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5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot 5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot

09-03-2018 , 06:48 PM
Quote:
but you are saying that calling with anything that makes a flush on this board is not standard pre flop then giving him those hands in his range now


KTcc flatting to a 3bet pre seems significantly worse than flatting with KQcc and even calling with 9Tcc
Well I originally that AcQc and AcJc are very much in his range. Possibly AcKc as well. Now I'm taking your word for it that he can be much wider.

And yes KTs is much worse than KQs, but it's much better than 65s, so I don't know why you would assume he has 65 but not KT. Feels like your preflop ranges are a little non-standard and you're projecting them onto Villain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KT_Purple
seems like ignoring those small details isn't like villain, he's pretty precise, I believe he has more a lot more pairs in his pf range than anything that makes a flush here
I just think he's almost never betting the pairs on the turn.

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Spoiler:

Spoiler:
hero figures that v2 can't have too many flushes here and we get the right price to draw out when he does call, so hero shoves, villain 2 folds....this thread is an open invitation to villain to post his hand if he ever reads this...v1 claimed to have folded 99 and left shortly after the hand...probably actually had QQ or something...ppl lie

Well that's not how I would've played it, but hey, nice hand.

Really bizarre result IMO. If I had to guess he probably was turning a hand like TT/JJ w/o a club into a bluff there. I think that would be a brilliant play against two solid thinking players, but with the fish in the pot, I think it's quite questionable. I'm at a loss for what else could make sense.

I think if there's a lesson to be learned its' that people do weird **** sometimes.
5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot Quote
09-05-2018 , 01:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by poloplaya1414

I think if there's a lesson to be learned its' that people do weird **** sometimes.
The thing i took away from it is that I was pretty much playing perfectly standard, and villains made huge mistakes here.

77 is probably the minimum I can 3bet with but it has to be slightly profitable and mostly correct. V1 didn't 4bet with 99 to get try and get it down to HU and ended up playing a middle pair OOP. This is gonna be extremely difficult for him to realize any of his equity barring a set on a clean board. And even we are liable to just fold and move on on some runouts.

And his open sizing gave him no maneuverability. Too hard to 4bet now and then fold.

I will be c-betting a ton of high flops too, so this just can't be good for him in any way. Standard is to absolutely 4bet. I showed down Q8s for pete's sake.

OTF I think my flat call is completely standard to the re-raise because I have absolutely no other hand to balance a shove with. I'm going to be flatting all of my flush draws here to pull v2 in so I don't think I have a raising range there. To this sizing I don't really have a folding range either. There is literally nothing to do but just call.

Turn villain 1 snap folds top set and the game is on!

People are still making huge and costly mistakes in poker so solid mathematically precise play is still winning
5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot Quote
09-05-2018 , 03:40 PM
Wow a lot of what you're calling standard isn't at all.

4betting 99 preflop is probably spew. It might make sense in some cases, but it's definitely not standard.

Calling flop instead of raising is not standard. You can absolutely raise some of your flushes to balance.

And jamming turn is definitely not standard. IMO it's a mistake that you got bailed out on.

No offense, but I'm just calling it like I see it, and maybe your play made sense given the reads you have, but it's in no way mathematically precise or standard.

Also all the other stuff you're saying like Villains like cold-calling T9s being a given makes me think that you have no idea what constitutes standard play. If I'm the crazy one, someone else speak up, but cold-calling 3bets with T9s and 4betting 99 isn't standard in any games I've played in.
5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot Quote
09-13-2018 , 03:32 PM
It's pretty hard to range v2 given the action. I think turn shove is defensible, especially given the smallish sizing and that hero should always 3! The flop with his exact hand so villain will be betting Against what he views as a much weaker range.

The small sizing semi bluffs also set up a lot of way for hero to get owned on the river and there are a lot of hands we want to deny equity against.
5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot Quote
09-15-2018 , 02:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KT_Purple
this game starts at 250 bb's deep and is often well above that. it's not unusual to see multiple 500bb stacks in this game. at some point it does become unprofitable to shove second set, tho i don't know if 280 effective is enough, it can't be much more than 300bb where we should not go broke without the exact nuts or drawing strongly to the exact nuts. At what stack depth is it ok to just call?

possibly you aren't playing in very very deep games but i'm pretty sure v1 folds everything but 99 or 22 if i shove and i already discounted 22...willing to wager he NEVER plays a flush draw like this
We can raise without being all in. You'd be surprised what small sizing can induce. If I was vill in this hand I'd be raising pretty wide, and continuing further in the hand fairly wide assuming you make it something like 1.2k. Yes, I'm stacking off with bottom set for 2.8k unless you're some kind of special nit.
5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot Quote
09-18-2018 , 02:12 AM
Check raising by V1 (am assuming V1 opened for 50 - you have typo) into the aggressor and a caller is very strong so range narrows to sets plus unlikely overpairs being overplayed. V2 has a draw - unlikely a naked draw. I don't think overcalling the check raise can be anything else.
5/10 Middle set in 3bet pot Quote

      
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