While I don't need to hear about every little weird PM, if you guys receive some that are obviously very sketchy, feel free to PM me about them. Better for everyone if we get rid of the scammers.

Say one of my cash stakees wants to play some sunday mtts. He is EV+ in the field but is still a cash game player over an mtt grinder.

What kind of %age split should we be working on for:
a) entries
b) winnings

FWIW he has a 50-50 (on stars, we share FPPs etc) 100k hand deal

I'm new to this term in staking. For example selling wsop action at 1.2 -1. I understand laying odds but want to make sure I understand completely what this means. Someone care to give an example for me?

Thanks,
Nate

means u pay 1.2 times face value. so if you are buying 1000 in action you must pay 1200 cuz there is a 20% markup due to there perceived edge.

oh wow i thought it was the opposite that's insane

so people seriously put money in high risk investments at a 50% cut and a mark up???

When you pay markup you arent putting up the whole buyin just a piece. If you pay someones whole buyin and there is no makeup then you usually get 75 or 80% of their profits after the buyin is returned

or is the mark up a substitute of a backers cut

So would taking a piece of someone at 1.2 - 1 be the same as taking a piece of someone at 83% backers cut?

if you pay 120 for every 100 in action. (mark up would be 1.2-1)

so if you buy 1%, and that costs 120, you get 1% of his cash in that mtt.

In large live events you're usually selling shares, not being staked. Typically shares are sold from even to a slight markup. As Zima said, in a $10,000 buyin, 1% sold even is $100. Sold at markup it will range from $110-$120. Buying 1% entitles the buyer to 1% of any cash the player makes.

Shares are sold at markup for two reasons (one for each side, buyer and player):

Buyer: The buyer pays markup because he believes the player has an edge over the field and is more likely to cash than even money. If he truly believes this he pays the player's markup.

Player: If you can demonstrate that you have an edge, you can charge markup (you can charge markup anyway, but if you can't demonstrate your edge no one will buy your action). The greater your edge, the greater the markup you can charge. Charging 1.2 for 1 will allow you to freeroll the WSOP after selling 83% of your action.

No. You are entitled to a % of the winnings equal to the % of the action you bought as Zima explained above. Here's an example:

A buyer buys 1% of a WSOP player for $120. The player cashes for $27,690. The buyer receives 1%, or $277.

Hope this helps, feel free to post any further questions.

ty JL I got it

any opinions/general thoughts?

50-50 or 60-40 in the backer's favor are standard for long-term MTT backing deals. Since it sounds like he's on a long term 50-50 with you for cash games, it's probably easiest to just make these MTTs 50-50 and lump them both together on the same stake. Though he may not be someone you would back playing MTTs full time, I think since he will have to grind back any MTT losses through playing his cash games it would make sense and be completely fair to do this.

If he doesn't want to have MTT expenses affect his cash game winnings, you could arrange it more like a one-time stake like 75-25 or 80-20 in your favor. I guess another option would be a short term deal like a 65-35 over x amount of tournaments for the next x amount of months. However, these deals are not really as good for you as lumping the MTTs in with his cash games since they can leave you high and dry for his buy-ins a decent amount whereas if he's a winning cash player lumping the the two together on one stake would make it a real rarity. I guess it depends on your bankroll and risk tolerance.

Thank you

I am thinking about staking a friend around 10K for $50-100 MTTs.

My question is, what are the rules behind makeup and no makeup?
Does makeup mean that he would have to pay the 10k back if he lost all of it in the tournies?
And does No makeup just mean I should receive a higher %?

Makeup means that before he profits any money, he has to "make up" what you've spent on him in buy ins. If you've sent him $10k 4 times, then he cashes for 50k, he owes you that 40k, then you split the remaining 10k in profit. With no makeup, he would only owe you whatever you agreed upon and then the split. You should obviously get a much higher percent with no makeup.

hey how do u guys deal when u send money for your stakee br then like you do 50k hands, and they want to extend this agreement(your fine with extending it because they are pretty good players and profitable). SO why question is when do you take the br back once they finish the next one, what if u just keep extending(i dont mind this finding good stakees is hard)?

When is ok to be like yo uve earned so much do u rly need my capital in ur roll cause i got to reinvest this ****?

I'm looking for ideas on how to write a somewhat professional proposal to be staked in an upcoming tournament.

I've been in contact with a company and they've tentatively agreed to cover tourny entry fee in exchange for wearing their company's logo (shirt/hat) during play. They won't be receiving any winnings, its just for exposure.

I just need to submit a proposal.

If there's a template or something that would be awesome!

Do people ever do coaching in exchange for a % of profit in cash? I've seen a fair few coaching/staking deals, but I was wondering if people did coaching just for profit % and no staking for people who already have established a roll grinding MTTs/SNGs? Thanks for any help.

Yes, I've heard of this in MTTs. It's commonly a % of final table finishes like 5%, but the terms will obviously depend on the amount of coaching and other factors involved.

Whenever you come to the end of the agreement and want to extend it, can't you choose to take out any amount of money that is yours and do what you want with it? If they aren't moving up in stakes and have made money then you should be able to split their winnings at the and of each staking term. It's a two-way street so when it comes time to extend your agreement, can't you set whatever terms you like?

Sorry if I have posted this in the wrong place, this was the most relevant thread I could find

I've recently noticed alot of the wsop staking threads with players selling a share of their action over several events and was wondering what kind of bankroll requirements you would need to buy an x% share in these events given that each player will be both +ev and also selling their shares slighly higher than what they bought in for. Also I've noticed many of the people buying shares are doing it on a regular basis and I would be interested in the roi and variance of these investments in general considering the risk can be spread over a number of events etc

thanks

lets say a horse wants to buy a piece of my action in a tournament series but is in makeup. if i win money does any of the horses makeup get cleared??

Greg,

If i understand your question -- there are two things that need to be said:

1) If you want to extend the stake that's fine, but the best approach to do this is to settle up to a certain point and reestablish the stake after that. Stakes up 1k on a $500 stake? Split $500 each (assuming 50/50) and leave $500 in the account, then the stake restarts. This gets some money out for both of you.

2) In the scenario you presented I think you're saying you keep extending, but you're not doing what i suggested in #1. So lets say now there is 3k in the account ($500 stake, $2500 profits). It's never ok to remove your share to reinvest and assume the horse will continue playing for you, unless they remove equal funds as outlined in 1. If you remove funds from them then you're not really staking them anymore.

An alternate scenario is $500 stake, BR is now at $2k ($1500 profit). The horse withdraws $750, you withdraw $250, and now you start a new stake with a starting roll of $1000 (moving up limits etc). PM me if I didn't explain something clearly or to get my AIM sn.