1

This volume recommends the following openings:
  • 1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 => Catalan
  • 1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 => Slav with 4.e3
  • Against the Tarrasch Defense => Main line, but 9.dxc5 instead of 9.Bg5
  • Against the Chigorin => 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nf3 dxc4 5.Bg5
  • There's also stuff against minor lines such as the Albin's or the Baltic

A sample read can be obtained as a PDF on the publishers web site.

2) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 2

The second volume is not yet published. It will cover the Indian defenses where Avruch is going to recommend kingside fianchetto lines.

3) Mihael Marin, A Spanish Repertoire for Black

Closed Ruy Lopez, 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.0-0 Be7 6.Re1 b5 7.Bb3 d6 8.c3 0-0 9.h3 Na5 10.Bc2 c5 11.d4 Qc7 12.Nbd2 and here two lines as the core of the repertoire, 12...Nc6 (Rubinstein variation) and 12...Bd7 (Petrosian variation).

Of course, White's earlier deviations are also covered. A sample read can be obtained as a PDF on the publishers web site.

4) Mihael Marin, Beating the open games

1.e4 e5 and not Ruy Lopez, with the exception of the Ruy Lopez exchange, which Marin also put in here. The book has an extremely awesome chapter on the Evans Gambit, which is also of use for playing the Evans with White. The complete chapter can be obtained as a PDF on the publishers web site.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-02-2009 , 05:34 AM
i believe this is right, correct me if i remember something wrong (dont have the books at hand right now)

avrukh vol. 1: catalan, 4.e3 vs slav/semislav complex, 7.bb3 against qga, stuff against more obscure defenses to queen's gambit
avrukh vol. 2: not out yet, supposedly g3 stuff vs indian defenses
marin spanish: classical chigorin ruy, normal stuff against white deviations, 5.-f6 vs exchange ruy
marin open games: italian, 4.-bb4 vs spanish 4 knights, 4.-nf6 v scotch, 2.-bc5 v kings gambit

edit: damn you viika with your quicker and better post
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-02-2009 , 05:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smilingbill
edit: damn you viika with your quicker and better post
I forgot the QGA in Avruch Vol. 1 though...
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-06-2009 , 02:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viikatemies
1) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 1

This volume recommends the following openings:
  • 1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 => Catalan
  • 1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 => Slav with 4.e3
  • Against the Tarrasch Defense => Main line, but 9.dxc5 instead of 9.Bg5
  • Against the Chigorin => 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nf3 dxc4 5.Bg5
  • There's also stuff against minor lines such as the Albin's or the Baltic

A sample read can be obtained as a PDF on the publishers web site.

2) Boris Avruch, Grandmaster Repertoire Vol. 2

The second volume is not yet published. It will cover the Indian defenses where Avruch is going to recommend kingside fianchetto lines.

3) Mihael Marin, A Spanish Repertoire for Black

Closed Ruy Lopez, 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.0-0 Be7 6.Re1 b5 7.Bb3 d6 8.c3 0-0 9.h3 Na5 10.Bc2 c5 11.d4 Qc7 12.Nbd2 and here two lines as the core of the repertoire, 12...Nc6 (Rubinstein variation) and 12...Bd7 (Petrosian variation).

Of course, White's earlier deviations are also covered. A sample read can be obtained as a PDF on the publishers web site.

4) Mihael Marin, Beating the open games

1.e4 e5 and not Ruy Lopez, with the exception of the Ruy Lopez exchange, which Marin also put in here. The book has an extremely awesome chapter on the Evans Gambit, which is also of use for playing the Evans with White. The complete chapter can be obtained as a PDF on the publishers web site.
The books are very very very good. The recommended variations are absolute mainlines and the coverage of these variations is much deeper than it was ever published before. The problem is of course memorizing all of this stuff, because it is technically a complete GM repertoire.
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-06-2009 , 04:13 AM
In my experience the memorizing will come through practise and work. Most of the recommended lines are not in the Najdorf ballpark, where one wrong move will get you mated.

There are some lines though which must be learned by heart, for example the defense against the Max Lange Attack in "Beating the Open Games". But this is something that must be done with every opening repertoire, as long as one doesn't want to resort to something dull like the Kings Indian Attack or 1.d4 2.Nf3 3.Bf4 against everything...
Positional Opening Repertoire? Quote
09-06-2009 , 04:13 AM
.

Last edited by Viikatemies; 09-06-2009 at 04:17 AM. Reason: Duplicate post
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