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German court bans circumcision of young boys German court bans circumcision of young boys

07-09-2012 , 12:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
So if it was socially acceptable to expose yourself to kids, that'd be fine right?
But it's not. You're arguing a hypothetical.

But, hypotheticaly, if it was acceptable it should only be allowed if they're circumcised. Otherwise, that'd just be gross.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 12:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundGuy
But it's not. You're arguing a hypothetical.

But, hypotheticaly, if it was acceptable it should only be allowed if they're circumcised. Otherwise, that'd just be gross.
lol
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 12:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfasdf32
physical damage
Damage? Say's who? You?
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 12:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundGuy
Damage? Say's who? You?
The dictionary. You're damaging the tissue.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 12:57 AM
Chopping off 20,000 nerve endings at the tip of your schlong is pretty clearly damage...
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfasdf32
The dictionary.
Try again.

damage (ˈdæmɪdʒ)
— n
1.injury or harm impairing the function or condition of a person or thing
2.loss of something desirable
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundGuy
Try again.

damage (ˈdæmɪdʒ)
— n
1.injury or harm impairing the function or condition of a person or thing
2.loss of something desirable
Ahem, pretty sure the 'function' of the foreskin is 'impaired' after it's removed.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfasdf32
Ahem, pretty sure the 'function' of the foreskin is 'impaired' after it's removed.
And what function is that again?
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundGuy
And what function is that again?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreskin#Functions (NSFW)
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfasdf32
Uh, no thanks. I'll just remain ignorant -- with an AWESOME looking penis.

Oops, gotta go, Mrs. Roundguy is calling. Damn glad I'm circumcised.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundGuy
Uh, no thanks. I'll just remain ignorant -- with an AWESOME looking penis.

Oops, gotta go, Mrs. Roundguy is calling. Damn glad I'm circumcised.
Still not sure what this means, but have fun.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 01:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundGuy
Uh, no thanks. I'll just remain ignorant -- with an AWESOME looking penis.

Oops, gotta go, Mrs. Roundguy is calling. Damn glad I'm circumcised.
Where does the urge to repeatedly express the cosmetic superiority of your penis come from? Do you have some kind of traumatic experience? Did mrs roundguy told you about this huge uncircumcised dick she had while backpacking europe? Did she then try to build you up with telling you that little mr roundguy is so much prettier?
You can tell us about it, we are in a safe place!
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 02:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
Not true. I had parent permission for an upper ear piercing at 12 in PA and I couldn't get one. Greatest thing that ever happened to me... Woulda looked like a mega-***. In PA it was 16 with parental consent, 18 w/o. AFAIK every state has some regulation.
So how can you explain all the little girls I see walking/crawling around with their ears pierced? Are you saying there are no girls with legally pierced ears below the age of 16 in PA? That's ridiculous.
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07-09-2012 , 02:03 AM
I've never seen an erect un-circumcised dong, but I heard that there's no difference once it's hard.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 02:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman
So how can you explain all the little girls I see walking/crawling around with their ears pierced? Are you saying there are no girls with legally pierced ears below the age of 16 in PA? That's ridiculous.
Clip on earrings, probably. I just googled it and you can do the lobe at 10 w/ permission. I was doing cartilidge. Point is, there's definitely regulation going on. Weird looking up PA body piercing stuff when I don't even live there anymore and have no interest in any piercings nowadays (and even if I did, I'd be well
older than the limit).

Last edited by wutangpoker; 07-09-2012 at 02:22 AM.
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07-09-2012 , 02:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
Clip on earrings, probably.
Nope. Maybe not in PA, but in NJ at least, it's completely standard to get a baby's ears pierced.
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07-09-2012 , 03:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman
Nope. Maybe not in PA, but in NJ at least, it's completely standard to get a baby's ears pierced.
http://www.state.nj.us/health/eoh/phss/bodyart.pdf

I'll be damned.

Snooki state, I guess
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07-09-2012 , 06:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
I've never seen an erect un-circumcised dong, but I heard that there's no difference once it's hard.
Basically this is true. I should point out I'm only going on a sample size of 1 here though
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 07:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by uke_master
You have the direction all wrong. This is not about mandating something, it is about banning something. There are lots of things that I think are stupid, pointless, and even harmful that idiotic parents (many of them religious) do to their children all the time. But I don't want to ban the vast majority of it.
The difference between those things and (religious) circumcision is that the latter is clearly an unnecessary procedure from a medical standpoint, with no immediate benefits; lowered HIV/STD transmission is not relevant until years later, improved hygiene, well, teaching kids (how) to clean their penis is probably equally effective. There's also the danger of some kind of complication plus the pain inflicted on the child (the procedure is apparently often done without anesthesia).
On the other hand these religious circumcisions infringe on the childs' right to physical integrity.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 07:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
So if it was socially acceptable to expose yourself to kids, that'd be fine right? Cuz they'd get used to it, and the psychological damage wouldn't happen if it happened to everyone.
I assume you mean sexually, right?

Because there isn't anything wrong in walking around naked in front of your kids until they are a certain age. I would probably say its more psychologically damaging if this isn't done than if it is (teaching them the body is dirty and must be covered up, etc.)
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 10:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
I've never seen an erect un-circumcised dong, but I heard that there's no difference once it's hard.
There's really almost no difference between cut and uncut when the foreskin is retracted. You can still tell the difference, but it's minor and doesn't really affect the aesthetics much.
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07-09-2012 , 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfasdf32
Ahem, pretty sure the 'function' of the foreskin is 'impaired' after it's removed.
"irreparable physical damage" is essentially a deepity. It is trivially true that the actual tissue is being damaged. But the implication of your posts is that there is something wrong with this, that some form of larger damage to the person occurs. This is where you have failed ITT, and indeed as far as I can see the circumcised person is more or less exactly the same and suffers no physical pain or suffering or emotional turmoil or anything of this nature in adulthood. Certainly not at a sufficient level of suffering to justify banning it. Pointing out that something has been "damaged" because it has been removed helps you in no way.
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07-09-2012 , 12:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by monarco
The difference between those things and (religious) circumcision is that the latter is clearly an unnecessary procedure from a medical standpoint, with no immediate benefits; lowered HIV/STD transmission is not relevant until years later, improved hygiene, well, teaching kids (how) to clean their penis is probably equally effective. There's also the danger of some kind of complication plus the pain inflicted on the child (the procedure is apparently often done without anesthesia).
On the other hand these religious circumcisions infringe on the childs' right to physical integrity.
so? Almost all the stupid things parents do that provide some small risk to their children are not "medically necessary" but I don't want to ban any of them. Again the burden of proof is bejng massively confused, I don't have to prove there are huge benefits, you have to prove there is huge harm sufficient for an extraordinary ban.
German court bans circumcision of young boys Quote
07-09-2012 , 12:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutangpoker
So if it was socially acceptable to expose yourself to kids, that'd be fine right? Cuz they'd get used to it, and the psychological damage wouldn't happen if it happened to everyone.
Exactly. If we lived in a nudist society, say, then nudity would not be a problem.
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07-09-2012 , 12:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by uke_master
"irreparable physical damage" is essentially a deepity. It is trivially true that the actual tissue is being damaged. But the implication of your posts is that there is something wrong with this, that some form of larger damage to the person occurs.
Of course there is something wrong with it. I'm almost certain no court would allow parents to circumcise their 16-year old son without his consent; the same should be true of an infant. And until such a time when a person can give their consent we should avoid lopping off body parts for no good reason.

Quote:
This is where you have failed ITT, and indeed as far as I can see the circumcised person is more or less exactly the same and suffers no physical pain or suffering or emotional turmoil or anything of this nature in adulthood. Certainly not at a sufficient level of suffering to justify banning it. Pointing out that something has been "damaged" because it has been removed helps you in no way.
Again, the ban on circumcision is basically no different than the banning of tattooing of infants (which would happen if it was a common occurrence). Your societal premise does not work because I'm not arguing on those grounds. I would be in favor of banning the aforementioned forehead swastika tattoos you mentioned earlier, even in a society were it was prevalent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uke_master
so? Almost all the stupid things parents do that provide some small risk to their children are not "medically necessary" but I don't want to ban any of them. Again the burden of proof is bejng massively confused, I don't have to prove there are huge benefits, you have to prove there is huge harm sufficient for an extraordinary ban.
No. The default position is to not cut off a piece of your child. To do so should require proof of sufficient benefits, and until this is done the practice of circumcision should not be allowed.

Last edited by asdfasdf32; 07-09-2012 at 12:38 PM.
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