disclaimer: i'm a noob (1350ish)

you are black. what's the best way to defend here? i was surprised to see that crafty actually graded this position fairly evenly. what's the best move and are there still solid winning chances?






edit: just realized i probably should put this kind of post in the low-content thread, rather than starting a new thread for it. will in the future.

it looks bad to me at a first glance, however maybe it is playable.

You have to defend g6 and then try to get some play yourself. You can either play on the h-file or in the centre. Although you have extra centre pawns I think striking out in the centre would only help White get at your king, so try the h-file. Rh6, Ra8-h8, Nf8 and at least you have a threat that is awkward for White to meet, while White won't be going crazy just yet because his QR and N are out of play and if he goes f4-f5 you can meet it with g5, or maybe Ne5 if the knight is still there.

Maybe Crafty sees something more concrete though, you should look at the lines it gives rather than just saying "this position is equal".

edit: I don't think h5 is a threat, just keep on with the Rah8 and Nf8 plan and he won't want to open the h-file.

Well, since White has the threat of Qxh5 and Qxg6, Black next move is pretty constrained: either Rh6 or Rah8. Both seem pretty reasonable, and one idea of 1...Rh6 is that White can't increase the pressure with 2.f5 because of 2...Ne5. (2.h5 is a possibility though)

I think 1...Rah8 is probably easier to play for Black though. That's where the rook should end up anyway, and Black's king is safer than White's after 2.Qxg6+ Kf8. That position is pretty balanced, and if Black declines White's offer to repeat after 3.Qxg7+ Ke8 4.Qg6+, White can still probably force the trade of queens and rooks.

I would go 1. Rh6 with the point being that after 2. h5 Black can play ...Rah8 and if 3. hxg6? then ...Rh1+ winning the a1 rook.

Rh6 looks best, at first glance I would rather have White here, but White's king is very exposed which might cause him problems in the long run.

... Rh6

Now, white's attack is stopped in its tracks. You can slowly plan a h-file pressure with ...Rah8.

Basically, there are two candidate moves: 1...Rh6 and 1...Rah8 and the latter is possible because it turns out that the Black king is "safe enough". The more difficult part is to realize that Black is better after 1...Rh6 with the idea of 2...Rah8,...Kf7/f8-e8-c8, ...Qa5: he has a safer king, every piece is working and arguably the better pawn structure; thus, Black can play on since he has the "slightly better side of equality". The position may be theoretically drawn, but it is White that should be trying to equalize. [ Yeah, I know it could be hard for anyone <2000 to realize all that! ]


With 1...Rah8?, White can equalize with 2. Qxg6+ Kg8 3. e5 ( with the idea of e6 so that if the Nd7 moves, Qg8+ mating ) and Black doesn't seem to have better than a draw after 3...de5 (3...fe5? 4. fe5+-: e.g., 4...de5 5. Nc5! +- wins at least the queen or 4...R5h6 5. Rf1+ Nf6 6. Qg7+ Ke8 7. ef6 ) 4. Qg7+ Ke8 5. Qg6+ and now either 5...Kf8 = or 5...Kd8 when White has 6. Rd1! ( threatening Qg8+ mating ) Kc8 7. Qxh5 Rxh5 8. Rg8+ Kb7 9. Rxd7 Qxd7 10. Nc5+ Kc7 11. Nxd7 Kxd7 12. fe5 Rxe5 with a likely draw.

1...Rh6! is best in order to play on: e.g., 2. Kg2 Rah8 3. Rh1 Kf7 4. Nc3 ( 4. c4 Qa5! 5. Nc3 =+; 5. Qxd7? Qd2+ and ...Rxh4 with a winning attack; this line shows the exposure of White's king ) Ke8 and Black is definitely not worse. [ Against 2. h5? Rah8 3. Rd1 and now 3...Rxh5? allows 4. Qg6+ Kf8 5. e5 fe5 6. Qg7+ Ke8 7. Qg6+ Kf8 = ( 7...Kd8?? 8. Qxh5! +- since 8...Rxh5 allows a mate ending with Nc5+ ), but 3...Nf8! leads to very good positions for Black: if 4. hg6? d5! 5. e5 ( 5. ed5? Rh1+ 6. Kf2 Rxd1 7. Qxd1 Qxf4+ 8. Qf3 Qd2+ 9. Kf1 Qc1+ 10. Kg2 Qxc2+ 11. Kf1 Qb1+ 12. Kf2 Qxa2+ ) fe5 6. fe5 Qxe5 7. Qd4 Rh1+ 8. Kf2 R8h2+ 9. R3g2 Rxg2+ 10. Kxg2 Rh2+ -+; White's best may be 4. Rh3 but after 4...Rxh5, Black's simply up a pawn. ]

After 1...Rh6! it is IMHO very difficult to find a constructive plan for White whereas Black will eventually activate his queen after moving his king away from the kingside.

i think after Rh6 white should not bother with Kg2, but immediately start rerouting his horrible knight. I'd go for Nc3-e2-d4 and if black plays c5 then back to c3 and into d5. I don't think the threat to the white h-pawn is that serious as long as were threatening g6.

Hm, upon further inspection this could be suicidal due to a timely Qb6-check. Then mate via Rxh2 and Qf2 always threatens.

I'd definitely prefer black here after Rh6 and I'm somewhat surprised he's not winning by force. White's position just has so many weaknesses. It's going to be hard for him to not lose material and after grabbing material black's initiative will only grow stronger.

And I think it was a great idea to post this in its own thread. I mean there's a whole lot more meat in a chess position than a poker hand, yet it's standard to post a single poker hand. Not to mention there's not too much to talk/post about in chess if you exclude positions!

Dire, what happens after 1. ... Rh6 2. h5?

2 .. Rah8 and white is really struggling to hold it together. I had to let Rybka find moves for white cause everything is so depressing. i.e. 1 ... Rh6 2. h5 Rah8 3. Kg2 Nf8 4. Rh1 Qa5 and black is just going to evacuate his king and use the h-file and infiltrating queen to pwn white's position.

What can black do to counter pawn F5, with a plan to advance to xG6, and hopefully move the other pawn to H5? Sorry forgot to add this is after Rook H6.

Mack

Seeing how Dire has responded earlier, after 1...Rh6! 2. f5? Ne5 -+. It's not an exaggeration to say that Black is winning after 2...Ne5: it's a tempo on the queen and now the h4 pawn is lost ( eventually ...Rah8,...Rxh4); also, e5 is an ideal post for Black's knight and although White's knight has a good post on e6, it's four moves away ( but the crux is that the h-pawn is falling ).