Why is the Pope getting so much flack? - Religion, God, and Theology

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Why is the Pope getting so much flack?

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02-09-2009 , 04:21 AM

Stu Pidasso

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Pope lifts excommunication of holocaust denier

It seems to me that denying the Holocaust is purely a politcal matter. Excommunication is purely a religious matter. When did denying the holocaust become religious heresy?

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02-09-2009 , 04:28 AM

Bulletproof Monk

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he is a nazi iirc

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02-09-2009 , 04:37 AM

Stu Pidasso

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Originally Posted by Bulletproof Monk

he is a nazi iirc

Pope defied NAZIs as a teen.

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02-09-2009 , 04:43 AM

Claudius Galenus

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It's still a public relations nightmare, especially with the Pope having been in the Hitler Youth. Aside from that, it is a nightmare for Christian-Jewish relations. It is also a 180 degree departure from the Catholic Church's official viewpoint on the subject, which I'd guess is frowned upon for high-level Vatican appointees.

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02-11-2009 , 12:17 PM

Splendour

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Definitely the Vatican should be catching some flack over this.

Look at the Bishop's interview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHhdBzPH_zM

He's got to have a loose marble rolling around in his head. There were plenty of people who came out of the camps and soldiers from foreign nations who freed people from the camps that witnessed the conditions.

Also his point about the deadliness of the gas is true but the question really is about how tight the seals were in the chambers. The Nazis themselves forced Jews to be the workers in the camp so they didn't have to run any extraordinary risks around the gas chambers themselves.

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02-11-2009 , 12:48 PM

Hopey

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Originally Posted by Stu Pidasso

He wasn't excommunicated for being a holocaust denier, he just happens to be a holocaust denier who was excommunicated:

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In June 1988 Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre announced his intention to consecrate Williamson and three other priests as bishops. Lefebvre did not have a pontifical mandate for these consecrations (i.e. permission from the pope), normally required by Canon 1382 of the Code of Canon Law. On June 17, 1988 Cardinal Bernardin Gantin, prefect of the Congregation for Bishops sent Williamson a formal canonical warning that he would automatically incur the penalty of excommunication if he were ordained by Lefebvre without papal permission.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard...xcommunication

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02-11-2009 , 12:49 PM

Autocratic

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Aside from the obvious political stupidity of this move, I think people are concerned that the Pope seems to be trying to build bridges with the extreme right wing of Catholicism.

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02-11-2009 , 02:53 PM

Stu Pidasso

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Originally Posted by Hopey

He wasn't excommunicated for being a holocaust denier, he just happens to be a holocaust denier who was excommunicated:

Yes but people are saying his excommunication should not be lifted because he is a holocaust denier. That's equivalent to using the sanction to punish people who deny the holocaust.

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02-11-2009 , 03:05 PM

Splendour

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Originally Posted by Stu Pidasso

Yes but people are saying his excommunication should not be lifted because he is a holocaust denier. That's equivalent to using the sanction to punish people who deny the holocaust.

I think his position is bizarre but I don't think it should affect his excommunication status.

Whether it should affect his bishop status is another question. I haven't made up my mind on that.

You could argue that he's siding against the church because his stance denies biblical prophecy.

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02-11-2009 , 03:36 PM

#10

Hopey

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Originally Posted by Stu Pidasso

Yes but people are saying his excommunication should not be lifted because he is a holocaust denier. That's equivalent to using the sanction to punish people who deny the holocaust.

Which is probably why the pope lifted the excommunication despite the bishop's continued denial of the holocaust.

The people who are calling for the bishop to remain ex-communicated are doing so out of disgust for the man's beliefs, not out of any sort of knowledge as to what the criteria should be for someone to be excommunicated.

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