2016 WCC Discussion Thread - Page 5 - Chess and Board Game Strategy

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11-23-2016 , 07:00 PM

#101

coon74

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 10,684

The 1st time control has passed, Sergey didn't go for 39. Qb3 in mutual time trouble but 39. Bxf7+ is still good enough for him to be much better.

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11-23-2016 , 07:09 PM

#102

buffyslayer1

Coach MTT

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,552

^^^for a human finding the best reponse g5 is also really tough. I would not be suprised if Sergey didn't see it as the reponse so rejected qb3 as being inferior.

He did spend about 25 minutes on the move also so was probably weighing up those two options.

Magnus certainly on the ropes and I feel like this is probably the 1st time he has ever been under real pressure during a wc match or maybe even in his career.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

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11-23-2016 , 09:00 PM

#103

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

Karjakin's got this. Carlsen is so shook it's not even funny.

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11-23-2016 , 11:09 PM

#104

brrrrr

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 4,371

Quote:

Originally Posted by All-inMcLovin

Karjakin's got this. Carlsen is so shook it's not even funny.

but naahhh. carlsen has two chances with white.

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11-23-2016 , 11:25 PM

#105

coon74

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 10,684

Magnus's chance to win the match is yet much bigger than the chance of Houdini 5 to beat Stockfish 8 in the TCEC season 9 superfinal (the score is 28.5:22.5 in SF's favour and 49 games are left).

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11-24-2016 , 03:03 AM

#106

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

Quote:

Originally Posted by brrrrr

but naahhh. carlsen has two chances with white.

Yeah so he can waste those whites with the Zuckertort.

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11-24-2016 , 12:40 PM

#107

coon74

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Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 10,684

I've recently come to a sad conclusion that 1. Nf3 is objectively worse than 1. d4. However, the 1. Nf3 systems with c4 but no early d4 (that often involve a fianchetto on b2) can be decent surprise weapons if Black is unprepared. I have less respect for the way Magnus used the early Nf3 in his lost game, i.e. the Colle transposition - with d4 and e3 but without c4, which can also be achieved by the move order 1. Nf3 d5 2. d4 Nf6 3. e3. White's dark-square bishop is notoriously bad in the Colle unless White fianchettoes it and releases the central tension with dxc5 like Magnus did.

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11-24-2016 , 03:10 PM

#108

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

1. Nf3 b6!

Then play a hedgehog and Black is already slightly better.

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11-24-2016 , 03:44 PM

#109

coon74

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...unless White counters with 2. g3

Meanwhile...

I didn't know that Pokerstars Baard is decent at chess. I wish he were so good at his main job.

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11-24-2016 , 05:09 PM

#110

sixfour

should be called sevenfour

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 75,238

Karjakin using waaaaaay too much time imo

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11-24-2016 , 06:04 PM

#111

buffyslayer1

Coach MTT

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 5,552

Why didn't Sergey take the perpetual? He surely saw it right?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

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11-24-2016 , 06:06 PM

#112

coon74

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Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 10,684

Yeah, I'm also puzzled about his 30-minute tank over the 15... c6 move. After that, both GMs are being imprecise, maybe too tired by the match already.

Apparently, Sergey wants blood instead of an easy perpetual. Even if he fails to win, he'll tire Magnus out, which will be useful in the last 2 rounds.

On a side note, I confess that my main reason to listen to the c24 stream is the way Gustafsson says "tschat" and Svidler says "cal'culation".

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11-24-2016 , 08:36 PM

#113

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

Quote:

Originally Posted by buffyslayer1

Why didn't Sergey take the perpetual? He surely saw it right?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Where was the perpetual?

Edit: Oh 21.. Nxf2+ 22. Kg2 Qf7 23. Kg1 Qf6 24. Kg2

Yep. Karjakin is a fool for not going for that.

A straight up FOOL. He spent 8 minutes on that move too.

Last edited by All-inMcLovin; 11-24-2016 at 08:46 PM.

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11-24-2016 , 08:47 PM

#114

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

Quote:

Originally Posted by coon74

...unless White counters with 2. g3

Nah, Black is still slightly better there as White's fianchetto is blocked while Black's is not.

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11-24-2016 , 09:32 PM

#115

TimTimSalabim

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Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 14,660

Magnus GOAT

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11-24-2016 , 09:32 PM

#116

coon74

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Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 10,684

Quote:

Originally Posted by All-inMcLovin

Yep. Karjakin is a fool for not going for that.

A straight up FOOL. He spent 8 minutes on that move too.

Yeah, the only question remaining about this game is whether Karjakin will participate in the press conference after the seconds tell him that he was a fool.

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11-24-2016 , 09:41 PM

#117

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

Quote:

Originally Posted by coon74

Yeah, the only question remaining about this game is whether Karjakin will participate in the press conference after the seconds tell him that he was a fool.

Straight truth homie.

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11-24-2016 , 09:43 PM

#118

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

I am spectacularly bad at chess, but I've seen every broadcast (mostly).

Jan and Svidler, especially Svidler, are hilarious.

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11-24-2016 , 10:32 PM

#119

The Yugoslavian

STTF HUC II Winner

Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 25,110

Goat gonna goat. They both are making "clear" mistakes though. So this could simply come down to who makes the last one.

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11-24-2016 , 10:50 PM

#120

Yeti

Abominable

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 23,208

Quote:

Originally Posted by All-inMcLovin

Where was the perpetual?

Edit: Oh 21.. Nxf2+ 22. Kg2 Qf7 23. Kg1 Qf6 24. Kg2

Yep. Karjakin is a fool for not going for that.

A straight up FOOL. He spent 8 minutes on that move too.

he didn't see it

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11-25-2016 , 12:11 AM

#121

All-inMcLovin

Wholesome Mod

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 51,576

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yeti

he didn't see it

Woah, color me surprised.

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11-25-2016 , 01:01 AM

#122

HelloFriends

adept

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,121

"Poker player wins game 10 in Chess Championship."
"Poker player wins chess marathon."
"Online rec player tied for the chess bracelet."

In an alternative universe it could be like this in Norwegian news.

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11-25-2016 , 02:02 AM

#123

HelloFriends

adept

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,121

Not sure if mentioned, but the total prize is 1.1m USD. Winner gets 60%. Chainsaw is rolling in his grave.

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11-25-2016 , 11:16 AM

#124

YouKnowWho

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 6,985

How can anyone in their right mind think that Karjakin saw that perpetual and didn't go for it?

Did you follow this match...? He was going for draws in semi-winning positions ffs!

Had he seen it, he would have went for it faster than Hellmuth snap calls pf with AA.

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11-25-2016 , 12:52 PM

#125

Melkerson

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Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 11,246

Quote:

Originally Posted by All-inMcLovin

Where was the perpetual?

Edit: Oh 21.. Nxf2+ 22. Kg2 Qf7 23. Kg1 Qf6 24. Kg2

Yep. Karjakin is a fool for not going for that.

A straight up FOOL. He spent 8 minutes on that move too.

I suck at chess and I still can't figure out how your line leads to a draw.
After 22. Kg2 Qf7, what happens if white plays 23. Rxf2 or even 23. Qxf2.

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