I agree. Nevertheless it's been interesting. The way many non-believers reacted in this forum totally validated the verses you listed above.

Truly arguing is not the way to go. That's why I asked for a closed theist forum so we could share wisdom in peace but we didn't get it.

God bless!

I think that Madnak will respect our wishes if we want to have a discussion without arguments from atheist that are completely off topic.

The issue is that I do not see that many theists are wanting to do that. When I started the thread about eternal hell I was speaking directly to theists, and yet almost no one engaged in the discussion. I think that it is a very interesting topic and hope to go over other topics that are interesting only to christians, but people need to participate to that. My thread got completely derailed, which is fine, but it was not the discussion that I wanted.

So I hope that when you and other theists see these types of threads you join in. There is a lot of very interesting topics that can be discussed between Christians. But without participation it is worthless.

There are plenty of Christian only forums on the web where you can discuss all your logic defying leaps of faith with each other without the danger of anyone of different opinions objecting or questioning. That way you can run round in spiritual circles all you want and plan day trips for when you get to heaven(plz come visit me jib, i promise we will have awesome music in hell).

And there are plenty of atheist forums out there for you. This is a poker forum. This particular part of the forum is God, Religion, and Theology. So I do not see why it would not be fair ask that we can have a conversation about God, Religion, or Theology that was allowed to stay on topic.

I have no problem with atheists joining the conversations. The beginning of my hell thread was almost all atheists that had honest questions. Nitty pointed out something in the video that I totally missed. But then the thread got totally derailed by people interjecting and accusing others of not being true Christians. And then there is always the out of left field remarks about how nothing we believe means anything anyway.

Well there are threads that you can start if that is how you feel. But do not attempt to tell me that it is your right to interrupt what is attempting to be a meaningful conversation just because you do not like what I believe. Just have respect for others.

lol. Yeah, christian music for the most part sucks. If anything brings me over to the dark side it will be the draw of good music and the high fives.

All it takes is one believer to become a non-believer for this statement to be nullified...and I'm pretty sure that has happened at least once or twice in human history.

This is a very interesting statement because I have noticed that the deeper I get (religiously) the more it seems like a no-brainer. And the frustrating part for a Christian who wants to display this is that the task is getting you to see it for it's simplicity. I guess it's faulty of it's own self in that it's too easy.

Pletho, if there's one thing you taught me personally it's that the Bible truly is The Word Of God. Sharing your interpretation has shown me that I have a long way to go, and for this I am excited!

I hope you do pop in from time to time Pletho. I have sincerely appreciated your contribution.

I agree Jibninjas but I think the problem is that there truly are few on here who wish to expand their knowledge. And the excitement of the back and forth from thread to thread soon scatters the attention of those who do. I am faulty of this myself. I try to only participate in a couple threads at a time but before I know it, I have replies in ten of them.

I personally like the participation from an atheist (for the most part) because it makes one stay true to themselves in the sincerity of their answers. And it's not only that but I like it for the silent reader who reads these threads and doesn't participate. The individual who may genuinely be qurious but is apprehensive about joining the discussion. The atheists present questions that many have and I think it's good to allow that question to be debated so that someone reading can make their own judgement for themselves.

Oops I lied, I popped back in to stomp out some ignorance.

Its hard to be loving sometimes in the face of ignorance.

You do err not knowing the truth. A true Christian has spiritual seed inside of them, that is why it is called being born again. The first birth of a person comes from seed right? Well the second one does too, but the second one is spiritual seed vs. physical seed. It is created in the person who believes, its called holy spirit.

So a true believer, a true Christian born again, can not lose his spiritual seed any more than a physical person can lose there physical seed. Its in the fabric of their being.

I had to pop in here, it was so hard to resist such a stupid unknowledgeable comment. But what else should I expect?

Honestly? I wouldn't expect a blind person to be able to tell me how beautiful a painting is, would I?

So, I shouldn't expect a blind unbeliever to be able to make a statement that is true regarding the bible either.

So really all it takes is one stupid comment like yours to make it available for me to point how how stupid and unknowledgable you are about the bible, life, ect... Please don't make it so easy for me again to pick apart your ignorance.

I am a Christian, but if provoked do not have any issues with fighting back ignorance with logic and truth.

Pletho

The extreme contempt, pride and arrogance displayed here has left a very bitter taste in my mouth which will result in me making a special effort to demonstrate the illogical and untruthful nature of your self-righteous bull****. It is 4 am here however we will have plenty of time to discuss many of these matters further in the coming days.

You are a self-righteous prick. You have just suggested that someone you don't even know is stupid and "unknowlegeable about....life etc". You disgust me and I'm looking forward to exposing you as the conceited and hypocritical fraud you most certainly are.

The truth is the truth. You and your unbelieving cohorts have continuously bombarded and attacked the Christians on this forum and called them illogical and stupid and ect.... So I thought that I might give you all a taste of your own medicine. It obvioulsy worked!

Let me ask you a question. If someone KNOWS an answer or the truth, then are they self-righteous and arrogant to express it, or let it be known? It's interesting to see the advesaries people get all ruffled at the feathers when they are put in their place.

You all may not think this is CHRISTIAN like. But have you ever read about Jesus Christ and HOW he handled unbelievers and especially those working for the advesary. He called a spade a spade. Black is black and white is white. Right is right and wrong is wrong. He did not mince words, or hold things back, he told it like it was. Even those who believed him at times became offended.

So, I feel no remorse for standing up for what I believe and straightly attacking the onslaught of ignorance and stupidity that you all like to throw at Christians on this forum. Sometimes people just need to take a stand against the unbelieving world and let the chips fall where they may.

All that you will end up doing in the end by trying to attack me is prove yourself just as ignorant of the bible and life as all the other unbelievers.

By the way, did you know that life originated from God?

I am in no way am impying that you or other unbelievers have not experienced life. That would be stupidity on my part. I am saying that you nor any other unbeliever has ANY CLUE about life period.

It's origins, your reason for being here, how things work and are intended to work in life from a spiritual point of view. These things you are ignorant of!

I understand that it is not your fault you are like this. I was once like you. No one is born as a believer. I once thought I had some idea about life, why I was here, what it was all about, what death was about, ect.... on and on. But I was not arrogant enough and prideful enough to think that I had figured it all out. I just though that SOME of my ideas made sense.

This is where you are at and all the other unbelievers on here.

I thankfully have recieved the truth about life. It is not because I am any better than you. It was because I WANTED to really know and wasn't going to throw the bible and God out of the picture, even though I had never really read it, or knew anything about it or God. I was meek and humble and willing to listen to someone share it with me.

Of course this was AFTER I decided I wanted to know. So until you really want to know, which logically means that you are saying YOU DONT ALREADY KNOW it all, then you will not recieve truth.

Pletho

but how do you know that any "evidence" at the earth being older than 6,000 years isn't just God testing your faith in him?

And I can also affirm that once that seed is planted inside of you, it's there! Most of the "Christians" that believed, and then grew up and stopped believing, never "BELIEVED".

Look at me, some would say I was close to unbelieving because I had your consistent, "Gods not real, Gods not real, Gods not real" messages in my head. But in reality, it was God just breaking me down a bit in order to build that foundation a little stronger. Didn't I even say that during that time I was holding on to the "belief" that I knew I believed?

It's all for one simple reason and it's that there's nothing better. You can't get better then perfection. Once you found perfection can you really let go of it?

Most is not good enough. All it takes is ONE to nullify his statement! Just one.

Dan Barker should serve as a good example. He was a devoted minister and missionary for 20 years. Now he's a self-proclaimed atheist debater.

Actually, forget Dan Barker (and the many others like him)...how about MOTHER TERESA! Are you going to tell me she wasn't a true believer?

So I'm blind, ignorant, stupid, and unknowledgable. And you are...
Makes sense now.

Just don't brag about that too much...you'll ruin it for the others.

Just because someone said they are a minister and ministered for 20 years does not mean they were really born again Christians. Have you ever heard the term a flase prophet?

Mother Theresa was Catholic wasn't she. There is no such thing as a Catholic in the bible the last time I read it. If you can find Catholic in the bible please point it out to me. I am sure this will cause some uproar on this thread.

You have to have spirit, holy spirit created inside of you to be a Christian. Hence the term Christian. It originated from the first century believers saying and teaching that they had Christ-in them.

It was originally a nickname given to them. Oh' look there is a Christian a Christ-in.

Catholics teach nothing and believe nothing about having Christ in you and getting born again. As a matter of fact for the most part of the history of the Catholic church they never even let people have or read a bible?

So to answer your question, No! Mother Theresa wasn't a Christian..

Pletho

woah, did not know about her religious doubts, etc.

Please read carefully so you don't misinterpret what I'm saying.

What you wrote in response to what Our House said makes you absolutely 100% delusional and gives Christianity a bad name.

You're also a small-minded, narcissistic prick.

You think that reading one comment from somebody tells you much they do, or do not know about life? You're judging people based on one ****ing sentence, and you're not supposed to judge at all!

Clearly, you're not a real Christian, just a Christ-in (as you put it) like Mother Teresa. (LOL)

Thanks, I like you too!

Did you know that Judge in the bible really means to Judge anothers heart?

It is not talking about judging their actions or words. So according to the Word I can make a general judment from the overall viewpoint of the bible about any situation or person I am confronted with, as long as I am not saying seomething like "they will never believe, because that is unknown to me. But other things are known, if you base your opinions on the bible.

As a Christian you are to bring everything you hear back to the word and make sure things line up with what is taught in the word, and if they do not then they are not truth.

Jesus Christ did it all the time. He actually said he came not to judge, but to save man kind, but he did say that IF he did judge HIS judgement would be true, WHY because he always does the Fathers will, meaning the Fathers word.

This is not judging as you think of judging.

He made his judements about situations and people in light of the word of God. Then they were correct judgements.

So my judment/comment about unbelievers NOT KNOWING about life is pretty much RIGHT ON. In that statement I did not judge them as to their heart, their worthiness, their value, ect... It was a according to the fact that they cannot know about life and their purpose and ect...because they do not have that knowledge in them. It comes from the bible ONLY.

If we cannot JUDGE as some of you like to throw around, then HOW may I tell you are we supposed to tell the truth about something. Or someone?

It is almost like that stupid liberal thing called "politically correct" where you cant sat the truth you have to tone it down and water things down so as not to offend someone.

Pletho

Nobody ever thinks the bible means what it says. They are always convinced it means what they say.

WOW! You really said something that true this time! I agree with this statement 100% Its because they dont know HOW to study the bible and read it. They interpret it themselves instead of letting the word interpret itself from within its own pages, by the ways in which it uses the same words in other verses. There are many other ways also.

Great quote! You get a brownie point!!!!!!!!! YEA!!!!!

Pletho!

I've really said something true this time? Maybe you confused me with butcho. I've never even talked to you before. And the condescension ensures I will never talk to you again.

Note to self: Did not attempt to answer original topic of the thread.
Note to self: Personality is close enough to narcissistic that he feels the need to sign his own posts.

I'm actually starting to think Pletho is a highly convincing level.

I do.

???Site please! This is the first that I have heard of this.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/...n3199062.shtml

I like how one of here dying wishes were to destroy the letters but the church just said "Nah, I think we will keep them, make a book, and profit more off of you"(may not be verbatim conversation)