I have a lot of history with villian, we are both capable of bluffing and we 3bet each other very light
4 handed
Around 1100 effective, 2/5 game
UTG limps im on BTN with AKo i make it 20, villian in SB makes it 70 folds around to me i make it 200, he tanks and raises to 500, i tank and shove for 600 more and he calls with AA
Is this just a cooler or could i have avoided it?
Feedback would be much appreciated

4b smaller.

Once he puts in the 5b/half his stack 200bb deep i let it go.

You’re seeing KK+ here 90% of the time

4b should be like 170 or you can Just call and 4b bluff worse hands like aq

One thing I’ve learned over the years is that no matt r how light people 3b their 4/5b/gii range is still super duper tight in most cases

I just don’t think people do this with QQ/JJ/AQ enough to show a profit. I prob flat and like above posted said use AJ/AQo for bluffs

Yep, nobody 5! bluffs at 3/5. At best, you're up against JJ/QQ, but most of the time it's going to KK+.

It's a mixed strategy hand. You should 4-bet to ~160 some of the time, call some of the time. You're folding to a 5-bet every time though, and that doesn't mean your 4-bet was a bluff. If the dynamic is as you say, he will flat with a range that your hand does fine against.

The utg limp makes the spot far tighter than if you had opened the button though, so I'd probably flat more frequently than re-raising based on the conditions.

Once we 3b! AKo and get 4 bet isn’t there merit to dumping the hand?
The only way I’m still playing to that 4b might be AK suited in which case I’m flatting and seeing a flop??

We didnt 3b. We 4b this hand.

But generally, yes live we should be letting go AKo to a 4b in most cases.

This 100%

Lol @ folding AK 4 handed against an aggressive villain

Even 200bb deep..

The only reason to get away is he made a very dumb 5 bet and chose an even dumber sizing for it ..

But whatever..I would still put it in ..you will have 4 bet bluffs that have to fold..can't start folding AK

I agree with the smaller 4 bet sizing ..200 is too big

Also agree with Renton that 200bb deep, ako is not 4 bet at 100% ..but the times that we do 4 bet it, I am not inclined to back down. The math gets too tight if you only stack off with kk+ ..and if you can fold AK ..you can fold kk to the 5 bet imo.

AK is a drawing hand, it is not a made hand we 3! and 4! it as a bluff because we have blockers to the nuts and it does play better heads up. When we see all the people at the world series go crazy with AK it is usually because they are a big stack or they are short stacked. Think about the SPR and if you are really committed to the pot, are you deep stacked or short stacked? AK suited or unsuited in my book is just a call for a 3! or 4! and sometimes a fold once we get 4! unless we already have 50% of our stack in. I learned my lesson the hard way a a beginning player. I ran into AA twice and decided to slow my roll with the good ole AK. Anyone else's thoughts on this hand?

People just don't 5-bet bluff frequently enough in live poker. It's one of those well-established tacit softplay agreements that regs have: they're paying obscene rake playing 25-30 hands per hour. They aren't risking 200bb to win 2bb. And if this opponent is one of the exceptions to that, OP would certainly know it by now and it would invalidate posting the thread at all.

Would you fold kk to the 5 bet? You need 40% to stack off here. If he doesn't have ak or qq, kk is only about 23% against his range of kk+.

-what is his limp/raise range?
-how does he play this range vs a 4bet?
-how does he play this range vs a call?

I'd lean towards calling the 3bet.

It's a huge mistake to talk in absolute terms about 22 combos when ranges are this narrow, and you're doing it both ways here. In terms of weighing his range, KK is a coinflip against KK+/AKs and 50% of AKo/QQ, whereas AKo is 35% against those. What we're really protecting against is him being able to ship bluffs with impunity, and KK is doing far better against any bluffing range than AK is.

In terms of weighing our own range, you're talking in absolute terms about whether we should shove 2.1% of hands or 0.5% of hands. It should be obvious how that's a huge mistake. Assuming we need to continue like 45% here, the former of those can sustain a 4.7% 4bing range, which is almost a 20% 4bing frequency in this spot and is like TT+/AK/AQs/A2s/T9s+ all at a 100% frequency, which is probably overkill. The latter can sustain a 1.1% 4!ing range (which would be like a 4% 4!ing frequency), so you're getting exploited even if you only 4! KK+/AKs.

It's compulsory to call KK and AKs at the very least. I do like to get away with as much 4!ing as I can here, since SB is going to have a super linear range because it's such a ****ty spot for him to flat much, so I like to continue with AK/QQ when possible. You could sustain a 15% 4! percentage by iso'ing <25% here and calling with QQ/AKo like 25% of the time, so that's pretty groovy if you ask me.

Incorporating an overlimping range would be a total game-changer, as you'd be isoing far less of your fold-to-3! range, but obviously that would leave the top of your range compromised.

UTG l/f'ed; SB 3! cold.

Ah ok, I misread hand. I'd still be asking myself the same questions.

I can't count how many times I've suggested a smaller 4bet on this forum, but I don't really mind OP's sizing.

FWIW throughout my low stakes career (1/2 and even up to 2/5) I’ve done extremely poorly with QQ/AK in my 4b/call it off range. it’s just always AA and KK and for some villains AA only.

Don’t think I felt great about getting it in with KK until I started 5/10

No way, AK calls 4bets fine.

As said, this is a mixed hand. Slightly smaller sizing is good, but people should be 3betting sb linear, and we're very deep with a narrow range, so we shouldn't go too small. 180 is fine.

Not only do people not 5b bluff much, people especially don't 5b bluff when they commit themselves. As played I'd fold. 4b/folding a value hand is fine, as long as your range isn't dominated by AK that 4b/fold. If you're going to defend some of them, pick your suited ones.

OOP would be a different matter altogether. As it is, your raise vs limp is tighter than open, so you're already tighter, which makes villain's 3b tighter (especially as a lot of hands that may 3b would now flat to play multiway with the fish), after he 3bets, you have the option to flat a bunch of your hands being so deep, which means you have less incentive to have a big 4bet frequency. If this was sb vs bb it'd be quite different.