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I dont understand this type of position

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11-02-2010 , 06:09 PM

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

http://bildr.no/view/750762

Wops. I see Ive forgot to click "crawford game" in my GNU-edit. The GNU-id is:Position ID: bNsGhQDIWRiANw

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11-02-2010 , 06:10 PM

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

I also dont remember if I can post these type of URLs on 2+2 forums? Im too stupid to figure out how to embed the picture into the post it seems.

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11-02-2010 , 06:51 PM

uberkuber

veteran

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,032

I would hit twice with 13/11* and 9/7* and cover in the home board with 6/4. As for the other deuce, I don't know. Probably 13/11 again to create a blocking point and eliminate 2 blots.

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11-02-2010 , 09:50 PM

geneftw

enthusiast

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 98

Blue's lost. If I were Blue, though, I'd try to start building a prime and hitting Red every chance I get in an attempt to slow him down and avoid a gammon against me. Who knows...With a lot of luck, the game could turn.

I'd play 13/7 hittin' two o' dem suckers and 6/4.

No. On second thought, I'd just click "New Game."

This would make a great Problem of the Week!

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11-02-2010 , 10:45 PM

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

Quote:

Originally Posted by geneftw

This would make a great Problem of the Week!

Its an actual position from a game between two of the better Norwegian players last week. The position gives me a headache and I cant really get my head around it properly. I would play 6/2 6/4(2) trying to maintain maximum timing, but I feel this is not the best way to do that. Which is also why I feel I dont understand the position properly and was hoping Mr.Robertie had a better idea then me.

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11-03-2010 , 01:47 AM

Taper_Mike

adept

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,030

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bjornar

I also dont remember if I can post these type of URLs on 2+2 forums?

Here's the method I copied from another poster:

How to Post an Image to the Backgammon Forum

alt + print screen of the gnu board.
paste image into mspaint, crop and save as jpg (to desktop is easiest imo)
go to www.imageshack.com on the web, hit browse there and find the image you just saved on your desktop and upload it. imageshack will create a link which you can then post here using the "insert image" icon.

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11-03-2010 , 11:09 AM

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

I guess bildr is not the place to go to do this. Ill have to surrender and try Imageshack I guess.

[IMG]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/IMG]

Last edited by Bjornar; 11-03-2010 at 11:14 AM.

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11-03-2010 , 11:16 AM

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

I guess I got it to function. Now I only have to understand how to make smaller screenshots. LOL. I dont have an intention of experimenting on this forum but Im trying to get places with this.

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11-03-2010 , 02:13 PM

Taper_Mike

adept

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,030

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bjornar

Now I only have to understand how to make smaller screenshots.

One easy way is to double-click the GNUBG title bar so that it runs in a window rather than in full-screen mode. Then you can resize the window before pressing Alt+PrintScreen to copy it.

Good luck!

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11-03-2010 , 02:23 PM

#10

Taper_Mike

adept

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,030

The hara-kiri play is usually recommended only for those positions where you can easily escape into the outfield with the checkers that get hit. Against a prime, letting your opponent hit you six times is a prescription for losing a gammon or backgammon.

Here, you might be advised to surrender the game, and work to save the gammon. Your chances are slim, even for that.

I would hit twice: 13/11*/7*, 6/4. You might luck out, and force your opponent to crack, but you shouldn't take too many chances trying to make it happen.

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11-03-2010 , 02:51 PM

#11

RealNick

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 217

I think 13/11* 11/7* 6/4 is the correct play but I'm not 100% sure... keeping contact with his last outfield blot while hes got two on the bar. 13/11*(2) 9/7* 6/4 also looks good cleaning up your position a little more but passing on his outfield blot.

Thematically speaking you need to try to prime him asap in order to get him to break his prime. that's your only winning game plan.

I too would like to hear Robertie's take on this...

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11-03-2010 , 03:21 PM

#12

RealNick

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 217

I think 13/11*/7* 6/4 is the correct play but I'm not 100% sure... keeping contact with his last outfield blot while hes got two on the bar. 13/11*(2) 9/7* 6/4 also looks good cleaning up your position a little more but passing on his outfield blot.

Thematically speaking you need to try to prime him asap in order to get him to break his prime. that's your only winning game plane.

I too would like to hear Robertie's take on this...

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11-03-2010 , 03:41 PM

#13

Robertie

old hand

Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,954

Very interesting position. As someone suggested, I'm going to play with this a little bit and use this (maybe with a variation or two) as the Problem of the Week next week. Thanks for posting it.

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11-03-2010 , 07:09 PM

#14

uberkuber

veteran

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,032

Bill, if you post it with some variation(s), even minor, in an eventual problem of the week, could you then comment on the original position posted here? Maybe those minor variations will lead to a different solution or at least different considerations, who knows?

P.S. I didn't mean to comment right now, it can be when you will give the solution to the eventual problem.

Last edited by uberkuber; 11-03-2010 at 07:10 PM. Reason: P.S. added

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11-03-2010 , 09:00 PM

#15

Taper_Mike

adept

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,030

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bjornar

I see Ive forgot to click "crawford game" in my GNU-edit. The GNU-id is:Position ID: bNsGhQDIWRiANw

At DMP, the same play (13/11*/7*, 6/4) is the way to go. Afterwards, you can try to hit the third checker, and force your opponent to crack. With no gammon price to be paid, you can take a few risks along the way, including loose hits on the blots that are threatening to get away.

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11-03-2010 , 10:17 PM

#16

Aaron W.

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 30,132

I suck at backgames.

That being said, I don't see any value in hitting anything at all. You're not going to trap checkers very well with only 9 checkers, so don't you *want* your opponent to keep moving forward so that 6-prime will have to crack?

My play would be to shuffle checkers around without hitting, so something like 8/4(2).

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11-03-2010 , 10:20 PM

#17

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

I discuss backgammon with a female friend of mine that is one of the better female backgammon players in Norway. She has a different take to this position but since it is going to be a problem of the week(thanks a lot for that Robertie!) I now get a world champions take on the position in a week or two time. Looking forward to it.

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11-03-2010 , 10:26 PM

#18

Bjornar

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,969

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron W.

I suck at backgames too. I would play 6/2 6/4(2) but Ive been convinced that cant be right. Hence why I post the position and headline the thread the way I do.

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11-03-2010 , 10:39 PM

#19

BogusPomp

newbie

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bjornar

I suck at backgames too. I would play 6/2 6/4(2) but Ive been convinced that cant be right. Hence why I post the position and headline the thread the way I do.

You can throw me in the camp that believes any move that does not hit has got to be better than any move that does. Timing is everything here, imo.

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11-04-2010 , 07:56 AM

#20

loveinvain

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 2,143

These kinds of decisions make my head hurt.

I think 9/7/5 and 6/2 is worthy of consideration the idea being to try to get on the bar and maybe gain some timing. If not than 8/4(2). Hitting hoping to get him to crack is close to hopeless IMO.

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11-04-2010 , 08:34 AM

#21

MordellWeil

newbie

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 33

9/7*/5 6/2 by a mile for me.

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11-04-2010 , 08:59 AM

#22

MordellWeil

newbie

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 33

Quote:

Originally Posted by MordellWeil

9/7*/5 6/2 by a mile for me.

Had missed this was gammon save so here comea another for 8/4(2). I would never touch the midpoint as that is our reservoir of timing now.

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