That would make an interesting thread. I recently listened to an EXCELLENT series by Craig on religious pluralism. Highly recommended.

The fundamental idea is that the fact someone else claims he was called by a different God doesn't affect my experience, nor do I have to judge his. It may be that those who follow a different God are responding to the light God gives them. God is the judge of that. But my duty is clear - Allah hasn't called me, Jesus has.

Is God bound in any way to adhere to our notions of him?

I thought God was more or less this. Clearly I misunderstand what God is then. So... what is God?

gskowal - sounds about right.

What's a "real argument"?


Not necessarily. Any meaningful argument that's not bull**** will do.

Are you saying that the man who claims that the dying innocent children are recipients of infinite good actually made an EXCELLENT series? i can't believe it...

Christianity? You're username has made me think you were Jewish.

Thank you for the recommendation, I'll give it a look.

From your understanding, how does the idea of God giving, for instance, Muslims a different light affect their ability to get into Heaven? Are you something of a Universalist?

It depends on which god you're talking about.

(The purpose here is to focus in on what you're actually looking for.)

You're not helping to clarify what you're looking for.

ganstaman - I am Jewish (by blood, not by faith), but most people here are Xtian.

I imagine most ppl here are Xtian so I am basically addressing most religious people on here. But not specifically Xtians. Any religious dude can join in the fun. Just provide some sort of argument that's not easily refutable, and we're in business.

My experience tells me that I don't need God of the gaps. God is not required for anything, to explain anything, or needed for anything. God is not useful in any way.

Why should I believe in God? Why should I take religion seriously?

Any God

There's a sense in which I'm not required for anything, to explain anything, or needed for anything. Yet, I still exist.

You probably have certain "ways" you're thinking about when you say "any way." What do you expect God to "do"?

You should believe in God because you have become convinced that the proposition is true enough for you to believe in God.

You should take religion seriously if you believe that it accurately reflects reality.

Then you're probably not talking about any god at all. (Pun not intended, but I don't know how else to say it.)

And what convinced you?

Not only am I not convinced there is a God, I have never actually come across any good evidence that God exists.

But I am not convinced. Do you think it is reasonable that I stick with this belief now, or do you think I should look for more evidence for God?

But I don't.

Okay, let's talk about the Christian God then. Do you think God exists in the physical universe? Or outside the physical universe? Or both?

A combination of life experiences and the process of carefully evaluating those life experiences.

What would count as "good evidence" that God exists?

Both. I think you should look for "more evidence." But I also think it's reasonable that you stick with your current belief for now.

Then why would you wonder whether you should take religion seriously?

How do you go about evaluating your life experiences? Who do you reflect upon them with?

3 things I can think of.

1) Because my current beliefs might be wrong and I am open to change (of opinion).

2) Moreover, I have always wondered why so many people are or claim to be religious. I just don't get it, and I feel as though I am missing out on some life experiences.

3) Because my father is quite a religious Jew and so is some of my family, and they have expectations, and if I "dissappoint them" (in their eyes), then because my family means quite a lot to me, I want to be sure that the decisions I make are benefitial enough to me to justify causing some pain to members of my family. That was probably badly worded, but I hope you get the idea. It is a trade-off and basically before I get married to a non-Jew for example, I would want to make sure that that was a good decision.

That was vague.

I would ask how you go about determining 'valid' life experiences that cause you to believe in the Christian God versus presumably non-valid life experiences that cause Hindus to believe in their God.

I'm assuming you do not adhere to religious pluralism, but this may not be accurate.

also, asdfasdf32, your display pic is distracting. Just thought I'd let you know

Carefully?

I don't think there's a single way to do this. But it sounds like you're going through that type of process. There must be some "core" things that make you who you are (or who you want to be). There must be some sort of central "truth" to your self-understanding. I would start by thinking about those things.

People you trust to give you honest and genuine answers, and people who know you personally.

The pods are in his defenders series #2.

I'm not a Universalist. My basic position is that God will save any and all who can be saved. I found it interesting and encouraging that Craig arrived at the same conclusion at the end of the series. I had come to that position by a different route several years ago but I believe it's also Scriptural. There's a verse in the OT that says "God is not willing that any should perish but that all come to a knowledge of the truth". Though I think it takes more than that one verse to establish the case, that verse sums it up.