more or less, the point is don't go astray to what is or oherwise you will suffer.

Simple enough, so what's so confusing with that?

Most will probably argue that the "or you will suffer" part is unnecessary.

Fine, yes they can argue but, the point being is that suffering will take place as all the religions say; unless ones sees what one is.

And suffering is everywhere to see, so something is going wrong everywhere
yet it is supposed to be so simple, all the religions agree.

So why is it so confusing?

What a gross oversimplification. Even a casual study of major world religions, and what they believe about human suffering, why it exists, and how to escape it, will show that religions vary widely.

Ten minutes of bored clicking on Wikipedia disproves the OP.

It's confusing because many atheists are also interested in living life in a way that reduces the amount of suffering. I think you're talking about something pretty broad, like the human ability to make sense of the world around him and interact with it in a "positive" way.

Not really the point about where they disagree, but taking a closer look to where they want to go.

I was thinking about suffering the other day and for Christians since we're in transit suffering doesn't really matter in the long run.

The biggest thing suffering does is alert us to evil in the world. Though sometimes God rods us to correct us and it says he is putting us through a type of "refinement" process.

Christ actually said about beggars, sick people that if you do charity onto them that you did it onto him. So from that I tend to give an accelerated status to certain categories of suffering people.

If you're suffering enough to equal Christ than suffering may be a sort of qualification into heaven.

Hence I no longer think the endless argument "If there is a God why does he allow children to starve in Africa" is even a valid question. I simply think God and Christ can make it right and maybe they qualify into heaven on the basis of their suffering.

Simply incorrect if you think Jesus or any of the the great teachers wants you to suffer. The oppsosite is true. People suffer and they want to take you to where there is no suffering. Call it the kingdom of god or nirvana or whatever you want to call it.

My question is why is it all so confusing. The message is direct, clear, not mistical at all, so why all the confusion.....

Yes, its true what you say about atheists(thats another subject though).
I am trying to discuss the message of all the great teachers which is quite simple in itself. Be what you are so supposed to be.
These teachers want for beings the same thing. They have different ways of teaching the same message though.

Have you actually read the Bible? It's about as clear as a mud pit in a snowstorm.

Varying teachers have often directly contradictory messages. Be they Jesus, Lao Tsu, Gautama, or Muhammad. Again, have you read the Bible? The Koran? The Bhagavad Gita? What do you know about the Eightfold Path?

I highly doubt you've researched all of them and concluded that they're the same.

JOEL_ you're not wrong, you're right. It is simple.

The answer to your question, "Why is it so confusing?"

Satan.

None of the great religious leaders want people to suffer but suffering is inevitable. Even Jesus suffered on the cross and we are saved through his suffering. Jesus suffering allowed him to overcome the world. In a sense we each are through our own trials imitating him and trying to overcome the world but Jesus actually did it. We're complete in our victory through Jesus alone.

The Buddhists have an expression. It's "Kill the Buddha". They don't want you to equate Buddha with God. (I'm starting to think Buddha was a great man on the right path in many ways that got interrupted by the devil. Buddha sat under the snake is a picture the Laotians have of the Buddha.)

There is a section in the Gospels that says if you help someone in desperate need you actually did the act onto Jesus. So I think Jesus is extending a special status to these people. It doesn't mean everyone gets this status awarded to them (the bible leaves a big grey area here. Probably deliberately. The bible is always trying to spur people on to be better people). He does say the first shall be last in heaven.

The message is not so clear for at least 3 reasons I can think of. Understanding is related to experience and its really only suppose to be clear to those who really care to put in the work. Lastly the king of this world deliberately blinds people.

Understanding related to experience: think a cookbook. You have to compare what you're doing/living to the book.

Which means I'm in league with Satan. Cute. Scary. Deluded.

As for OP. Most religions do not say "pretty much the same thing". They say the same thing the way most crime novels are about crime. That doesn't mean there is an archetype crime novel, that all crime novels are very similar or that most crime novels are pretty much about the same.

It's only simple for simple-minded people. I bet the more intellectual theists struggle with their faith more than anyone will ever know.

All the good stuff = God

all the bad stuff = Satan


Are you looking forward to high school?

Your first statement was a statement about consequences. Your second statement is an idealized statement about "it" (vaguely defined, but having something to do with the condition of suffering). The third statement is an idealized statement about the "self."

It's probably confusing because you don't actually have a solid thesis that you're trying to build.

Good honest post.

It's not possible to understand without experiencing. One can have ideas, but not real understanding; till you experience.
Jesus had compassion, saw the rotten state of the human(without the being) and made up some rules if you like. His message though remains clear but represented in a way that seems non understandable. Which it is, of course till you experiene. Intelectual understanding is not enough.

This could very well be true, but most probably not. Though it coud be one of the factors contributing to the confusion of the more intelectual theists. Too much noise going on.

The message is the same, the teaching though is different which could seem contradictory.

The eightfold path is basically buddhism. Actually a teaching which is expressed clearer than most for the individual though maybe not for entire societies.

Big Erf,

As far as Satan is concerned what can be said that has not already been said?

Satan of course exists but not in the way as most represent Satan. The bible though is clear on this. To have rebellion to what is.
Once you go against what is, your under the influence of another spirit which YOU think you have it together but your in fact lost. Not till you free yourself from this spirit will you have peace. Which again is the message of most teachings. Too free oneself of the I and join the kingdom of god. Words get in the way of course spirits gods devils,but when you realise they are just words trying to help up us understand something that is non understandlbe intelectualy. Paradox galore but one thing, it is not confusing to know that there are somethings that one cannot understand with the mind but have to be experienced.