"Sodomy" is not used as a synonym for "same-sex sex" in law, which you said was why you changed your mind about using it. Dictionary.com is about common usage, not legal usage.

As I said originally in that 2018 thread, I assumed that you use "sodomite" as a pejorative term against gay people. You think homosexuality is immoral and perverted and so prefer to use a term to describe homosexuality and homosexuals that conveys that attitude. The reason most people don't commonly use it to refer to homosexuals anymore is because most people don't want to convey that attitude and so prefer less value-laden terms like "homosexual."

In that original thread, you also brought up that you use it because it is used in the KJV and claimed it specifically referred to same-sex activity. As Aaron W pointed out in that thread (and as I have argued), this is false. When the KJV was written "sodomy" referred to a broader range of what were considered sexual sins and deviances and not just male homosexual sex, although that was strongly associated with it. The meaning of "sodomy" you are appealing to now from dictionary.com is a later narrowing due to the increased prominence of homosexual identity in twentieth-century culture.

But none of this answers my question. This was all part of the original discussion. Eventually you indicated you agreed that "sodomite" is today considered homophobic and that you would stop using it. I and others there took this to mean that you didn't mean to use a pejorative label to refer to homosexuals. Beyond just going back on your word, which I guess you don't care about, why did you change your mind and decide to use it after all?

When I child, the book my family used as a model for evangelism was Arthur McPhee's Friendship Evangelism, which advocated a relational model of evangelism where you focus on demonstrating your care for those you are trying to evangelize. Seems like a better choice than trolling people for Jesus.

Well since we've already established that I am a "homophobe" (even though its still a stupid word), then there are no grounds for me to not use "homophobic" (there's that stupid word again) language.


Friendship Evangelism is the best technique in most one on one evangelism circumstances, but "shock" evangelism seems most effective with young people on college campuses.

For example, sometimes when Jed Smock is open air preaching at a college campus, and a rather scantily clad young lady walks by, he'll ask her "why do you dress like a whore?"

Sometimes when a young woman screams profanity at him, he'll say to her "Please watch your language, there might be ladies present."

Attracts a good crowd, and many hear the Gospel and many come to a saving faith in Christ.

Jed Smock sounds like a swell guy.

He has lead many to a saving faith in Jesus Christ. If that's not swell, I don't know what is.

"Brother Jed's self-described lifestyle of "drunkenness, dissipation, and debauchery" began while he was a freshman in high school … By his second year he had established himself as the heaviest drinker in the fraternity."

"I don't know how the whorehouses in this town stay open — all of you sorority girls are giving it away for free!"

"A masturbator today is a homosexual tomorrow."

"those who listen to rock and roll are destined for Hell, along with homosexuals, fornicators, those who use tampons, and masturbators."


Swell guy.

Spending his afternoons verbally abusing girls, sounds like a swell guy.

Something tells me homie couldn't get laid during happy hour at a brothel and turning to religion gave him cover to lash out at the "whores" who wouldn't touch him with a 20ft pole, coz skydaddy is cool with a little casual misogyny like that.

They didn’t have Reddit back in his day, so angry incel dudes had to go yell at girls in person.

Also, I can confirm this is bad intel.

Give it a day.

Great work, A+.

I guess I'll just drop it since you refuse to acknowledge that you said that you would stop using "sodomite" and "sodomy" to refer to homosexuals and homosexuality and then you just kept on doing so anyway. I'm not really trying to be the PC police here. I think you have cruel views about homosexuals and so don't really mind you communicating that to people by using these terms to refer to them. I just think it's dishonest to tell people you'll stop if you have no intention of doing so.

Correspondingly I also have little sympathy for your distress about people using the term "homophobe" to refer to you or your views. Our language is often value-laden, and just as you are unwilling to give up your value-laden terms to describe homosexuals, I don't see why other people should give up their value-laden terms to refer to those hostile towards homosexuality.

Citation needed.

This makes the same mistake as the Westboro Baptist Church people, counting the wins while ignoring the losses. I wonder how many young Christians at college have lost their faith because they see the prejudiced and intolerant witness of Christians like Jed Smock mocking and attacking their friends over how they dress or comport themselves, or who they love. I doubt that is how Jesus acted when he ate and associated with publicans and prostitutes.

Ohshit. I can't even...

Well then put some clothes on... whore.

1. Since Covid Season started, I have done very little open air preaching. I've never used the word sodomite in open air preaching, either before or after the various discussions about it on 2p2. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever even brought up the topic of homosexuality specifically while preaching. I typically go through several of the Ten Commandments to illustrate how we've all violated God's law. Whenever homosexuality comes up, its always because a listener brings it up. So I guess I never stopped using sodomite, because I never really started using it anywhere in the first place other than when talking to fellow Christians or on 2p2. I might consider using sodomite sometime in preaching on a college campus, since according to all-knowing dictionary.com it is proper English usage to use the word and will tend to attract a crowd.


One of my favorite books on one-on-one evangelism is Compassionate Evangelism by Steve ****. I'm not familiar with the McPhee book. A newer book in that vein would be Becoming A Contagious Christian by Bill Hybels and Mark Mittleberg.

edit: lol filter. Steve C-o-o-n

Brother Jed's wife Cindy often preaches with him on college campuses.

I'm not "distressed" at all. The word is comically stupid, so I just laugh at it. I'll find something important to get distressed over.


People can use any words they want. Unlike the modern so-called "Progressives", I don't like to silence people.

What is she wearing? You don't mind if I ... oh, oh yeah. That's it, that's right...

I suddenly feel like a homosexual.

No satisfaction in sin, brother:



I get the feeling "disco queen" and "dancing" are euphemisms in this story. 30 hours straight is impressive, I have to admit.

So yeah, lagtight, looks like your idol pulled the girl on campus who was getting more action than a privy door when the plague's in town. Not that there's anything wrong with that (unless you're some hypocritical puritanical weirdo whose imaginary friend thinks there is).

Very strange. I never stopped using "sodomite" because I never started using it, except here on 2p2, which is also where I said I'd stop using it, but then didn't.

Perhaps the plight of lgbt kids who are bullied, or become homeless after coming out to their families (often religious families).

Is that something important to get distressed over?

Oops, I did it again.

Being from the generation that called rock and roll the Devil's music, I got the impression she was being literal. Dancing to Satan was sinful enough.

It can sometimes be hard to tell though, right? The most outspoken apologists will tell you about how depraved they used to be 'as atheists', before 'getting saved', and it can be hard to distinguish between the ones that thought something as mundane as dancing really was depravity, or that an extra glass of wine without a meal was alcohol abuse, versus the ones whose lives were truly on the brink of self-destruction from e.g. extreme drug abuse and so were prime candidates for a 'saving' religious experience, any religious experience.

True. to paraphrase Mencken, puritanism is the unbearable thought that someone, somewhere, may be having fun.

1. A few years ago I often used the word "sodomite" as a synonymn for homosexual.

2. I was informed by a poster or three in this Forum that "sodomite" was both offensive and not correct English usage of the word.

3. Based on that information, I agreed to stop using the term.

4. I later discovered that "sodomite" can be used to denote a homosexual.

5. I discovered "shock evangelism" (which to date I have never used).

6. Based on #4 and #5, I might use the word "sodomite" sometimes.

You can have the proverbial "last word" on this topic if you'd like.