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Old 06-22-2020, 07:02 AM   #2401
Yeodan
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Re: ***Official Staking Discussion Thread: Use this thread for staking advice/questions***

I'm looking for tips to get live staking.

I don't really know anyone on this forum in-person.
I'm not an online player, so I don't have fancy stats or graphs to show (I do not enjoy playing online, this is not an option for me!)

I do play a lot of live and I think I'm beating most of the low stakes games, but I don't have the money to play them often enough to have meaningful results.

So I need to find someone who believes poker is a good investment and has the money to stake me while I'm still learning and improving without knowing if I'm actually a winning player or not.

I do believe I'm currently a winning player, I've been playing for a long time, I have some, but no meaningful, good results in live games.

Even if I'm not a winning player, I'm willing to put in the time and effort to play a TON and study/review a lot, so I believe I will become a winner/crusher if I can keep playing.


Basically I'm looking for someone who can afford to lose some money but will keep faith in me while I'm grinding live games.
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Old 01-10-2021, 09:23 PM   #2402
GundamPoker
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Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

Greetings, I am seeking feedback on 2 questions.

I searched the forum for "staking agreements" to find the typical rules for staking that most people use. I understand that they can be highly varied, but surely there is a generic set of rules that is most typical. I was unsuccessful at finding anything.

Question 1: Where is a good source that list common staking agreements/rules?

Question 2: What do you think of these rules for staking a friend for a set amount (not a continuing stake situation but with a fixed initial amount)?

() Bankroll the Player X amount.
() Before any profits are taken, original X would be paid back to staker.
() First X amount of profits goes 100% to Staker if player decides to quit early
() Second X amount of profits goes 100% to Player if player decides to quit early
() If Staker decides to quit, all profits are split 50/50.
() All profits beyond 2X are split 50/50 until either player or staker decides to end deal when either player decides to quit

Here's how it would work if both players quit deal when expected:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bank roll to $3000
Player pays Staker $2000 ($1000 stake, $1000 profit) and keeps $1000 profit.

Here's how it would work if player decides to end deal early.
Example 1:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player decreases bankroll to $700
Player decides to quit, player gives staker all $700

Example 2:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2000
Player decides to quit, player gives staker all $2000

Example 3:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2200
Player decides to quit, player gives staker $2000 and keeps $200

Example 4:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $4000
Player decides to quit, player gives staker $2500 and keeps $1500 (splitting profits)

Here's how it would work if Staker decides to quit early
Example 1:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player decreases bankroll to $700
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker all $700

Example 2:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2000
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker $1500 and keeps $500 (splitting profits)

Example 3:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2200
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker $1100 and keeps $100 (splitting profits)

Example 4:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $4000
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker $2500 and keeps $1500 (splitting profits)
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Old 01-11-2021, 07:24 AM   #2403
PokerPlayingGamble
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

I dislike it, the player should be able to quit without penalty any time they are even or better.
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:51 AM   #2404
GundamPoker
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble View Post
I dislike it, the player should be able to quit without penalty any time they are even or better.
Thanks for your input! I appreciate it.

Do you happen to know of a source or a standard staking method?
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:43 AM   #2405
PokerPlayingGamble
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

50/50 split of profits, with makeup. horse can quit any time he has cleared makeup. backer can quit any time, but if he quits while in makeup the makeup disappears.
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Old 01-14-2021, 01:19 AM   #2406
GundamPoker
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble View Post
50/50 split of profits, with makeup. horse can quit any time he has cleared makeup. backer can quit any time, but if he quits while in makeup the makeup disappears.
Thanks! That is simple. Trying to figure out if backer's risk/reward is hurt by this if horse is above rake player. I think it is.
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Old 01-15-2021, 03:41 AM   #2407
nab76
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

Examples 1-3 for when the player decides to quit are all wrong in my (and I feel like pretty much everyone elses) opinion.

Example 1, player should owe 300 if they want to quit.

Examples 2-3, no reason staker should be getting anymore than 50% of the profit.

Feel like what you are looking for doesnt exist, like there isnt a industry best practices list for staking somewhere. But I think pretty much everyone has the same rules:

Staker can quit at any time but if he quits while player is in makeup, he eats the loss.

Player can quit at anytime, but if he is in makeup he owes that. No penalty for quitting while ahead.
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Old 01-19-2021, 10:44 PM   #2408
Tarheel234
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

I agree with everything nab just said, was about to post that myself.
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Old 01-23-2021, 06:37 PM   #2409
PokerPlayingGamble
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

Quote:
Player can quit at anytime, but if he is in makeup he owes that.

50% of makeup is a better buyout imo, because if the stake is overall in profit this results in a 50/50 split of all profits. Even if the stake is in a loss, here the backer gets to recover some of his losses without risk of going further into the hole.
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Old 02-06-2021, 04:18 AM   #2410
GundamPoker
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Re: Staking Resources (typical staking deals)

And... if the bankroll goes to zero... Does the horse have to make up the entire amount? Isn't that just a loan?
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Old 02-12-2021, 12:13 AM   #2411
PokerPlayingGamble
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Re: ***Official Staking Discussion Thread: Use this thread for staking advice/questions***

That's not how it works. The backer has to reload so the horse can keep playing, otherwise the arrangement is ended and the player owes nothing.
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Old 06-21-2021, 07:25 AM   #2412
ImCooperMan
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Re: ***Official Staking Discussion Thread: Use this thread for staking advice/questions***

Hi Everyone... new member here.

I've been playing MTTs recently with some degree of success. Obviously everyone dreams of giving up their day job and tackling poker full time and I'm no different.

I know I'm very early in term of volume and sample size etc... But I wanted to ask -

What sample size and ROI % would be needed to start looking for staking (and have a decent chance of success)?

Current sample - https://ibb.co/92Qvr74

Last edited by ImCooperMan; 06-21-2021 at 07:48 AM.
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Old 06-22-2021, 10:55 AM   #2413
JSkelts
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Re: ***Official Staking Discussion Thread: Use this thread for staking advice/questions***

Is there a way to handle rakeback thats considered standard? Is it all the stakee's or does it also get split according to the deal?
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Old 06-22-2021, 02:55 PM   #2414
The Apex
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Re: ***Official Staking Discussion Thread: Use this thread for staking advice/questions***

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSkelts View Post
Is there a way to handle rakeback thats considered standard? Is it all the stakee's or does it also get split according to the deal?

Usually split just like profits.
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