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3-Bet by shorty with jacks 3-Bet by shorty with jacks

08-18-2020 , 06:44 PM
$2-5 home game. One limper. I have JcJd in HJ. I make it $25 to go. Button has $250 and makes it $75. He usually plays in a home game that is $0.25/$0.50 or $0.50/$1.00. He buys in short and plays tight. SB has $500 and calls. Action back to me. I have SB covered. My gut is tell me to rip it and get it in vs shorty, but I am convinced if he calls it's a pair larger than mine or AK. If I call, do I ever extract enough from SB to justify the call?
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08-18-2020 , 06:56 PM
So, no info whatsoever on SB? Even just his age/race would kinda help
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08-18-2020 , 09:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmay28
So, no info whatsoever on SB? Even just his age/race would kinda help
White. 40s. No real reads. Seems reasonable.
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08-18-2020 , 10:23 PM
100bb effective rip it in.
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08-19-2020 , 02:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RodionRaskolnikov
$2-5 home game. One limper. I have JcJd in HJ. I make it $25 to go. Button has $250 and makes it $75. He usually plays in a home game that is $0.25/$0.50 or $0.50/$1.00. He buys in short and plays tight. SB has $500 and calls. Action back to me. I have SB covered. My gut is tell me to rip it and get it in vs shorty, but I am convinced if he calls it's a pair larger than mine or AK. If I call, do I ever extract enough from SB to justify the call?
Rough.

How tight is BU? How wide do you think he 3bets OTB? Because if he's not 3betting TT or AQ (as many tight players won't do) you're not looking too good with JJ. With just BU, depending on how tight we think he is, this should almost be a nitty fold. With extra money in the pot and an extra target should we hit, JJ becomes a set mining hand, which means its a call.
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08-19-2020 , 10:43 AM
Flat calling doesn't work. Stacks are not deep enough for there to be enough to win even if you do get action from SB and that is going to be hard to get.

Having SB involved actually makes this an easier fold. Against button alone this will mostly be small +EV to small -EV depending on his range. SB has to be really bad before he helps you EV but can easily make it much worse if he is trapping with a big pair.
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08-19-2020 , 12:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TB27
Rough.

How tight is BU? How wide do you think he 3bets OTB? Because if he's not 3betting TT or AQ (as many tight players won't do) you're not looking too good with JJ. With just BU, depending on how tight we think he is, this should almost be a nitty fold. With extra money in the pot and an extra target should we hit, JJ becomes a set mining hand, which means its a call.
He’s tight. Like, I put his range at JJ+, AK, AQ. That’s it. I’ve played with him enough to know that this is a fair estimate.
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08-19-2020 , 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RodionRaskolnikov
He’s tight. Like, I put his range at JJ+, AK, AQ. That’s it. I’ve played with him enough to know that this is a fair estimate.
surely SB is bad if he is CC'ing a 3bet OOP. have you seen him CC from blinds before?
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08-19-2020 , 02:20 PM
I think this is at worst a slightly profitable jam.

You lose less than 4BBs when you get all in with just the BTN (according to the range you put him on). In a 3 way all-in you retain your equity well, and you have a strong equity advantage in the side pot vs the SB. Factor in the times when the BTN folds something like AQ and you take down the pot (not to mention when the SB calls off the jam heads up when you have 60+% equity), and I think that more than compensates for the initial 4BB loss.

Play around with a few different ranges and percent actions in an equity calculator, and I think you'll see it's a winning play.

Also, calling doesn't make sense to me. You don't have the odds to set mine only. You have very little maneuverability postflop because the BTN is short and has position on you.
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08-19-2020 , 05:40 PM
Jam is a punt vs tight 3b range. Yawn fold.
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08-19-2020 , 11:13 PM
Against a range of {JJ+, AQ+} we are +EV to GII if SB is dead money. IME 3! cold calls are usually capped ranges.

Any time we get BU to fold we’re winning more because every hand in the range you assigned is getting odds to call. I doubt he’s ever folding though given pot odds. He’s also likely calling off if he 3-bet a worse pair.
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08-20-2020 , 12:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuadJ
Flat calling doesn't work. Stacks are not deep enough for there to be enough to win even if you do get action from SB and that is going to be hard to get.

Having SB involved actually makes this an easier fold. Against button alone this will mostly be small +EV to small -EV depending on his range. SB has to be really bad before he helps you EV but can easily make it much worse if he is trapping with a big pair.
Right, of course. Need to call $50 so we'd need to win $500 for set mining. Definitely a fold then.
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08-20-2020 , 03:16 PM
I folded. Hand played out. Button I’d pocket kings.
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