Why not? I have an affinity for history, and Islam was part of it. I had also been reading the vedas and studying the life of zarathustra at the time.

Because it takes effort, of course (as I said). I was just curious why you would read a book that repulsed you about a religion you didn't know much about.

It's a question, not an attack.

I don't mind expending effort if I am satisfying my curiosity. While I said 'affinity' I think a more appropriate word would be 'passion'. I really love history and anthropology, especially when I was younger.

Did your curiosity about religions you don't know much about wane once you realised the Quran was the word of Allah? Or do you still read holy texts of other religions?

If I'm curious about a topic or need to provide evidence for something then I'll look it up. I just don't believe what I'm reading.

Yeah, me neither.

I wondered whether coming to believe in Allah and adopting your religion changed that part of your personality. Hard to tell from a message board of course, but I'm also not averse to expending effort when I'm curious about something.

This is what I was getting at. When I say 'humility' I mean this separation from ego. The ego wants to bring you into your head. When you separate from ego, you become more in tune with your intuition, through the subconscious mind, where I believe spiritual connection is.

This is what I believe reading the Quran did for you. I'm wondering if you have the self awareness to realize that it was this feeling of re-connection that drew you in - that reading the Quran is one path among many that can lead to the realization of this connection.

Do you see the distinction I'm trying to make? The process of separating from ego is what is really important not the path (reading the Quran) that led there. Religion is a means to that end but when you make it the end then you become susceptible to dogma. I'm not trying to sound disrespectful just encouraging you to consider seeing it from this perspective. What do you think of that?

I never noticed a difference in my personality, but my family has mentioned that I've become 'better', although I'm not really sure what that means. I was a delinquent in my younger years so I assume they mean the curb in my attitude. I can't drink or party or commit felonies like my siblings, so that might have a lot to do with it lol.

I did notice a difference in my contentedness, but most people who feel secure are happy. It makes sense.

It's been my experience [I may be wrong] that most people on message boards are meaner than they are in person because they are free to be jerks without fear of being clocked for it.

If you are getting rid of music might as well get rid of dancing.

I think your view is incorrect, at least regarding me and and my motivation/intentions. Allah guides whoever He wills through whatever means He wishes to.

Many religions preach humility and self-contentment. Many offer far less punishment as well. Those things weren't what made me believe. Even if it said my ultimate fate was to be a flaming kumquat I still would have believed it to be the truth.

I just believed it because I believed what was written was real and that the One who said these words was actually the same One who Created this universe and everything in it. There is no ulterior motive for me.


Well hey, if that is what you want to do, feel free. I personally like dancing and won't stop.


Salam

Its going to look odd without music but alright.

Yes you believed it intuitively right? How? Was there a feeling, an emotion? I'm trying to encourage you to give this more examination. I mean it is such a pivotal moment in your life that it shouldn't be glossed over right?

You say Allah caused it but that is an interpretation that was presented to you that you've decided to accept.

Dancing looks pretty odd anyway. You're just moving, twisting, jumping, flailing your arms and legs.

I am aware of what you are trying to encourage, thank you.

From an academic standpoint, one should view all human cultures and habits with an open mind, even practices most people consider taboo such as cannibalism and human sacrifice. You can't understand the mindset of ancient peoples unless you view life from their eyes, and being judgmental is counterproductive. It's difficult to suppress it sometimes (as with me and war/submission), but you can't make progress without doing it. So I did.

Nope, no emotions. I didn't have some bright epiphany or ah-ha moment. I have no interest in sensationalizing my conversion or adding lights and glitter where it wasn't before. It was a while before I realized I believed what I was reading, but it was not sensational.

I was reading it and did not believe it to be a fairy tale or based in myth as I believed others to be. It really was just that simple. That was many years ago. I have no doubts in my convictions.

Allah, the owner of this universe and everyone in it, does as He pleases. The Quran makes this clear. As I believe the Quran to be factual, so do I believe this statement to be with full conviction.

Is capitalization necessary for this word or was it an accident? I understand using it for "Creator" but the word "created" implies an action rather than an entity.

Cant argue with that.

They should at least let you listen to some Yusef Islam, NSFNMP or not safe for non music people.

Wow i just realized that the rick roll meme had some potentially serious consequences.

I had been wondering the same thing but it's a bit of a can of worms. I don't think we need to be trained psychologists to suggest though, that Islam would clearly appeal to those who seek a firm hand of guidance, easy answers and a purpose, even more so than Christianity. I would very much like to see if profiles exist of those who have voluntarily become Muslims, as opposed to those who had no choice.

Not staking out a position but curious as to your reasoning here, could you please elaborate?

If there is some thing that created the universe. Why do you think this creator sees human beings as so important, that he judges our lives?

Yes, it was an accident.

Thanks for the warning, I appreciate it.

I prefer anasheed. It's a special type of religious poetry which is sung (similar to how minstrels told stories in ancient europe, but without the lute).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8-OcMkKaXQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAyv53WWMY8

"And I did not create the jinn and mankind except to worship Me." Surat Adh-Dhariyat [51:56]

Of course, this creator, made the universe just so for a fraction of time he could be put a few humans and jinn (invisible people?) on a planet in one solar system, just so we could worship him.

Even better, to get his message across he chooses a small part of this planet (the middle east) to receive the message, 200 000 years into the existance of mankind.

Yep very believable!

Every single nation of people that has ever existed was sent a Messenger and a Religion to follow. (Quran 16:36, 10:47, 14:04, 35:24, and 13:38).

Islam is simply the last true revealed religion that was sent, which is why Muhammad(saws) is called "the seal of the prophets". He is a messenger for all of mankind, not a single nation. All are ordered to follow his religion the second they are informed of it, since he is the most recent prophet, otherwise they are among the losers [in the hellfire].

[If you want to get technical, "Islam" is the word used for all revealed religions and also the word used to describe the last religion in Arabic. In previous languages, their religions were called words similar to submission and monotheism, like the banu hanifa. They had their own revealed word for themselves in hebrew and again in aramaic].

Every single nation of people that has ever existed was sent a Messenger and a Religion to follow.

Inuit, Australian aborigines, Vikings, African bushmen, Japanese etc etc? Is there any proof from their cultures that this happened?

Also considering humans have been around for 200 000 years, and for most of that time our life expectancy has been around 25-30 years, You do have send the message regularly so people can remember it.

We didnt have the internet or even books for most of that time!

Ummah, rereading our conversation I was trying to make a point based on an assumption that you reject: that you in some way consciously chose your belief in Islam. You say Allah made you believe. That's my mistake. I was trying to bring to your awareness a way in which you may have consciously decided to adopt Islam but just been unaware of how it happened.

One last thing I'm wondering about: Is your experience universal for Islam? Does anyone consciously choose to believe in Islam or does Allah always decide who should believe? If one person reads the Quran and doesn't believe and another reads it and believes, is that due to anything that those two people have control over? Or can it work both ways in that a person can decide on his own to believe or Allah can make them believe? Thanks for being patient and explaining all this to me.

Over time, religions became corrupted. The Christianity of today is not the Christianity of 1900 years ago. The Hinduism of today is a melting pot of various tribal beliefs and myths collected under one descriptive title. Every time a religion became irreparably corrupted, Allah sent a new one. Islam was the last one sent and the one all people are required to follow.

Everyone is different. Allah brings people to Islam through various means. Yvonne Ridley came to Islam through kidnapping. Yusuf Estes came from having a Muslim friend. I came from curiosity. I've known people who learned Islam only so they could preach against it and ended up believing in it instead. We're all different. What we have in common is that once you accept Islam, you enter the family and your past is forgiven.

A person's heart [literally their desires and inner thoughts] is only known to himself and to Allah. Allah knows best who wants to be guided and who does not. He is the One that gives them the nudge to enter or exit faith and only He knows why.

He has told us that those who truly desire the truth will be guided and nothing can misguide them, so not to worry.

And those who are arrogant or evil in intentions will be misguided whether they are Muslim or disbeliever. Those people have a veil drawn over their reasoning and nobody can guide them or force them to believe.

But people change and can switch from one to the other. Nothing is permanent except death. That is why Muslims seek refuge in Allah multiple times a day from becoming arrogant and rebellious.


Salam