It seems that we didn't actually meet - I was there in 1997, 2004 and 2009. It was remembering 2002.
Presumably it was Matthew MacFadyen who offered to coach you? He's a nice guy, and a good coach.

WAGC link here.

Yes it was him, and he was indeed very nice.
I don't think I even got back to him later or thanked him for analysing a couple of my games. (My only excuse is that I was 16 and easily distracted).

I was supposed to play again in 2003, the year it got cancelled.

It seems that there are two scoring systems. Janice Kim's Learn to Play go Series seems to count territories as being areas surrounded by stones of a certain colour but not including the stones, while the brief tutorial I had a look at on KGS says the stones are counted as part of the territory.
1)When is each system used?
2)Which is more common or offical?
3) And are there specific names for them so I can spot when each one is in use?
It seems that it would greatly affect strategy, particularly when to pass.

Also Niel S. Is that offer of a learning game still open?

Counting stones is called area scoring, and is typically associated with the Chinese tradition of the game, whereas scoring territory is known as, imaginatively enough, territory scoring, and is associated with the Japanese tradition.

Assuming that people don't pass through the game except to indicate the end (which they pretty much shouldn't) it's not a handicap game, and one other technical condition, then there's basically no difference to the result from which system you use.

It does slightly alter the way you play out the end of the game and how you do the counting, as well as how you handle prisoners (in territory scoring you have to keep them to include at the end, in area scoring you don't), but these are pragmatic issues not strategic ones.

This page explains more, but is a bit anarchic i think on a quick glance: http://senseis.xmp.net/?TerritoryAndAreaScoring

Area v. territory affects when to pass but it doesn't really affect strategy. Mathematically the two are equivalent.

Rules differences between Japan, Korea, PRC, ROC, New Zealand, US, and Europe (did I miss any? :-) do affect strategy but not because of this.

Right now not really. It'd been a year since I posted in this thread and since then I drifted back off and have taken on new commitments that really suck too much time for me to study this game seriously right now.

KGS allows you to chose which rules to use if you create a new match request ("custom game" button). If you join someone else's match request then you use the rules they have selected.

In the US and Europe, Japanese (territory) counting is more common.

The official USA (AGA) rules are actually much closer to chinese rules although they allow you to use territory or area counting mechanisms (with minor modifications to the territory counting to make it match area counting).

If you are a n00b, I can play some teach games with you. I was never very good but I can probably still teach you a few things.

PM if you want to play on KGS.

Yeah, the Sensei's Library website already mentioned, along with godiscussions.com are the two best social resources. The folks as godiscussions.com will be happy to talk go with you all day long.

Thanks all for the informative replies.

Had a quick browse of godiscussions.com (now Lifein19x19.com) and it looks good.

There's also the Ing rules, named after a Taiwanese businessman who donated $millions to Go. You both have exactly 180 pieces each, and instead of countiing territory you fill the empty spaces, and whoever has pieces left over loses.

I thought those were standard in ROC. No?

I tried searching for videos on youtube but I couldnt find any good ones. Are there any Go matches with commentary I could watch? I'm really interested in the game.

Thanks

ask on godiscussions.com.

Sensei's library probably has some references to (text) commented games.

Typical games last longer that football (soccer) matches. The Honinbo title alots 8 hours of playing time + byo-yomi per player. These games take 2 days to play. It would be quite boring to watch a Honinbo title match in action

Wow, I wasn't aware that matches take that long! haha incredible...

Thanks for the site, much appreciation.

What about the situation where you have an opportunity to turn a few dead stones into a long line through your opponents territory. You will still lose your line of stones but since he must put down twice as many stones to take them it seems there would be an advantage to making him fill up his own territory with his own stones.

I am happy to accept this is wrong but I just can't see why that is the case.

A line through your opponent's territory will only require placing stones on one side at most. You don't need to take the stones off to declare them prisoners. But there is a position seki where the scoring can be very different.

It is very rare that a sacrifice invasion will even gain 1 point. These plays tend to be where the life and death fight is very tight.

Not what I call action

The game that sounded most interesting was where the record states "black lost by an illegal move".

The illegal move was apparently black throwing the board on the floor!

Bump! Any Go players alive?

Just saw this.

Why would he have to put down twice as many stones as you? If the position is dead for you, he doesn't have to play any stones at all!

Only if you're trying to make them live, by playing your own stones, would he have to play back. And by you playing your stones, you're creating prisoners.

teach chinese (area) counting and this n00b fallacy is completely side stepped.

Add Ikeda's rule to traditional area scoring and the two rule sets (Ikeda area counting and japanese counting) give the same result in all but the rarest cases.


Heck, you can even switch to japanese counting when you know enough to know why OP's statement is wrong.

The game is really about market share (controlling more than 50% of the board) not capturing. Area scoring makes this more obvious to the uninitiated.

I like area counting.

Though I remember on KGS, I'd be accused of cheating by people who wouldn't pay attention to what rules were in place, and would pass instead of filling in.

if you would pass with japanese rules, you CAN end the game without filling dame without affecting the outcome. The final score will not add up to 361 but if you are not counting on a real board by hand that is not a problem.

Yup. But the way people would flip out was just crazy. Part of what eventually pushed me away from KGS.