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Official Annihilationist VS Eternal Torment Thread Official Annihilationist VS Eternal Torment Thread

07-31-2010 , 02:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
I want to be there when you try that with God, only not standing real close to you.
so you want to see god destroy him with a fireball or something?
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07-31-2010 , 03:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Butcho22
so you want to see god destroy him with a fireball or something?
Has nothing to do with what I want.
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07-31-2010 , 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
Has nothing to do with what I want.
Sure sounds like a loving god to me!
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07-31-2010 , 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
Has nothing to do with what I want.
riiiiight, but you made it sound like you wanted to be there to watch the show.
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07-31-2010 , 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Butcho22
riiiiight, but you made it sound like you wanted to be there to watch the show.
You and Arouet got zero sense of humor.
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07-31-2010 , 10:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
You and Arouet got zero sense of humor.
Seriously, I thought that was a pretty obvious joke.
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07-31-2010 , 10:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
You and Arouet got zero sense of humor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jibninjas
Seriously, I thought that was a pretty obvious joke.
Maybe, but it was semi-joking at best. I got the humour, but the underlying message was still there.
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07-31-2010 , 11:01 AM
You'll have to excuse me if i can't spot humor from someone who claims to believe a man rose from the dead. If God is being discussed, I have no reason to assume humor without a smiley face at the end of a dry statement such as NR's itt.
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07-31-2010 , 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
I want to be there when you try that with God, only not standing real close to you.
My question should be among the easiest to answer, assuming religious language in fact has some relevance to real life.

So why is it so difficult for you?
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07-31-2010 , 11:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subfallen
My question should be among the easiest to answer, assuming religious language in fact has some relevance to real life.

So why is it so difficult for you?
It seems like you are changing the subject you were on some how.
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07-31-2010 , 11:46 AM
My subject remains: how do I tell if I reject God?
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07-31-2010 , 11:52 AM
How about looking at the word "reject":

•refuse to accept or acknowledge; "I reject the idea of starting a war"; "The journal rejected the student's paper"
•refuse: refuse to accept; "He refused my offer of hospitality"
•disapprove: deem wrong or inappropriate; "I disapprove of her child rearing methods"
•reject with contempt; "She spurned his advances"
•resist: resist immunologically the introduction of some foreign tissue or organ; "His body rejected the liver of the donor"
•refuse entrance or membership; "They turned away hundreds of fans"; "Black people were often rejected by country clubs"
•rule out: dismiss from consideration or a contest; "John was ruled out as a possible suspect because he had a strong alibi"; "This possibility can be eliminated from our consideration"
•cull: the person or thing that is rejected or set aside as inferior in quality

Now I don't totally buy into the idea that you are rejecting God...It appears to humans that you are because we judge by appearances, by your actions and your statements.

Only God can judge you on the state of your heart.

That's why I find the psychological angle worthy of studying. What can influence someone's heart? Isn't the subconscious a very powerful hidden force? Can't we all be influenced by hidden and submerged things from our past?

On top of that you have to realize that the biblical heart isn't the physical heart. Though I suspect there is an interplay between the two because the spiritual and physical are always interrelated.

The biblical heart is the mind, the will, the emotions and the conscience.
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07-31-2010 , 11:56 AM
wat
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07-31-2010 , 03:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arouet
but the underlying message was still there.

Of course, that Sub is in trouble if he continues to reject God, and I meant it.
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07-31-2010 , 04:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
Of course, that Sub is in trouble if he continues to reject God, and I meant it.
I just don't get how a being so superior, so magnificent, so perfect ostensibly would put so much importance on being accepted and worshiped. Why would such a being care about glory? What need would such a being have for glory? Especially since it didn't do anything special to be so awesome, it just always was that way.

The fact that our less than a century on this earth would have such profound effects on our future prospects for eternity again is hard for me to reconcile with such a being - at least if that being has our best interests at heart.
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07-31-2010 , 05:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arouet
I just don't get how a being so superior, so magnificent, so perfect ostensibly would put so much importance on being accepted and worshiped. Why would such a being care about glory? What need would such a being have for glory? Especially since it didn't do anything special to be so awesome, it just always was that way.

The fact that our less than a century on this earth would have such profound effects on our future prospects for eternity again is hard for me to reconcile with such a being - at least if that being has our best interests at heart.
Magnifying God's glory keeps people connected to him and has an effect on human character. When people fail to give God his glory they sometimes worship created objects in his place.

http://www.gotquestions.org/glory-of-god.html
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07-31-2010 , 05:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arouet
I just don't get how a being so superior, so magnificent, so perfect ostensibly would put so much importance on being accepted and worshiped. Why would such a being care about glory? What need would such a being have for glory? Especially since it didn't do anything special to be so awesome, it just always was that way.

The fact that our less than a century on this earth would have such profound effects on our future prospects for eternity again is hard for me to reconcile with such a being - at least if that being has our best interests at heart.
I've explained it many times. Read something.
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07-31-2010 , 05:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splendour
Magnifying God's glory keeps people connected to him and has an effect on human character. When people fail to give God his glory they sometimes worship created objects in his place.

http://www.gotquestions.org/glory-of-god.html
But so what? Really? Why should such a being get bent out of shape to the point of eternal punishment over such things? I will say it again, a being who truly cared about us would prefer we treat each other well than treat him well. And even if we didn't: eternal punishment? That's justice? Do you folks have any conception of the infinite nature of eternity? To add to the cruelty, God then decides to make his existence hidden. And then will bring down a final judgment to last for eternity?

It's just an insane proposition. But if you're going to accept it I don't know how you can consider such a being loving and just. Such a being rules out of fear, not love.
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07-31-2010 , 07:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arouet
But so what? Really? Why should such a being get bent out of shape to the point of eternal punishment over such things? I will say it again, a being who truly cared about us would prefer we treat each other well than treat him well. And even if we didn't: eternal punishment? That's justice? Do you folks have any conception of the infinite nature of eternity? To add to the cruelty, God then decides to make his existence hidden. And then will bring down a final judgment to last for eternity?

It's just an insane proposition. But if you're going to accept it I don't know how you can consider such a being loving and just. Such a being rules out of fear, not love.
I don't think the onus is on God. He's already did everything he can do. There comes a point that you make a decision whether or not you accept his offer and co-operate with him.

Glory is something that is owed to God and human beings benefit from giving it to him.
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07-31-2010 , 07:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splendour
I don't think the onus is on God. He's already did everything he can do. There comes a point that you make a decision whether or not you accept his offer and co-operate with him.

Glory is something that is owed to God and human beings benefit from giving it to him.
It is an offer that cannot be fully comprehended. We don't have full information. Worse, the information we do have is vague and contradictory. Is it your opinion that it is just to base eternal decisions on such limited data? Is it your opinion that less than one hundred years should be the basis for eternity?

Why should a being such as God feel he is owed anything? I mean, I'm sure he'd appreciate some good wishes, but how does an atheist, or a believer of another faith really offend a being who is so much greater than ourselves? Would I be offended if I learned that an ant didn't like me? Or preferred my neighbour's front walk to mine?

It's funny how utterly human God's desires seem to be portrayed as.
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07-31-2010 , 08:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arouet
It is an offer that cannot be fully comprehended. We don't have full information. Worse, the information we do have is vague and contradictory. Is it your opinion that it is just to base eternal decisions on such limited data? Is it your opinion that less than one hundred years should be the basis for eternity?

Why should a being such as God feel he is owed anything? I mean, I'm sure he'd appreciate some good wishes, but how does an atheist, or a believer of another faith really offend a being who is so much greater than ourselves? Would I be offended if I learned that an ant didn't like me? Or preferred my neighbour's front walk to mine?

It's funny how utterly human God's desires seem to be portrayed as.
A relationship with God is a spiritual phenomenon. I don't think everything is logically dissectable. Its meant to have an experiential aspect to it and I don't think that we know all of God's future purposes for the human race though we have some Millenial Kingdom information provided.

I think I will leave it at that. Quite a bit of one's personal interpretation is based on one's view of God's nature.
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07-31-2010 , 08:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotReady
Of course, that Sub is in trouble if he continues to reject God, and I meant it.
I don't 'reject God', for the simple reason that nobody does. Those words do not denote an action---or even a cognitive or emotional orientation. They are a social label used by certain groups to demonize outsiders.

Exhibit A: this thread. Nobody has offered a criteria for 'rejecting God'; but you and Concerto have assigned me the label, apparently as justification for my eternal destruction.
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07-31-2010 , 08:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subfallen
I don't 'reject God', for the simple reason that nobody does. Those words do not denote an action---or even a cognitive or emotional orientation. They are a social label used by certain groups to demonize outsiders.

Exhibit A: this thread. Nobody has offered a criteria for 'rejecting God'; but you and Concerto have assigned me the label, apparently as justification for my eternal destruction.
Sure they have, time and time again. You just refuse to accept in and continue to obfuscate the subject as per usual.
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07-31-2010 , 09:09 PM
I'm fairly solid at reading comprehension, yet I don't see it. Direct me?
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07-31-2010 , 09:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subfallen
I'm fairly solid at reading comprehension, yet I don't see it. Direct me?
It has been given in general form and specific form.

God says that the best thing to do is X, and you do -X. Where X would be from the bible.

By doing -X you are rejecting God's will for you, thus rejecting God.
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