I'm deeply atheist but often find myself saying things like 'god, please' 'I'll do anything if you just let me get through this' etc when either in a very bad situation and sometimes just as a phrase of speech. Yes, this is contradictory!!

But in a balanced state I can not see any reason for a higher power based on our scientific knowledge - and the just have faith argument is nonsense!

I can't believe in Christianity, Islam etc - why would we choose to ignore current knowledge in favor of those who were so technologically primitive?

Further, I can't see how people would find comfort in a diety or dieties whose ultimate aim on Earth it seems - is to consistantly promote life and then frequently wipe out 99.9% of species.

For me we live in a universe of code; namely Atomic and Cellular code, which is ultimately self writing code without the need for governance.

How do you suppose a method of obtaining knowledge about "natural" things (where I define natural to be repeatable, causal and observable) could somehow gain knowledge about something that is postulated to be "supernatural" (violates one or more of the previous conditions).

If you are relying on science to tell you about God.....you have some serious philosophical problems in your thinking.

A higher power is going to put this thread in a different forum. Does that count?

If you're wrong, you'll be sorry

This bothers me: don't you people realize that there's a whole field called "Philosophy of Religion"?

It depends on how much higher.

yeah they had this debate when considering separate forums and decided it was best to go about it the way they did. maybe you're aware, but I don't recall you posting regularly as you do now.

What else can a human do beside make deduction from the world around us. Further, science in many aspects boarders upon releigion in cutting edge physics where nothing is obseved first hand i.e. black holes - we postulate there existence via second hand data.

And upon that deduction I see no reason or evidence of a being outside the system having an influence on the inside. Fundamentally we have atoms, energy, space-time. And from our self supposed importance - cellular structures. These are all self governing systems as far as I gather. And, why would a supernatural being be soo loving of destruction?

Further, I was hoping for a logical argument that provides a reason for why a belief in god is plausible - not a discounting of my statemnet!

i don't know why I'm still here.
thanks to a higher power I'm alive.
I was given a second chance at life.
thanks to god.

I don't thank god - I see our perception of the fact that we are alive as special, but not evidence of a higher power. More of evidence of how materials in our universe self-align themselves into ever more complex systems. Just to be wiped out again.

I think I am here because after 3.8 billion years of evolution my nuerones have evolved to transmit millions of times in order to make me aware of my surroundings to a higher level than that of life before us. But to a lower level than that which will come after us. Pain makes us scream for a world which has answers and a higher power takes away all mystery of why - but this strikes me as ignorance. We have come portray ourselves as important, due to the fact that we believe we are here and can imagine the future.

Why would a god make living soo difficult - why would he not promote us to not unecessarily feel pain. Because he does not exist!

PLEASE someone, try to make me believe from a science viewpoint!!

I hear acid is good for that sort of thing. The more, the better. About 20 tabs should do the trick. Enlightenment through modern chemistry.

lol, hmm. Prozac may help me also. Sometimes get jealous of these types who naively follow religions without questioning anything bad about them.

Judging by the lack of replies, i assume that no one can convince me - i was kinda hoping for some uber christian to at least give me some argument!

so you suppose the holy grail proof of god is being secretly held onto by someone on this forum and they are just now going to tell you about it after keeping it secret for so long?

lmao, yes, maybe i was being overly optimistic!!

The way the OP is worded, it is best that the thread is moved to RGT to receive the full flogging it so deserves. It would have been moved sooner but I have been busy with other matters.

-Zeno

The people over there are blissfully unaware of what philosophy means and its history. It should be the Science and Math forum.

I totally agree - when i posted originally it was for a convincing argument for the role of an entity that governs/has influence upon our universe. Yet to here one btw!!

but it's more philosophy and science if you've read any of my prior posts.

But then i have stated deity - which is essentially a god. And, one of my aims was to start a heated discussion with someone who actually believes in such but i think that they don't exist - here, anyway!

I think i might post a new thread called. 'As everyone here seems atheist in belief - then how is it that people of Christian belief still come to prominence in The Computer Age? Especially when government and society is concerned.'

nope. and they've had thousands of years to think of one. and the best reason they've come up with is "well just in case he's there..."