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Old 04-11-2019, 12:13 PM   #226
festeringZit
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeaucoupFish View Post
... polling a 0.2% subset of a general population is statistically irrelevant? Yes, THAT'S what I'm saying. As should you. As should the historian.


How do 0.2% of Muslims get around it, you mean...?
Upwards of a billion Muslims want Sharia law instituted. So, I'm not
sure where you get this .2% figure.


https://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/...iety-overview/


Some of the fun stuff that is in Sharia law:

• Theft is punishable by amputation of the hands (Quran 5:38).
• Criticizing or denying any part of the Quran is punishable by death.
• Criticizing Muhammad or denying that he is a prophet is punishable by death.
• Criticizing or denying Allah is punishable by death (see Allah moon god).
• A Muslim who becomes a non-Muslim is punishable by death (See Compulsion).
• A non-Muslim who leads a Muslim away from Islam is punishable by death.
• A non-Muslim man who marries a Muslim woman is punishable by death.
• A woman or girl who has been raped cannot testify in court against her rapist(s).
• Testimonies of 4 male witnesses are required to prove rape of a female (Quran 24:13).
• A woman or girl who alleges rape without producing 4 male witnesses is guilty of adultery.
• A woman or girl found guilty of adultery is punishable by death (see "Islamophobia").
• A male convicted of rape can have his conviction dismissed by marrying his victim.
• Muslim men have sexual rights to any woman/girl not wearing the Hijab (see Taharrush).
• A woman can have 1 husband, who can have up to 4 wives; Muhammad can have more.
• A man can marry an infant girl and consummate the marriage when she is 9 years old.
• Girls' clitoris should be cut (Muhammad's words, Book 41, Kitab Al-Adab, Hadith 5251).
• A man can beat his wife for insubordination (see Quran 4:34 and Religion of Peace).
• A man can unilaterally divorce his wife; a wife needs her husband's consent to divorce.
• A divorced wife loses custody of all children over 6 years of age or when they exceed it.
• A woman's testimony in court, allowed in property cases, carries ½ the weight of a man's.
• A female heir inherits half of what a male heir inherits (see Mathematics in Quran).
• A woman cannot speak alone to a man who is not her husband or relative.
• Meat to eat must come from animals that have been sacrificed to Allah - i.e., be "Halal."
• Muslims should engage in Taqiyya and lie to non-Muslims to advance Islam.
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Old 04-12-2019, 01:40 AM   #227
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

There is more then one version/interpretation of Sharia law. But you have been told this before and keep pushing misinformation so...
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Old 04-12-2019, 08:17 AM   #228
BeaucoupFish
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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Originally Posted by festeringZit View Post
Upwards of a billion Muslims want Sharia law instituted. So, I'm not

sure where you get this .2% figure.
The article Bill linked stated:

"90% of Muslim-Americans say that they are “proud to be American.” That doesn’t sound much like “hatred of the West."

Muslim-Americans make up .2% of all Muslims (so their being proud of being American says nothing about the overall Muslim population's views on the West, whatever it happened to be).
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Old 04-12-2019, 01:26 PM   #229
Bill Haywood
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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Originally Posted by festeringZit View Post

Some of the fun stuff that is in Sharia law:
This is only slightly more specific than "laws that have been passed on earth."

Would it be just as valid to characterize Judeo-Christianity by any rule that has ever existed in the west?
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Old 04-12-2019, 01:38 PM   #230
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

Zit, you think Sharia is one particular thing.

The largest and most long-lived Muslim polity was the Ottoman Empire, which was even a caliphate.

The Ottoman 1858 penal code legalized sodomy. Please explain how this premier example of Muslim law fits with your conception of Sharia.

From linked article:

Quote:
The Ottomans, who followed the flexible Hanafi school of jurisprudence, were pragmatic about law from the beginning. Decrees issued by sultans introduced fines or prison sentences instead of corporal punishments, rendering the latter often practically obsolete.
Note Britain was still castrating gays (chemically) in the 1950s, see: Alan Turing.
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Old 04-12-2019, 05:05 PM   #231
festeringZit
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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Originally Posted by batair View Post
There is more then one version/interpretation of Sharia law. But you have been told this before and keep pushing misinformation so...
Um, what "misinformation" did I push?
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Old 04-12-2019, 11:39 PM   #232
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

Saying definitively what sharia is when that is not what it is to many Muslims.

Like ive said before its also counter productive. You chose the harshest version of sharia and declare it sharia. How do you think that helps liberal Muslims fight the more extremes. If you are going to interpret their religion for them learn about liberal Islamic teachings and push those. At least then you would be helpful.

Last edited by batair; 04-12-2019 at 11:46 PM.
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Old 04-14-2019, 03:14 AM   #233
dex 1
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

I read the Sam Harris book from 2004 I think called THE END OF FAITH.

I do not see how anybody could disagree with what he has to say. Well, I do see how. People who have been brainwashed from birth and people that don't know how to do critical thinking.

I would highly recommend this book - as on point today as it was in 2004. I know the title Common Sense has been taken - but that title would work for the book by Harris as well.
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Old 04-14-2019, 11:04 AM   #234
Bill Haywood
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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Originally Posted by festeringZit View Post
Um, what "misinformation" did I push?
Is this how he always is? Toss around blood libel then not give a lick of justification?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dex 1 View Post
I read the Sam Harris book from 2004 I think called THE END OF FAITH.

I do not see how anybody could disagree with what he has to say.
I believe this is one of two threads that show in detail Harris' shortcomings. We've looked mainly at his ill informed chapter on Islam. You might start with the quick Juan Cole articles linked above. Cole is a specialist, while Harris has no language skills, did no interviews, and did not visit Arabia. He simply does not know what he is talking about.
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Old 04-14-2019, 11:47 AM   #235
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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Originally Posted by dex 1 View Post
I do not see how anybody could disagree with what he has to say. Well, I do see how. People who have been brainwashed from birth and people that don't know how to do critical thinking.
This exact same line is one that flat earthers use to justify their beliefs. You may want to try to do better.
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Old 04-14-2019, 06:07 PM   #236
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

This I appreciated and can only give pause;

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/qant...uslim-religion
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Old 04-14-2019, 06:36 PM   #237
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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This I appreciated and can only give pause;



https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/qant...uslim-religion
In what way is Ilhan Omar an Islamist? She is Muslim and a politician, but mainly AFAIK supports mostly progressive policies which most Islamists oppose.
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Old 04-15-2019, 07:40 AM   #238
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

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In what way is Ilhan Omar an Islamist? She is Muslim and a politician, but mainly AFAIK supports mostly progressive policies which most Islamists oppose.
OK
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Old 04-15-2019, 10:57 AM   #239
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

Does it give you any pause labeling her an extremist when the right doing that puts her in danger?
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:53 AM   #240
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

Everyone is full of fight; the piece was the honest considerations of a Muslim, as to how she saw 9/11 and other events. She wasn't in denial and I appreciated that, not so much any disparagement of another.

She also appreciates what our country has accomplished with respect to Muslims as compared to the difficulties Muslims are having in Europe. I was also happy to hear some one say ( a Muslim), that our country is doing some good in this realm .

The dyscrasia fostered out of the political forces of the deceit of power(s) is enervating to the average man (from the center of the earth) and the "boys in the band" refuse to see it.

As to my " give one pause", it was unclear, obviously, and so I'll try to do it better. I noted the antipathies to the Muslim in the thread and felt it would be good to reference a Muslim offering good thoughts, and in my mind, as a true human being.

It doesn't mean the difficulties will go away because a "wand has been waved" but any morsel helps.

A long while back I was reading investment advice from a stock market guru whose name I have forgotten, who also offered some social meanderings in a homily way. He offered that the human being, Man, will have to change his very being in in order to emerge from the morass( realized or unrealized) of the times.

He said (wrote) it in such a manner that one could feel the heart felt warmth within the words that they became alive in one's soul and so never forgotten.

A story of Christ Jesus as He and his disciples walked by a dead decomposing dog to which the disciples treated with a dismissive contempt while He expressed wonder at the glisten of the shining teeth that lay before them within the corpse of that dog.
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Old 04-15-2019, 12:52 PM   #241
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Re: The Sam Harris interview from Salon

Guess not. People like trump are going to get her killed. You should be more worried about their words then hers.
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