Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game

12-07-2014 , 04:25 AM
Spoiler:
kinda weird how he analyzed one line out 5 moves and came to a conclusion but then the next (and best) line with 10.g4 he just stopped after a move and a half and was just like "my king is airy" but doesn't look at the space edge, the fact that black doesn't have any good way of opening the position to get at the white king, and the kingside initiative that white has in the resulting position. then there's the fact that if he had played Nc3 at a time that was more reasonable instead of waiting so long and still having it on its home square, then it wouldn't even be an issue. so here, instead of playing Nc3 to remove the Bxb1 option so that he can get some g4 action in that's more to his liking, he plays b3?? i don't get it.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-07-2014 , 07:36 AM
1. e4 Nf6 2. e5 Nd5 3. d4 d6 4. Nf3 dxe5 5. Nxe5 c6 6. c4 Nf6 7. Be2 Bf5 8. O-O Nbd7 9. f4 e6 10. b3 c5



Conditional moves:
Spoiler:
If 11. Bb2, then 11... Qb6.
If 11. d5, then 11... exd5.
If 11. Nxd7, then 11... Qxd7.
If 11. dxc5, then 11... Bxc5+.

I have to sleep now and then play a ton of poker tonight, so I'll leave only brief comments for now and elaborate when I have more spare time (ganstaman is of course welcome to make a move in the meantime).
Spoiler:
Hmm, 10. b3 looks too slow, moreover, it denies a4 to his own queen. I think that, after my 10... c5, 11. Bb2 is more or less forced (my follow-up will be 11... Qb6, adding pressure along the a7-g1 diagonal). Anyway, White can't take on c5 immediately at move 11 - after the obvious 11... Bxc5+ 12. Kh1, I believe I have a tactic that I'll leave for you to find as a (much easier) puzzle #2.



Regarding puzzle #1, I don't want to spend time on writing lines out as said above; a caveat is that, as it turns out, White isn't 'totally winning' in the critical line, but just transitions to an endgame that I think is won, though I need to spend a bit more time to find the most precise moves 'proving' it.

So I'll put off announcing solutions to both puzzles until some further time, especially because some of you might have thought that the moves you've found aren't a 'solution' because they're not crushing.

In general, it's funny that my 4... dxe5 and 5... c6 have set up an 'eclectic opening' that is far from Alekhine's but a kind of a Slav Caro whose pawn structure resembled the Panov attack (but with an undeveloped b1 knight) until now.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-07-2014 , 08:00 AM
Spoiler:
Quote:
Originally Posted by coon74

I think that, after my 10... c5, 11. Bb2 is more or less forced (my follow-up will be 11... Qb6, adding pressure along the a7-g1 diagonal).
11. Bb2 cxd4 12. Bxd4 Bc5 and Black gets off easy. 11. d5 should be a lot better, maybe even winning; I've seen positions like this turn out to be like +2.0.

Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-07-2014 , 10:06 AM
Spoiler:
Yeah it's weird that Black didn't consider d5 at all before playing c5. This is pretty much the only move you have to consider in such a position because everything else is obviously fine for Black. after c5 d5 exd5 exd5 Bd6 Bb2 the position looks promising for White - at any rate the onus is on Black to justify his play.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-07-2014 , 01:39 PM
Spoiler:
yeah, very weird to consider Bb2 is "more or less forced" when it plays into Black's hands.

maybe he is relying on d5 ed5 ed5 Nxe5?? fxe5 Nxd5?? but Bb5+ would be quite the rude awakening
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-07-2014 , 08:33 PM
Spoiler:
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundTower
Spoiler:
yeah, very weird to consider Bb2 is "more or less forced" when it plays into Black's hands.

maybe he is relying on d5 ed5 ed5 Nxe5?? fxe5 Nxd5?? but Bb5+ would be quite the rude awakening
or just Rxf5 at the end of that.

Yeah, d5 definitely seems critical and seems pretty crushing tbh. I don't like c5 at all, I think it's just too early.

I haven't checked all the commentary carefully, but has coon74 thought about playing h5 at any point? I think some sort h5--g6--Bg7 (potentially Ne4--other knight to f6 too) is pretty much the only viable setup he had, since leaving that g4 option available for white looks suicidal. Then maaaaaybe at some later stage he could have started thinking about breaking through with c5.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-08-2014 , 12:12 AM
I was busy today and just injured my knee playing soccer. Will hopefully move within 24 hours of this post. Will hopefully be walking again sooner than that, but we'll see.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-08-2014 , 12:19 AM
I'm sorry to hear about your injury , get well soon!

Take as much time as you need, we're obviously not in any hurry.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-08-2014 , 01:04 AM
excuses!
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-08-2014 , 01:28 AM
^ Don't worry, I haven't forgotten that I'm owing detailed comments on the latest move, just there are things that are a bit more important than a hobby chess game, and I might put the explanation off until Tuesday night unless I have enough energy tomorrow.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-08-2014 , 11:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by coon74
I'm sorry to hear about your injury , get well soon!

Take as much time as you need, we're obviously not in any hurry.
Thanks, seems I 'just' sprained my MCL, so I've got a brace and am on crutches for a little bit, but am otherwise supposed to heal up just fine without further intervention.

Now, back to the chess in a moment, and I'll make my self-imposed 24 hour deadline.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-08-2014 , 11:48 PM
Spoiler:
Ah, it does seem smart to play ...c5 at this point instead of after ...Nxe5. I'm not liking this as much for me now. I could continue as planned, meeting ...c5 with d5, but it's just not the same without my f-pawn moved to e5 first: 11. d5 exd5 12. cxd5 Nb6 13. Bb5+ Bd7 14. Nxd7 N(b or f?)xd7 15. Re1+ e7 16. d6 and actually, this does look good (assuming the position looks like what I think it does). I'm actually struggling to find ways for Black to improve upon this. If 11. d5 Be7, then 12. d6 could be interesting but I imagine I'll eventually lose that pawn so 12. Nc3 might be better --11. d5 Be7 12. Nc3 O-O and I really want to play 13. g4, but 13. Bf3 might be better.

Well, when you see a good move, look for something better, right? Eh, too tired to type all my thoughts, but I looked at:
1) 11. Ba3 cxd4 12. Bxf1 Nxf1 and that d-pawn looks like it will be very annoying.
2) 11. Bb2 cxd4 12. Bxd4 Bc5 looks ok, but I feel a little nervous about it in that it seems to allow Black to solve some of his cramping and his centralized king without giving me anything. It would be my back-up if I felt uncomfortable with everything else.


1. e4 Nf6 2. e5 Nd5 3. d4 d6 4. Nf3 dxe5 5. Nxe5 c6 6. c4 Nf6 7. Be2 Bf5 8. O-O Nbd7 9. f4 e6 10. b3 c5 11. d5

Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 12:00 AM
Conditional move triggered:

coon74 plays 11. ... exd5

I'm not going to try to figure out how to post a diagram from my phone...
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 12:02 AM
Spoiler:
Calculation a bit sloppy, but still the decision is correct so what the hell. After d5 Be7 Nc3 0-0 white would just win a piece with d6 I think now exd5 cxd5 Bd6 is pretty much forced for black, but it still looks rather ugly..
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 12:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobJoeJim
Conditional move triggered:

coon74 plays 11. ... exd5
Spoiler:
Well I don't really have a choice at the moment, so onwards with my analysis!


1. e4 Nf6 2. e5 Nd5 3. d4 d6 4. Nf3 dxe5 5. Nxe5 c6 6. c4 Nf6 7. Be2 Bf5 8. O-O Nbd7 9. f4 e6 10. b3 c5 11. d5 exd5 12. cxd5

Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 10:32 AM
Spoiler:
Of course d5 and e5 are untouchable now - after 12... Nxe5?? 13. fxe5, two pieces are hanging. I'll make a developing move Bd6, with a small idea to meet 13. g4 by 13... Nxe5 that spoils White's pawn structure because otherwise White loses the exchange and a pawn (for a compensation - my exposed king) - 14. fxe5? Bxe5 15. Rxf5 Bxa1 16. Bb5+, I can maybe even move the king to e7-d6 to avoid cutting the h-rook off, though that does sound risky.

White can play 13. Bb2 followed by g4 anyway, but I'm not sure if he's gonna expose his king that much.

Pieces coming to b5 is smth I shd watch out for; but if 13. Nc3, I'm gonna hide my DSB to b8 - 13... Rc8 14. Nb5 Bb8.

Sorry for the brevity, I have to sleep & play poker again tonight, but I do remember about my 'debts'.

1. e4 Nf6 2. e5 Nd5 3. d4 d6 4. Nf3 dxe5 5. Nxe5 c6 6. c4 Nf6 7. Be2 Bf5 8. O-O Nbd7 9. f4 e6 10. b3 c5 11. d5 exd5 12. cxd5 Bd6



Conditional moves:
Spoiler:
If 13. Bb2, then 13... O-O.
If 13. Nc3, then 13... Rc8 14. Nb5 Bb8.
If 13. Bb5, then 13... a6.
If 13. Nxd7, then 13... Qxd7.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 07:50 PM
Spoiler:
I feel like at least one of those moves loses the bishop to a g4 trick
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 09:03 PM
Spoiler:
Conditional moves:

Spoiler:
13. Qc2 Ke7 14. Qd3 Bb8 15. Qe4 Kd6 16. Qb4 Kc7 17. Qb6+ Kc8 18. Qc7+ Black resigns




Spoiler:
The conditional lines sort of look like that at times.

13. Nc3 Rc8 14. Nb5 seems like a triple ?!. But of course, gansta really shouldn't play 13. Nc3, a fact that might save c00n from the fancy new toy.

I think both players have been relying too much on abstraction, not digging into the meat of the concrete possibilities.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 10:02 PM
Spoiler:
It's hard to understand the line Nc3 Rc8. It's not even that Rc8 is bad, it's more that Nc3 only makes sense if White has something after Nxe5 fxe5 Bxe5 - maybe White has something here, but even so, if you're checking Nc3, you have to look at this line first.

It's okay if you consider Nxe5 and decide that Rc8 is better, but to consider Rc8 without analyzing Nxe5 at all is a fundamental error.

Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-09-2014 , 10:17 PM
Spoiler:
both white and black are slightly worse imo
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-10-2014 , 05:57 PM
Spoiler:
Another reasonable move that I somehow did not see. First thought is to play 13. Bb2 to support e5. Then, if 13...Nb6 14. Nc4 might be helpful, though 14. Bb5 might be best. On 13...O-O 14. Bf3 Nb6 15. a4 a5 16. Na3 Bxe5 17. fxe5 Nfxd5 and I believe I lose a pawn so either 14. Bf3 or 13. Bb2 is wrong for me. Perhaps then (13. Bb2 O-O) 14. Bc4 Be4 15. Nc3 I think is fine, though visualizing all these minor pieces moving is harder than usual, for some reason. (13. Bb2 O-O 14. Bc4) Bxb1 15. Rxb1 Nb6 16. Ng4? saves the pawn? If I play Bc4 and he plays ...a6 at some point, I should respond with a4.

Let me try 13. Bb5 O-O 14. Bxd7:
a) 14...Nxd7 15. Bb2, and while there are many possibilities, it seems to me that I hold the d-pawn.
b) 14...Bxd7 15. Nxd7 Qxd7 16. Nc3 Nf6 17. Qd3 Rad8 18. Rd1 and I believe
the d-pawn holds again.

These 13. Bb5 positions are slightly clearer in my head, but they seem very defensive/passive. The 13. Bb2 line, while I'm less sure I'm seeing it correctly, seems more active. I feel that I underperform in these Malkovich games, and I'm not sure why. Possibly I'm so used to playing CC online with a board to move things around as I haven't played live in a long long time, or maybe somehow explaining my thoughts makes me do things I'd usually not do, I don't know.

Eh, let's consider another move. 13. Nc4 Nb6 14. Nc3 O-O 15. Bf3 and it's hard not to like this position a bit more than the above. I'm holding onto my pawns and getting my pieces onto good squares. So let's try other moves for Black. 13. Nc4 Qc7 14. Nc3 a6 15. a4 O-O also seems nice to me. I feel like before I had rejected 13. Nc4, but I think I was trying 13. Nc4 Nb6 14. Nxb6 and that didn't seem to work out as well. I guess 13. Nc4 works since it allows me to not play Bb2 to protect e5, so it doesn't waste a move and take away a defender of f4. It then also allows me to get in Nc3 so I can have adequate defenders of d5 and get the knight active. So I'll go with that.


1. e4 Nf6 2. e5 Nd5 3. d4 d6 4. Nf3 dxe5 5. Nxe5 c6 6. c4 Nf6 7. Be2 Bf5 8. O-O Nbd7 9. f4 e6 10. b3 c5 11. d5 exd5 12. cxd5 Bd6 13. Nc4

Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-10-2014 , 07:18 PM
Spoiler:
My one comment on ganstaman's thought processes is that he tends to look at long variations that are not at all forcing. For example he rejects Bb2 because of 13...O-O 14. Bf3 Nb6 15. a4 a5 16. Na3 Bxe5 17. fxe5 Nfxd5 - however both sides have multiple alternatives on every move - 14.Nc3/ Na3/ g4/ Nc4 etc.

That being said, I think his choice of Nc4 is a good move, possibly even better than Bb2.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-10-2014 , 09:55 PM
Spoiler:
I dunno, the position after Gansta's intended 13..Nb6 14. Nc3 0-0 15.Bf3 just seems absolutely fine for black to me. Take on c4, play Qd7 to stop g4, one rook probably to the e-file, another one to the b-file and maybe even plan a6-b5 (note how b1 square is taken by the bishop on f5). I don't see any advantages for white there, his protected passer is blocked and all he has are weaknesses all around the place. White has to look for something more than that I think.
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-10-2014 , 11:04 PM
Spoiler:
I don't like multiple, short comments after my move. Makes me think I screwed up
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote
12-10-2014 , 11:19 PM
Alas, I'm in a terrible mental shape, have hung a piece in a totally won corr endgame, so I think I have to extend the break by a few days (as there's no time control) to avoid disappointing you all by an early blunder here.

Spoiler:
It's time to post the promised 'solutions', though.

Puzzle #2



1... Nxe5 (zwischenzug / clearance) 2. fxe5 Bd4 3. exf6 Bxa1 4. fxg7 Bxg7.

Puzzle #1



1. Bh5 (threatening Nc6+, Nxf7) Nxe5 2. Rxe5+ Be7 (2... Be6 3. cxd5 Nxd5 (3... g6 4. Bf3) 4. f5 g6 5. fxe6 gxh5 6. exf7++, and d5 is hanging) 3. Rxf5 g6 4. Rxf6 Bxf6 5. Bf3 (x-raying b7) dxc4 6. Qe2+ (to deflect the queen from the d-file and the Qd1+ threat) Qe7 (6... Be7 7. Bxb7) 7. Qxe7+ Kxe7 8. Bxb7 Rb8 9. Ba6 Bxb2 (9... Rhd8 10. Nc3 Rb4 11. a3) 10. Bxb2 Rxb2 11. Bxc4, White has two pieces (with a bishop pair) for a rook (and sometimes a pawn), should win despite a slight lag in the Q-side development.

That's all for tonight; I'll put the explanation of my thoughts about the 9... c5 even further, to have smth to talk about tmrw.

It's frustrating that I keep mispredicting White's replies, forgetting those options in the pre-analysis
Ganstaman vs coon74 Malkovich game Quote

      
m