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Medium-High Stakes Full Ring Discussion of $400+ pot-limit and no-limit and 5/10 live texas hold'em full ring games, situations and strategies

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Old 03-15-2018, 01:15 AM   #1
Tiltyjoker
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3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Villain is early 40s asian guy that recently shipped a big WPT main.

Villain opens to $40 in the CO. Hero is $1800 effective with villain and 3bets black QQ to $160. Villain pauses for a few seconds and flicks in a call.

($325) J107
Hero Checks / Villain Checks

($325) J107 9
Hero Checks / Villain bets $300 / Hero Calls

($925) J107 9 7
Hero Checks / Villain bets $525 / Hero?

Thoughts on all streets... Thanks
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Old 03-15-2018, 02:41 AM   #2
lolposting2016
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Effective stacks pls
Anyway more pre like 5x is gonna yield higher ev
Flops fine but bettings is better and again higher ev it’s like always a bet here
Turn std
River as played you need some hands to call w and this is it imo
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Old 03-15-2018, 10:14 AM   #3
diskoteque
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

I would bet flop like 240ish

As played I would probably call
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Old 03-15-2018, 02:02 PM   #4
Tiltyjoker
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Yeah I don’t like my check on the flop. I just thought it would be difficult to bet 3 streets here.... Does this mean I’m not bluffing enough?
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Old 03-15-2018, 04:17 PM   #5
OMGSwineFlu
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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Originally Posted by Tiltyjoker View Post
Yeah I donít like my check on the flop. I just thought it would be difficult to bet 3 streets here.... Does this mean Iím not bluffing enough?
It's difficult to give you a specific answer because we don't know how you're constructing your other ranges in this spot, but I'd be betting QQ given I have enough semi-bluffs with AK,AQ,KQ...
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Old 03-15-2018, 09:33 PM   #6
Tehkid
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

I think betting or checking are both fine. I would agree with lolposting in a normal 100bb eff situation, but being 180bb I think checking is fine. calling river

generally would cbet 100% 100bbs deep but I believe the strategy changes to more defensive lines deepstacked and OOP on this specific board texture
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Old 03-16-2018, 12:12 AM   #7
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Call river. V is putting you on AK/AQ. Most tournament players suck at cash games. So yeah, I'm calling pretty quickly.
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Old 03-16-2018, 02:02 AM   #8
lolposting2016
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Also shoving river would be kinda sweet
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Old 03-16-2018, 02:13 AM   #9
Tiltyjoker
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Thought about it... but doesn’t seem too credible of a line with KQ. I do have JJ in my range, but would much rather have AJ/KJ to pull the trigger

Also, what kind of hands are we putting Villain on the turn? Check flop / ~ pot turn

Last edited by Tiltyjoker; 03-16-2018 at 02:30 AM.
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Old 03-16-2018, 12:58 PM   #10
Jarretman
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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Originally Posted by lolposting2016 View Post
Effective stacks pls
Anyway more pre like 5x is gonna yield higher ev
Flops fine but bettings is better and again higher ev itís like always a bet here
Turn std
River as played you need some hands to call w and this is it imo
Yeah pretty much this. Although I think this flop should be checked very frequently as the 3bettor in this spot 200bb deep. But ya QQ benefits a lot more from betting than KK or AA.
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Old 03-18-2018, 03:05 AM   #11
AllTheCheese
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Shoving river makes no sense. I literally don't know whether it would be meant to be a bluff or a value raise. I guess value since he is clearly never folding trips or better to our practically minraise all-in. But that would be an epic value self-own, since his range for bet/calling the river is way ahead of QQ.
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Old 03-19-2018, 01:14 AM   #12
julien.roy
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

The whole line is fine.

You only lose to 99, I would think JJ/TT would bet this flop often enough for us to discount it.

I guess maybe trapped aces sometimes? either way in my book if you beat his value range you should always call.

You are ahead of AJs, TJs, T9s which could take this line and be value on the river.
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Old 03-19-2018, 11:34 AM   #13
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Results?
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Old 03-20-2018, 01:26 PM   #14
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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Originally Posted by julien.roy View Post
The whole line is fine.

You only lose to 99, I would think JJ/TT would bet this flop often enough for us to discount it.

I guess maybe trapped aces sometimes? either way in my book if you beat his value range you should always call.

You are ahead of AJs, TJs, T9s which could take this line and be value on the river.
There are a few more hands we lose to.
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Old 03-20-2018, 09:50 PM   #15
julien.roy
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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Originally Posted by surf doc View Post
There are a few more hands we lose to.
What hands would villain call a 3bet here with.
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Old 03-20-2018, 11:13 PM   #16
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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Originally Posted by julien.roy View Post
What hands would villain call a 3bet here with.
They are deep. I don't think he folds 88, 78s, 89s, 8Ts, maybe J8s, 68s if he is loose.
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Old 03-21-2018, 12:09 AM   #17
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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They are deep. I don't think he folds 88, 78s, 89s, 8Ts, maybe J8s, 68s if he is loose.
QFT
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Old 03-21-2018, 05:59 PM   #18
lolposting2016
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

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Originally Posted by AllTheCheese View Post
Shoving river makes no sense. I literally don't know whether it would be meant to be a bluff or a value raise. I guess value since he is clearly never folding trips or better to our practically minraise all-in. But that would be an epic value self-own, since his range for bet/calling the river is way ahead of QQ.
Misread stacks if itís a minraise
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Old 03-21-2018, 11:45 PM   #19
iamallin
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Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Correct answer : call

Exploitative Live pro answer : fold

Turn pot followed by river half pot is a very fishy line taken by bad players for value. Since he won a WPT we know he is a bad player ( may be he bought it? Who really knows these days )

Last edited by iamallin; 03-21-2018 at 11:52 PM.
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Old 03-23-2018, 01:57 AM   #20
ReallyRaphy
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Diamond Re: 3Bet QQ OOP 5/10 Live: Line Check

Pre - I like your sizing oop.
Flop - I think I like a cbet better in this spot but if you're trying to strengthen your checking range than that's ok too.
Turn/River - You're blocking nut straight draws and it's hard to imagine him 'value' betting worse on the river but I think a shrug and call on this runout is standard especially now that you have J10 beat and your hand is pretty under repped. If you had cbet the flop I think I would barrel this spot on the turn as you just picked up more outs and you'd probably be ok calling off facing a raise (I'd have to double check stack sizing).
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