I'm looking for tips to get live staking.

I don't really know anyone on this forum in-person.
I'm not an online player, so I don't have fancy stats or graphs to show (I do not enjoy playing online, this is not an option for me!)

I do play a lot of live and I think I'm beating most of the low stakes games, but I don't have the money to play them often enough to have meaningful results.

So I need to find someone who believes poker is a good investment and has the money to stake me while I'm still learning and improving without knowing if I'm actually a winning player or not.

I do believe I'm currently a winning player, I've been playing for a long time, I have some, but no meaningful, good results in live games.

Even if I'm not a winning player, I'm willing to put in the time and effort to play a TON and study/review a lot, so I believe I will become a winner/crusher if I can keep playing.


Basically I'm looking for someone who can afford to lose some money but will keep faith in me while I'm grinding live games.

Greetings, I am seeking feedback on 2 questions.

I searched the forum for "staking agreements" to find the typical rules for staking that most people use. I understand that they can be highly varied, but surely there is a generic set of rules that is most typical. I was unsuccessful at finding anything.

Question 1: Where is a good source that list common staking agreements/rules?

Question 2: What do you think of these rules for staking a friend for a set amount (not a continuing stake situation but with a fixed initial amount)?

() Bankroll the Player X amount.
() Before any profits are taken, original X would be paid back to staker.
() First X amount of profits goes 100% to Staker if player decides to quit early
() Second X amount of profits goes 100% to Player if player decides to quit early
() If Staker decides to quit, all profits are split 50/50.
() All profits beyond 2X are split 50/50 until either player or staker decides to end deal when either player decides to quit

Here's how it would work if both players quit deal when expected:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bank roll to $3000
Player pays Staker $2000 ($1000 stake, $1000 profit) and keeps $1000 profit.

Here's how it would work if player decides to end deal early.
Example 1:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player decreases bankroll to $700
Player decides to quit, player gives staker all $700

Example 2:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2000
Player decides to quit, player gives staker all $2000

Example 3:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2200
Player decides to quit, player gives staker $2000 and keeps $200

Example 4:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $4000
Player decides to quit, player gives staker $2500 and keeps $1500 (splitting profits)

Here's how it would work if Staker decides to quit early
Example 1:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player decreases bankroll to $700
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker all $700

Example 2:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2000
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker $1500 and keeps $500 (splitting profits)

Example 3:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $2200
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker $1100 and keeps $100 (splitting profits)

Example 4:
Staker gives Player $1000
Player builds bankroll to $4000
Staker decides to quit, player gives staker $2500 and keeps $1500 (splitting profits)

I dislike it, the player should be able to quit without penalty any time they are even or better.

Thanks for your input! I appreciate it.

Do you happen to know of a source or a standard staking method?

50/50 split of profits, with makeup. horse can quit any time he has cleared makeup. backer can quit any time, but if he quits while in makeup the makeup disappears.

Thanks! That is simple. Trying to figure out if backer's risk/reward is hurt by this if horse is above rake player. I think it is.

Examples 1-3 for when the player decides to quit are all wrong in my (and I feel like pretty much everyone elses) opinion.

Example 1, player should owe 300 if they want to quit.

Examples 2-3, no reason staker should be getting anymore than 50% of the profit.

Feel like what you are looking for doesnt exist, like there isnt a industry best practices list for staking somewhere. But I think pretty much everyone has the same rules:

Staker can quit at any time but if he quits while player is in makeup, he eats the loss.

Player can quit at anytime, but if he is in makeup he owes that. No penalty for quitting while ahead.

I agree with everything nab just said, was about to post that myself.

50% of makeup is a better buyout imo, because if the stake is overall in profit this results in a 50/50 split of all profits. Even if the stake is in a loss, here the backer gets to recover some of his losses without risk of going further into the hole.

And... if the bankroll goes to zero... Does the horse have to make up the entire amount? Isn't that just a loan?

That's not how it works. The backer has to reload so the horse can keep playing, otherwise the arrangement is ended and the player owes nothing.

Hi Everyone... new member here.

I've been playing MTTs recently with some degree of success. Obviously everyone dreams of giving up their day job and tackling poker full time and I'm no different.

I know I'm very early in term of volume and sample size etc... But I wanted to ask -

What sample size and ROI % would be needed to start looking for staking (and have a decent chance of success)?

Current sample - https://ibb.co/92Qvr74

Is there a way to handle rakeback thats considered standard? Is it all the stakee's or does it also get split according to the deal?

Usually split just like profits.

I've never really been staked before and I'm very curious what the "marketprice" for being staked is.

I've got a deal with a friend that I am not sure I am getting the right deal, everytime I mention it people seem a bit squeamish.

I'm playing on Pbros with 70/30 no downside. If I lose I am just in markup, I don't owe anything. I get 0 rakeback.

I know stakes are really variable, so I am just curious if I should be fighting for more edge. This was his first offer and I just took it. So I think I could be getting a slightly better deal.

Interested to hear anyone's thoughts. I've been a live pro for a while but looking to get into the online game.

Cheers

it depends a lot if its only backing or does it involve more time from the backer's part
If it's only a "passive" investment from him , it makes sense to offer very good players a better deal than average without having to coach and invest more of his time
however for somebody to receive a 60-70% the player needs to check some boxes like
crusher/proven winner over big sample
good reputation and trusted in the community or hard vouch

for your actual deal
I would also take this deal if most of my winnings are from win rate and only 10-20% of total win rate comes from RB
if however you're putting in 25-30K hands per month with 2-3bb at 200nl+
I would like to get some % of the RB cause rake is high and you'll be paying 2-3k in rake or more on that sample size

Looking for stake for 25/50 - 50/100 live cash at EPT London next week - can share screennames in PM I play 5/10 on euro sites and ignition and have been coached by a great HS player for a year (can share more in detail along with graph) have 4bb/100 at 5/10

Have multiple fairly known references of character in poker scene too

What's the health of the live MTT staking arena in the U.S? Are there still larger stables operating that recommend and put people together at tournament stops, offer some coaching and HH review?

Looking for stake on poker bros plo cash tables 1/2 if you stake me I'm happy to give 70% winning to the staker and 30% for my self I'll be playing 12 hour sessions as well Kind Regards

Hello

I’m looking voor potential staking on GGPoker

My main traffic is flip&go and hypers, mixed with some regular mtts
I preferably become part of a stable. That environment with pokerminded people would be interesting for me and the must profitable path for both parties.

I play almost solely on gg for legal reasons, but there are a few other options.

On gg I grind between $100 and $360 a day onthe leaderboards next to rakeback

Hello,

I have an opportunity with a very big company in Vegas to be staked for Tournaments. The sponsor people in several industries, and I'm aspiring to be their official poker player. I am moving to town and I am in the process of putting together my proposal and agreement. I come from a marketing background and could be an asset for this company to be marketed in a whole new industry, the thing is, they don't necessarily need me, its just interesting to them. So what I am trying to do is think of all the ways that I can be valuable to them, and try to find ways to monetize any business I send their way. It has to be perfect, for they are perfectionists.

On the other hand, I am asking for a 100k in tournament runs, 50/50 w/makeup. I am trying to figure out the best ways to put that money aside, where I can access it anytime, without having to ask for each tournament run. I want to make them comfortable with this. I must add that I have never been staked before. Also, if I receive the 100k for runs, when i cash, i will have to have a formula on how to pay the makeup if I originally have 1 lump sum.

I've been taking my time with this, trying to educate myself, so I do it perfectly. I need this, I currently have zero bankroll due to some tough times. I'm coming to Vegas because that's where I can utilize my skillsets and get my life back. Not just in poker, my experience and skills in marketing, hospitality sales, nightlife, and networking abilities make Vegas the place for me to be., I have a strong network in and out of poker there and am very excited to build my poker network more.

Thanks in advance!

You can keep front money on account at the casino you expect to play the most at. Just needs to come from (if not cash) a personal bank account with your name on it.

I'm interested in finding a live stake for Los Angeles card rooms. I've been playing for about 18 years and played full time for a couple years. I'll play anything from 1-3 to 10-20 and am closest to Bicycle, Hustler, or Hollywood Park. Please pm me if interested and would be happy to discuss any of my knowledge/history of playing

Hey guys. I’m going to be staked for online cash by a non-poker playing friend. We plan on the deal lasting for 300k hands and splitting profits after every 25k hands. Trust is not an issue and I am a proven winner. Does 70/30 profit split in my favor sound reasonable? Also I’m really struggling to find a fair way to settle possible makeup for the last 25k hands. If I am in makeup when the deal has ended it sounds unfair for me as a player to have to pay back the entire makeup when the deal is over. On the other hand, if backer takes all the risk then I can see the player getting incentives that are negative for the backer. Let’s say I am in makeup with 5k hands remaining I could just start playing extra aggro taking lots of big -EV high variance spots to try to get even and then make a profit for the last 25k hands without any downside if it doesn’t work out. Would appreciate anyone attempting to provide clarity in this situation.

70/30 is you taking advantage of your friend imo. 50/50 is industry standard.


any time the horse chooses to repay markup rather than play it out, it should be at a discount of 50%.





What you are describing are agency costs, and they are a definite problem with poker staking. What happens is at times the interests of the horse and the backer are diametrically opposed, or at least not aligned. Probably the better solution is short term staking contracts with a higher cut for the backer and no makeup. Or if you were to join the bankroll as an investor, this would temper the problem somewhat.

Anyway, I would recommend no fixed time period, 50/50 split of all profits, either stake or stakee can end the stake any time it is in profit, but horse cannot end the stake if there is makeup without buying out the makeup at 50%.