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5/5/10/20 3b IP spot 5/5/10/20 3b IP spot

05-25-2019 , 01:50 PM
We're Biggest BB in four blind 5/5/10/20 six handed

Weird kinda readless spot w Villain. I've played one session with him around six months ago. Got the impression he was generally tight and waiting for hands; but just generally an above average nit rec. Had an eye on him bc he just sat down 20 minutes ago and he's the biggest unknown at the table for me by far.

We're around 1200 effective
Folds to him in SB1 60, Folds to us w AJs in straddle to 200 he calls
We're polarizing here but a little light. probably KQ+,TT+ and then around half of all the 54s ish stuff + A/K/Wheel stuff
I except him to be capped but linear w the raise and flat. call it JJ-55, A broadway up to AKo from time to time, suited broadway, and maybe 98/87s+ at around a 50% weight

Flop A58r XX
Turn Ao X We bet 125, XR to 375 pretty quickly, we call
River T He snap leads for 500 w like 200 back

hit me

Last edited by sungar78; 05-25-2019 at 02:09 PM.
5/5/10/20 3b IP spot Quote
05-25-2019 , 06:09 PM
Pre is fine pretty sure you’re supposed to just 3x ip but this size is fine
Post flop it’s just a bet for 1/4-1/3 turn it’s the same 1/3 size then you’re supposed to just pile river
As played it’s a pretty easy call down sorry you lost
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05-26-2019 , 10:22 AM
Only thing to discuss here is your check back on the flop, as you should be betting 100% of your range. Sorry you lost...


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05-26-2019 , 11:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipedreamer101
Only thing to discuss here is your check back on the flop, as you should be betting 100% of your range. Sorry you lost...


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That’s not true ^
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05-26-2019 , 08:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lolposting2016
That’s not true ^


Please explain?


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05-26-2019 , 10:26 PM
This spot does not play 100% cbet
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05-27-2019 , 04:54 AM
sorry you lost
5/5/10/20 3b IP spot Quote
05-29-2019 , 02:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sungar78
We're Biggest BB in four blind 5/5/10/20 six handed

Weird kinda readless spot w Villain. I've played one session with him around six months ago. Got the impression he was generally tight and waiting for hands; but just generally an above average nit rec. Had an eye on him bc he just sat down 20 minutes ago and he's the biggest unknown at the table for me by far.

We're around 1200 effective
Folds to him in SB1 60, Folds to us w AJs in straddle to 200 he calls
We're polarizing here but a little light. probably KQ+,TT+ and then around half of all the 54s ish stuff + A/K/Wheel stuff
I except him to be capped but linear w the raise and flat. call it JJ-55, A broadway up to AKo from time to time, suited broadway, and maybe 98/87s+ at around a 50% weight

Flop A58r XX
Turn Ao X We bet 125, XR to 375 pretty quickly, we call
River T He snap leads for 500 w like 200 back

hit me
You mentioned 1200 effective which is pretty shallow. Did you or villain only have that much? What were the stack sizes of the players in between.

I agree you should be betting this flop at a very high frequency. I would be ~$160 on this flop all day. Easy call but we beaten a large amount of the time.
5/5/10/20 3b IP spot Quote
05-29-2019 , 03:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipedreamer101
Please explain?


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I don't know what preflop ranges look like sb call vs str 3bet 60bb deep (not sure many people do lol) but if it's anything similar to the 100bb ranges we actually lose a lot of EV in this spot by betting 100% of our range 1/4 pot.

We have a lot of hands that really want to check, so the benefits of simplifying to a 100% bet strategy don't outweigh the EV loss imo.

FWIW the preferred bet sizing IP on the flop is ~1/4 pot if you're gonna choose one sizing and IP bets about half the time.



@OP nh except for your 3bet is too big pre at 60bb stacks, now easy call river.
5/5/10/20 3b IP spot Quote
05-29-2019 , 11:29 PM
In theory always a call.

In practice, outnitting nits is a special skill to have. One that will make you rich.

Some exploitative points to consider :

It is so hard for a known nit to find bluffs here. Does he have worse for value? I would say unlikely.

Is the straddle part of the announced game? Or is it just there for this round? Kinda makes a difference since $500 is a big bet for a $5/$10 game but not for a $20 blind game.

Keeping some chips back when they are bluffing is very common among rec players. So that points towards this being a bluff.

Snap actions indicate lack of thought. Since it requires a lot of thought to find bluffs here, snap turn raise indicates value.

Evaluate these and some other exploitative probes into his game and arrive at a decision. May be the decision is to call down anyway.

But the whole point of asking this question is to think about these exploits. Any schmuck can realize that AJ is a call theoretically.
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05-30-2019 , 06:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarretman
I don't know what preflop ranges look like sb call vs str 3bet 60bb deep (not sure many people do lol) but if it's anything similar to the 100bb ranges we actually lose a lot of EV in this spot by betting 100% of our range 1/4 pot.

We have a lot of hands that really want to check, so the benefits of simplifying to a 100% bet strategy don't outweigh the EV loss imo.

FWIW the preferred bet sizing IP on the flop is ~1/4 pot if you're gonna choose one sizing and IP bets about half the time.



@OP nh except for your 3bet is too big pre at 60bb stacks, now easy call river.


At 100BB Pio like almost all spots will take a mixed strategy. As you mentioned though we can simplify this by just betting range HU in position & add in the occasional check backs on 456 or monotone type boards witch will yield a neutral EV.


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05-30-2019 , 08:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipedreamer101
At 100BB Pio like almost all spots will take a mixed strategy. As you mentioned though we can simplify this by just betting range HU in position & add in the occasional check backs on 456 or monotone type boards witch will yield a neutral EV.


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05-31-2019 , 07:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipedreamer101
At 100BB Pio like almost all spots will take a mixed strategy. As you mentioned though we can simplify this by just betting range HU in position & add in the occasional check backs on 456 or monotone type boards witch will yield a neutral EV.


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I don't want a neutral EV, I want a positive EV. Where's the solver for that?
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05-31-2019 , 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlindingLaser
I don't want a neutral EV, I want a positive EV. Where's the solver for that?


Betting 100% of the time vs a mixed strategy are both equally +EV ie one isn’t better than the other...


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