just gotta figure out a correct percentage for each party now.


gl

hi, im looking for a stake for $11 hu sng's. I cant however create a new thread in the staking forum. Not sure why but would be gratefull if you could resolve this please

when ppl stake on stars how do you split fpps, i know you cant transfer them so you make the horse play sattys but when do you tell them to do this? I mean if they are playing x sngs for you at the end of that stake do you make them play for the value of the fpps?

i would say 25%

How -EV it is to have to 2 stakee playing on the same table? What about SnG?

Question about live tournament staking and force major reasons missing the tournament.

player A buys a share of player B for live tournamet in another country.
Player B buys tournament tickets and sets everything up.
Then there is a force major reason for missing the tournament (say the flights are canceled)

What would be de-facto standard to handle this?

1) player B has the responsibility to show up to tournament. He bears all the risks that are included in getting there. He will pay shares back.
2) Buying shares includes a risk that there is force major obstacle. Player A dose not get a refund.

Please advice!

make them play their 500 game set er whatever, than after just have them grind them out in the 280 hypers er something. they unreg from the mtt, and get the T$. and than you buy the T$ from them at face value thus putting cash in their account.

Hi guys, can you give me some help

I'm looking forward to make a stacking deal with a friend of mine and we're trying to figure out some fair %
(I'm not asking for a deal, I just want some info)

How much would you ask in terms of %profits/%rakeback to a modest nl100 winner who wants a 50% stake to play nl200? (eventual losses are divided equally of course, what about profits?)

ty

I registered on this site over 6 months ago but have not posted very much and don't know anybody on here so do I put up staking requests on the thread for <6 months?

Cheers Sean

you can do that or apply for marketplace approval.
for reasons I won't go into it could take a bit longer than usual to get approval (for anyone, not specifically you) right now.

Sorry what is market place approval and how do I go about this. I am also not sure how to copy & paste my sharkscope figures and graphs - it doesn't turn out correctly? Sorry to be a nuisance.

Sean (charwell)

i have a question for all of you that are of the opinions that stakees have a sort of obligation to get out of makeup. Why is that ?

Say a stake is for 200nl for 20k hands after 5k hands, bad downswing of 25BI, why would stakee have to play lower ? Why does he have to get out of makeup ? if the deal is 20k hands 200nl, why would he have to drop down ?

Whats the big deal of steaks ending with losses ? I think it happens as often as with profits and should be treated the very same way as if a stake was ending on profit.
Staking is risky for the backer. If the stakee has to grind back at lower limits it shouldnt be called stake, but loan.

all assumptions are made for arguments sake and arent necesserily realisitc.
opinions appreciated.

lol

thats my opinion on your post

I mean generally this type of stuff should be covered in some agreement beforehand, but ostensibly the staker and horse are working with each other and for the relationship to go as well as possible the horse shouldn't be a dick about something like this.

If a horse throws away a backing arrangement by refusing to try to accomodate a backer in a spot like this it's something that should definitely follow the horse.
On the other hand if the backer doesn't protect himself with some language in the agreement covering this it's a pretty dumb way to approach business.

horse A gets a stake...starts off bad and than just tanks the rest cause "hey, who cares, i dont owe him anything and i can just get another stake"

horse A gets another stake, same thing happens.


horse A gets another stake and does well under backer and makes a little money. they do another set, and he tanks again and at the end doesnt care and just wants to move on to another staker.



seems like a good way to lose a ton of money in backing.

1) Sorry how do I get market place approval and what is it?

2) How do I copy and paste my Sharkscope graph?



I am a genuine, considerate and very profitable MTT player. However, I have never sought staking before as profits just supplemented my income. However, now I wish to play full time poker and to make that leap I am looking for some sort of staking option with a good backer.

Thanks in anticipation

I'm considering staking/coaching a good friend who currently has very limited poker knowledge:

I want to give him $1,000 and personally coach him and monitor his progress. I will make videos for him and sweat him constantly. Basically 4-6+months of training for what will eventually be a 6-figure semi-full time job for him.

Obviously I want to help my friend, but also gain financially from this endeavor. What do you think is a good deal? i.e. coached till 20,000$ BR and I get 10,000$ when done .... or 5,000$ on the first 10k he makes?

Every time I hear an assumption of profit, problems ensue.

I mean you're putting a pretty big expectation on an inexperienced friend here, and have no procedure laid out for when things go poorly.

It's pretty hard for a person to make their first 10K in poker, and a lot of people find that they're not up to it for many different reasons. If I'm reading this right you're giving him 4 months to get it done.

I'd do it more gradually, give the guy a small stake at a set level and coach him for free.

Chop at set amounts/hands but with shorter intervals so the next step always seems attainable.

Let him chop and quit any time he's in profit and explain to him clearly how makeup works. Let him know if you expect him to always grind such an amount back(which you of course will and is std), and what you expect of him if he is unable to do so.

Clearly state a % of total profit that you both will receive.

Retain the right to quit the stake and receive the staked funds back if you feel the deal is no longer working out.

Set up regular coaching sessions and state that you both must agree before he moves up in stakes.

I'm not the most experienced at this but I've seen a number of people get into bad spots because they didn't completely understand their obligations. Particularly between friends as ppl find the conversation uncomfortable, and assume knowledge that the other party simply doesn't have.


It's not just about protecting yourself a little if he goes degen, I've actually seen problems arise from guys trying to be too decent with each other over deals they never thought enough into and/or discussed properly.

All that said, ppl say to not stake good friends for a reason. If he's a close friend I personally wouldn't do it. You're expectations just seem too high.

Hope this helps.

Bren,

Thanks for the advice. I was hoping there was just a standard staking 'contract' (for friends/non-friends) that I could just copy and paste to my buddy. i.e. what to do if the money is lost, what my/his obligations are, etc. I guess I just have to sit down and think about this.

The 1k$ is not a big deal for me at all. Out of all my friends this is the only person I would trust to ever become good at poker and have the mental control to not become a degen with someone else's money. So basically I don't mind losing it as long as he sticks to the boundaries of our deal, i.e. only playing .10/.25$ stakes until we agree he's ready to move up. I guess when we talk about it I must make sure he understands I am his coach and he shouldn't do anything unless I say it's okay for him to do it.

Assuming that is understood, I still don't know what to do regarding profits. What is fair? The 4-6 months I mentioned was the period with which I help him the most on improving (let's say move to .5/1$ stakes). At that point I am still his coach but he plays mostly on his own. I don't expect him to have a 10k or 20k bankroll for a year and I understand that is still a relatively pretty high expectation. I think a good deal for him would be me only taking 5k on the first 10k.

I'm trying to imagine a situation where this could get ugly and I can see it happening if he strays from the stakes we decide on and loses money, or tilts away a bunch of money at normal stakes and I start feeling he's not taking this seriously. Then if I call the stake off and ask for my money back or he wants to immediately chop ... could get ugly/awkward etc.

So I think the important thing is for me to stake w/ an amnt I don't care about losing and won't feel the necessity to call off the stake/get angry w/ my friend. And even though there's a small % of a chance it could still happen, the % of him succeeding and changing his life seems more worth it.

So I think I'll give him 1k + coaching and he gives me 5k on the first 10k. If I see him playing other stakes I can call it off immediately and he must give me all the money in his account. Other than that I try to act casual in regards to the money and if he tilts I'll let it serve as an expensive lesson for him. If he somehow losses all the money it was just a poor investment on my part and I'll try not to let the results affect our relationship.

Impossible endeavor or ... >?

Too hard to say. Personally I'd want shorter intervals between chops for the reasons I stated above, but that may be a matter of taste.

you could front weight your cut a bit if the revenue stream will continue after your time commitment cuts back.
If he doesn't get to the long run it protects your investment a little bit more and I don't think hurts his chances of seeing the long run by discouraging him.

For the right horse it also motivates them to get to that longer run where the deal is better for them.

a friend of mine has bin pretty interested in poker the last year, hes 19 lives at home and dosnt have a job, hes bin a winning player in $1/45's and $2/180's over his first 100 games playing on my PC with me telling him what hes doing wrong and a little reading. Anyway he agreed to play around 500 games for me (mostly $3.25/45's, $2/$4/180's in exchange for me buying him a nice referbished PC ($210),

so i got it, he had cashed out his stars account a while ago so I am staking him for the micro MTT's and decided this would be a fair deal

70/30 in backers favor, must play a min 500 games (with makeup), if horse fails to win a min. $500 within the 500 games, the remaining amount owed must be paid in order for the deal to end

during the staking period Il be supplying him with great reading material to improve his game and going through hand history's. With a little effort I think in about a year he could be where im at now (winning $20k+ in 09 grinding MTT's partime)

sound good?

Might want to clarify that b/c it reads like he owes you $500 in makeup on a $210 PC.

Is that right or did I misunderstand?

the $500 is for the PC and our profit which we will chop 70/30 (with the $210 for the PC coming out of my 70%). SO he has to win the min $500 to pay for for me buying him the PC upfront, if I hadnt bought the PC the deal would be 55/45 with makeup and no min $500 profit

Oh I get you now