Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Medium-High Stakes Full Ring Discussion of $400+ pot-limit and no-limit and 5/10 live texas hold'em full ring games, situations and strategies

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-25-2017, 11:28 AM   #1
Curryboy
centurion
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 155
5/10 4b pot flop spot

Hero: V tight in session
EP: V loose, passive weak rec
MP: V loose rec, VPIP 80%, with random pf and postflop over aggression. Had ran up 700 to 5k quickly, did make 4K bluff in 4w 3b pot when checked to on Ahi board.

I rz utg+1 with AKto 40(2.7k), EP call (5k), MP sq to 160(5k), I 4b to 525, EP fold and MP quickly call.

23:5

I...

Flop line/size/plan?
Pf thoughts welcome also. Cheers
Curryboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2017, 12:26 PM   #2
diskoteque
Joey Local
 
diskoteque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 30,483
5/10 4b pot flop spot

May bet like 33% pot on flop and give up if calledor just check fold and be super careful when mucking my cards

Not gonna try to triple a crazy rec player off an overpair or bluffcatch him down. May bet flop small to see if he will fold out his AK AQ type stuff but sounds like he is not the type to lay it down easy.

this is a textbook "take -ev, easy line and wait for the fish to hand over his stack drawing dead next orbit" spot imo
diskoteque is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-25-2017, 05:25 PM   #3
jrr63
The Situation
 
jrr63's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Saguaroland
Posts: 3,352
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

I like the 33% or so cbet and give up if raised, check fold turn unimproved, if called on the flop, approach against this type of V. There will be other chances to bust him. Could have just said +1 to Disco's post
jrr63 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 10:33 AM   #4
Avaritia
Confirmed 2500 hour haver
 
Avaritia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Florida
Posts: 10,712
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

I would personally check and not fold vs described villain
Avaritia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 11:11 AM   #5
Curryboy
centurion
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 155
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Yeah I ch to ch jam actually as I felt his Pf range was wide and that he would stab a lot of his air, Ax and likely bet call off his Ax. If he bet calls pairs our equity is still okay.

However he ch behind and I was not sure what to do on a Jd turn?
Curryboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 01:44 PM   #6
Imaginary F(r)iend
veteran
 
Imaginary F(r)iend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 3,081
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

check again imo and probably not folding to a single bet... I'm not sure I'm folding to two bets either. It's a situation where the villain's checking behind range is much stronger than his betting range.

If he checks the turn and then bets a relatively blank river I hate life.
Imaginary F(r)iend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 03:01 PM   #7
Avaritia
Confirmed 2500 hour haver
 
Avaritia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Florida
Posts: 10,712
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Do you check flop as a standard Imaginary friend?

I bet 1/3 folded a 233 flop last weekend vs a good reg and felt like i did something wrong. I always get weirded out in spots where i feel like its a clear bet with an op but burning money with AK (as people over station and overspazz on dry low flops in 3b pots ime)
Avaritia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 03:19 PM   #8
Imaginary F(r)iend
veteran
 
Imaginary F(r)iend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 3,081
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

I would mix it up. X/C a part of my hands and c-bet a part small so they can continue to spazz out, obviously x/f most of the hands that can not take any kind of heat. Probably exploit a bit. It's funny because the shove doesn't rep much, but hands like gutshot+A high seems like a must raise every time

At certain point AK becomes a b/c.

This particular hand against a reg this deep I really don't know, I play a lot online so this doesn't come up. A lot of regs wouldn't have 5-bet range here and a relatively tight 4-bet flat range given the positions so I might not c-bet. On the other hand, I might not 4-bet many AK's here so trying to get rid of a split/weak overpair somehow might be worth it and being OOP sucks.

Last edited by Imaginary F(r)iend; 09-26-2017 at 03:39 PM.
Imaginary F(r)iend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 03:48 PM   #9
diskoteque
Joey Local
 
diskoteque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 30,483
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avaritia View Post
Do you check flop as a standard Imaginary friend?

I bet 1/3 folded a 233 flop last weekend vs a good reg and felt like i did something wrong. I always get weirded out in spots where i feel like its a clear bet with an op but burning money with AK (as people over station and overspazz on dry low flops in 3b pots ime)


You're a good player so prob not telling you anything you don't already know but this resonated with me a bit and felt compelled to reply

I agree it's tough when you have a flop that you would bet 100% of the time with AA but feel like you're never taking down with AK. For me it's become highly dependent on board texture, suits, etc when deciding which AK I'll bet and which AK I'll check/call or check/fold. Also whether or not me hitting my A or K is likely to result in me getting value or not or value owned myself. Sort of like when you have 44 on a 9T2dd flop. Maybe you continue if you have the 4d and fold if you don't, it's splitting hairs.

I know this is all coming out retardedly and microstakes-esque but it makes sense in my head lol. I'm actually pooping at work and bored
diskoteque is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 03:51 PM   #10
Imaginary F(r)iend
veteran
 
Imaginary F(r)iend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 3,081
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

At certain point AK becomes a b/c. 233, opponent has what, 6 combos of fh, 2 combos of trips and 12 combos of A5/A4/45. B/c seems fine.

Quote:
Sort of like when you have 44 on a 9T2dd flop. Maybe you continue if you have the 4d and fold if you don't, it's splitting hairs.
That's not retarded, often when solving the tight spots of the range the difference between calling and folding is bdfd. Sure the difference is typically like a dollar or two max.
Imaginary F(r)iend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 03:54 PM   #11
diskoteque
Joey Local
 
diskoteque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 30,483
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Vs a good player sure

But vs a rec who thinks 99 is the nuts (and will assume you have AK when the K hits and fold) is it a bet? I think it's an exploitable fold.

I think the villain here falls into the latter category. Maybe he's a bit looser and more likely to bluff but I'm just not inclined for my big spot of night vs the fish to be when I have A high
diskoteque is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 04:27 PM   #12
Imaginary F(r)iend
veteran
 
Imaginary F(r)iend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 3,081
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Quote:
Originally Posted by diskoteque View Post
Vs a good player sure

But vs a rec who thinks 99 is the nuts (and will assume you have AK when the K hits and fold) is it a bet? I think it's an exploitable fold.

I think the villain here falls into the latter category. Maybe he's a bit looser and more likely to bluff but I'm just not inclined for my big spot of night vs the fish to be when I have A high
I wouldn't c-bet against a rec AK here and I don't think it's close.
Imaginary F(r)iend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 08:35 PM   #13
Avaritia
Confirmed 2500 hour haver
 
Avaritia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Florida
Posts: 10,712
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Quote:
Originally Posted by diskoteque View Post
You're a good player...
Lol lets not get ahead of ourselves here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imaginary F(r)iend View Post
At certain point AK becomes a b/c. 233, opponent has what, 6 combos of fh, 2 combos of trips and 12 combos of A5/A4/45. B/c seems fine.
Yea, at first i wish i checked but then thinking back on the hand im like wtf could he possibly have? And thought it was more of a bet/call. Hes a great player, prob top 3 winner in my area, and usually not stupid. I thought that even though a raise made no sense he'd know that I'd know that...so i thought a fold is not what he wanted...but that was possibly over leveling and he was just owning me with A5 or whatever.

I have seen alot of "good" players doing this with like 88 in 2017, no idea what thats about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diskoteque View Post
I'm actually pooping at work and bored


And this is why you should never go pro kids. You can literally get paid to sh*t and post on the internet. Why would you ever do anything else?
Avaritia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2017, 11:12 PM   #14
day'n'night
old hand
 
day'n'night's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Alaska
Posts: 1,476
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

x/r
day'n'night is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2017, 10:41 PM   #15
lolposting2016
old hand
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,285
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Pre is good
Flop you wanna bet your whole 4b range for a small size 1/4-1/3 here. This board is rly good for the 4bettor and ur range pwns his right now and checking turns u pretty face up and it's 2 hard to balance a x range
You could pretty easily b/b/jam and make money
Bet small/ x and try and showdown works as well
You probably want to do some of both
Especially cuz you need to have some bluffs when u b/b/jam and ak for some % works well
lolposting2016 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2017, 04:16 PM   #16
Lego05
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 24,150
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Does villain's overaggressive play include excessive 3betting regardless of position dynamics? If not, then I probably just call the 3bet pre-flop given the positions.

As played, I like check/call the flop, especially against this villain as he is described (perhaps depending on the size of his bet). If you bet, he's not going to fold a pair. If he somehow has like 77 or 88, then maybe you could get him to fold with multiple barrels depending on how the board runs out. But it seems like he'll probably bluff here too much, so I'd rather go bluff catching with some equity with a gutshot and the chance to hit a pair of A's or K's. If he barrels 3 streets and we don't improve, then that kinda sucks.
Lego05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2017, 03:58 PM   #17
flopturntree
adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: ur girls crib
Posts: 864
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imaginary F(r)iend View Post
I would mix it up. X/C a part of my hands and c-bet a part small so they can continue to spazz out, obviously x/f most of the hands that can not take any kind of heat. Probably exploit a bit. It's funny because the shove doesn't rep much, but hands like gutshot+A high seems like a must raise every time

At certain point AK becomes a b/c.

This particular hand against a reg this deep I really don't know, I play a lot online so this doesn't come up. A lot of regs wouldn't have 5-bet range here and a relatively tight 4-bet flat range given the positions so I might not c-bet. On the other hand, I might not 4-bet many AK's here so trying to get rid of a split/weak overpair somehow might be worth it and being OOP sucks.
Wizard
flopturntree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2017, 03:59 PM   #18
flopturntree
adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: ur girls crib
Posts: 864
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

In a live game I bet here after 4b pre
flopturntree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2017, 06:19 AM   #19
Curryboy
centurion
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 155
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

[QUOTE=Lego05;52937488]Does villain's overaggressive play include excessive 3betting regardless of position dynamics? If not, then I probably just call the 3bet pre-flop given the positions.

Yes he had been v active 3b 55, 99 from mp vs ep, calling a 4b ip with 99(150bb eff) and doubling up. I think he can 3b AQos+, KQs+, 99+ and also have some random Axs, mid/low pp, sc semi bluffs. I also think he flat my ~3x 4b ip with a large percentage of this range.
Curryboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2017, 06:25 AM   #20
Curryboy
centurion
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 155
Re: 5/10 4b pot flop spot

So I ch flop, he ch back. Turn J. I ch, he bet 900...
Curryboy is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2017, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online