"Stronger" isn't really a helpful term here.

The fundamentals of initiative is that with each bet, the aggressor's range gets more polar and the caller's range gets more middling. If the calling range as a whole had its druthers it would want to get to showdown (or at least more cards) as often as possible as cheaply as possible; the aggressors range wants to keep putting bets in, either to create more opportunities to fold better hands or to maximize value with the TPTK+ range.

Leading, even for a small amount, doesn't help the caller. It just allows the top of the aggressors range to build the pot more quickly while letting the bottom take a stronger bluffing line or even fold a small percentage of its range, exacerbating the aggressor's range advantage.

This is all general theoretical stuff, but there's no reason it doesn't apply here (the 3ber/cbettor has more AK/KK/AA and the 6 didn't help OOP catch up).

So nobody bets the river for value?

He does not have a 9. It would be weird to turn a showdown value hand into bluffy
He could have JJ, QQ. Even AA. He could have a king.
If he’s good, he can def bet for value with the meaty bet with high pair on river. Reason being that, you either believe him or not. If he can bet 1.5-2x more and probability of you calling him does not change drastically, it is +EV to bet big. He knows you do not have a king.
I’m not a range counter yet. Count all his missed draws like AQ, JT, QJ etc and compare them to the hands above. I️ don’t really think he is bluffing, but if he’s good he could be.
And he is likely good since he’s got you on the heater in this big pot.


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There’s no way he is betting a 9 on the river with this sizing.

It’s a very polarising bet. It is a king or air.

It’s not QQ-JJ either.

I think it’s a GTO call but agree that this river is usually underbluffed

I was thinking this too and obv b/f if raised a big number.

0/3

He said 4 things.

Nice find the first point made some sense so 1/4 imo

Sometimes perhaps, but this is just another reason to ckc riv as V might not perceive an average hero as having too many Kx checks. Also, he is just too wide with too many hands that 1/3 pot flop, ck turned equity, pile riv with a clear range adv.

I'm really not sure what it is your saying. You think villain has a strong range advantage after 3betting the button, betting 1/3 pot OTF (likely with close to 100% of his hands), and checking the turn? We still have Kx (including many AK), 99, maybe 33 and even 66.

I would block bet this hand and missed gutshots and attempt to make his ace high hands indifferent to calling.

Meant polarity advantage, not range, which in my mind makes it a more of a ckc than ckf. Still it’s certainly close as I would expect a good opponent to bet down to JJ, perhaps even whatever 9x hands he may have 3bet sometimes.

Leading river looks like the primo play.

Leading riv for like 1/4 pot seems fine.

i really agree with this ^

i think you have to call.
Why does V check the turn?

I dont think he checks the turn with K.

His 3-bet preflop indicates a premium hand.
what are your thoughts on the flop? why float the flop?

Im really afraid of QQ or JJ, he might have the same hand as you.

As played, snap call the river and catalog this villain.


(First post, take it easy on the newbie)


where do we find the results? really interesting

Your hand looks like what it is and it looks like it'll never fold on the K river.

Go all in with your image/read on villain. Your hand sucks for it but the situation is great...

I think betting river is probably best.

I think it’s a fold as played though. I think v’s line is not strong because of the check on the turn, so I think he would have to be on a very high level to do the ‘big bluff bet’ on the river to represent strength. I think he would bet normal sizing for a bluff and ‘big bluff bet’ for value.

I am sorry I am so bad at poker. Call is bad.

Villain now has JJ/QQ.

You can either bluff the river or check/fold. I'd bet $330.

The problem is we really are this lazy. We barrel AK on the turn but not QQ. Because this line is wrong, something must be right. I believe it is wrong for villain to raise preflop without a squeeze. He turns his monsters face up as this hand illustrates.

This looks fine. River is probably 0EV. I would lean call most of the time because if you find that he bets a hand like QQ here then you have gained very valuable info

We should bring back threads from 5+ years ago more often, see how advice has changed over the years.

Oh FFS. Well spotted.

I'm late to the party and play a lot of these type games.

total read on V here as to river.

against unknown we were pre flop aggr and I raise river here big.

if I know the V to be a station ( not sited here in post) then fold