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Old 04-14-2019, 05:31 AM   #7026
onedollars
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Originally Posted by Ranma4703 View Post
I've considered it, and that may be what I end up doing; I'm feeling an urge to quit my job because it isn't making me very happy. I may want to make the switch to doing contract work so that it is easy for me to work 10-20 hours a week instead of full time, I may want to work for a non profit, I may want to do something else entirely. I'm having a bit of a mid life crisis (third of life crisis? whatever)

It is less about 'quitting my job to play poker' and more 'quitting my job to find my happiness, with poker as a way to keep my monthly drain on my bank account down'
I don't think your predicament is that rare for our generation (I'm in my mid 30s). I have a bunch of close friends who were funemployed for 1-2 years in their early 30s. Most of them were in tech and made solid money/saved for 8-10 years, weren't married, didn't have kids. The primary motivation varied from boredom, wanting adventure, to feeling burned out, but they were all similar in that they had all worked hard from around age 14 onward and did all the "right things": studied hard and did great in school, then got respectable jobs that paid well. But their jobs weren't fulfilling and each decided they needed an extended break to figure out wtf they wanted out of their lives.

While funemployed, they traveled to wherever they wanted, indulged in their hobbies, spent time with friends and family, and focused on themselves and their happiness. Once they returned to the workforce, they were refreshed, much happier, and ended up earning more (in some cases significantly more) than they did previously despite taking such long breaks from employment. Essentially, they made up for lost personal/fun time and, more importantly, figured out a better work-life balance.

Currently, I am begging my best friend to take at least 3 months off to do the same. He just burned out of/quit his very "nice job" (paid well but stressful af because the company was infected with Game of Thrones level politics, lying, and backstabbing) and walked away from ~1M in stock options. He still has a lot of savings for a single dude and could probably get a job at any of the top 5 tech companies tomorrow if he wanted, so I really think he needs to be selfish and focus for a while on enjoying himself and improving his mental and physical wellbeing.

IMO quitting your job to become a poker pro would likely be a mistake due to the grind of being a professional combined with the emotional swings and potentially huge paycut you'll have to take, not to mention all the bs you'll have to deal with from jerks at the table. When poker becomes a job, not a profitable hobby, the honeymoon period of being a pro can end very quickly and painfully as stated ad infinitum ITT. However, I think quitting your job so you can do whatever the **** you want - including playing a lot more poker/traveling/visiting friends/hanging out with or finding a SO - can be a potentially life-changing period of time.

So, as long as you are confident you can jump back into your field after 6+ months off (huge factor obv), +1 to quitting your job, but also +1 to not being a poker pro. Good luck!
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Old 04-14-2019, 07:21 AM   #7027
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

I turned on to your Sessions podcast. It's outstanding.
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Old 04-14-2019, 09:20 AM   #7028
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Originally Posted by onedollars View Post
I don't think your predicament is that rare for our generation (I'm in my mid 30s). I have a bunch of close friends who were funemployed for 1-2 years in their early 30s. Most of them were in tech and made solid money/saved for 8-10 years, weren't married, didn't have kids. The primary motivation varied from boredom, wanting adventure, to feeling burned out, but they were all similar in that they had all worked hard from around age 14 onward and did all the "right things": studied hard and did great in school, then got respectable jobs that paid well. But their jobs weren't fulfilling and each decided they needed an extended break to figure out wtf they wanted out of their lives.

While funemployed, they traveled to wherever they wanted, indulged in their hobbies, spent time with friends and family, and focused on themselves and their happiness. Once they returned to the workforce, they were refreshed, much happier, and ended up earning more (in some cases significantly more) than they did previously despite taking such long breaks from employment. Essentially, they made up for lost personal/fun time and, more importantly, figured out a better work-life balance.

Currently, I am begging my best friend to take at least 3 months off to do the same. He just burned out of/quit his very "nice job" (paid well but stressful af because the company was infected with Game of Thrones level politics, lying, and backstabbing) and walked away from ~1M in stock options. He still has a lot of savings for a single dude and could probably get a job at any of the top 5 tech companies tomorrow if he wanted, so I really think he needs to be selfish and focus for a while on enjoying himself and improving his mental and physical wellbeing.

IMO quitting your job to become a poker pro would likely be a mistake due to the grind of being a professional combined with the emotional swings and potentially huge paycut you'll have to take, not to mention all the bs you'll have to deal with from jerks at the table. When poker becomes a job, not a profitable hobby, the honeymoon period of being a pro can end very quickly and painfully as stated ad infinitum ITT. However, I think quitting your job so you can do whatever the **** you want - including playing a lot more poker/traveling/visiting friends/hanging out with or finding a SO - can be a potentially life-changing period of time.

So, as long as you are confident you can jump back into your field after 6+ months off (huge factor obv), +1 to quitting your job, but also +1 to not being a poker pro. Good luck!
Nailed it. I've never been a fan of hindsight. All those questions like, if you could go back what would you do differently, etc. I think its better to frame it the opposite way. When faced with any problem these days the first question I ask myself is, "looking back, what would my 85yo self want me to do here." The only exception for me is that I kind of wish I took a gap year after high school to break the mindset of just continuing on blindly to college and get on the path of "doing all the right things" as you said. It took me a long time to start being me.

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Old 04-14-2019, 09:51 AM   #7029
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

Actually, lets get philosophical for a bit, because I've recently come to realize a mindset trap that i've been in, and I'd be willing to wager that many poker players are the same. When 85yo you talks to present day you its probably pretty simple. She wants you to make the decision that allows you to most enjoy your life. But I think many of us aren't enjoying the moment. We worry about the future and we think that if we can just shot take and run good for a few months we'll be set. Just bink a tourney one time and we'll be comfortable. One day I can make it to Bobby's Room or Macau as the BIG Goal and then life will be great. But its not actually like that. Rich people have just as much stress as poor people. Once you get the money you'll need to protect it so you'll worry about that. Extra home security, cash boxes. What if the market tanks and you lose a lot with your investments? There will always be things to worry about. Then years go by and you look back and you wish that you just didn't worry about those things, because they would have turned out the same anyway. I heard a great analogy the other day from Alan Watts. That guy was smart. Most people treat life like a game. Get to the end and "win." Then everything will be awesome. But we should really just treat it like a song. You don't rush through to the end. You just enjoy the song.
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Old 04-14-2019, 04:21 PM   #7030
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

I was just listening to Alan Watts last night say a very similar thing. He is very wise
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Old 04-14-2019, 04:43 PM   #7031
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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One thing I'd disagree with to some degree is when Garrett mentions that a pro doesn't need to be a circus clown. I think there is definitely a time and place for it, and it doesn't need to be a fake scummy thing. At higher stakes, just being a social person while playing serious and not cutthroat nitty is about all it takes. Almost everyone else in the game also wants to play seriously. In smaller games, I'd say that being a bit of a circus clown is fine. In my case, I don't stop being myself, I just become a spazzy version of myself and I'm doing it to entertain myself just as much as I am to entertain the game. There is a significant difference in the average table dynamic in a $5 game compared to $20+ game. Largely because bigger games have a reasonably static player pool and smaller games are a revolving door of players. And there's a difference between atmosphere of a quiet single table in the corner of a cardroom in a top section, behind glass doors, in a loft or penthouse, etc compared to the zoo that is poker on the floor of Planet Hollywood, games at Harrah's that are one leap away from being on the sidewalk on the strip, etc. But all small/medium stakes games aren't equal either. There's generally a big difference between being a regular at your local card barn in a $5 game where that's the biggest game or close to it and hopping from place to place in Vegas where there are dozens of games spread across numerous casino. The less likely you are to play with the people you are engaging with again, the less serious your interaction with them should be. That's just normal. If you're at a bar, you don't interact with your friends that you've known for years the same way you interact with the random person a couple stools down from you that chats you up or the bored bartender that has nobody else to serve.
I like where you're going with that thought. There's a lot of nuance in everyone's situation, the different games out there, and what's considered acceptable behavior. It's very complex.
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Old 04-14-2019, 05:17 PM   #7032
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Originally Posted by SSC-Ry View Post
Actually, lets get philosophical for a bit, because I've recently come to realize a mindset trap that i've been in, and I'd be willing to wager that many poker players are the same. When 85yo you talks to present day you its probably pretty simple. She wants you to make the decision that allows you to most enjoy your life. But I think many of us aren't enjoying the moment. We worry about the future and we think that if we can just shot take and run good for a few months we'll be set. Just bink a tourney one time and we'll be comfortable. One day I can make it to Bobby's Room or Macau as the BIG Goal and then life will be great. But its not actually like that. Rich people have just as much stress as poor people. Once you get the money you'll need to protect it so you'll worry about that. Extra home security, cash boxes. What if the market tanks and you lose a lot with your investments? There will always be things to worry about. Then years go by and you look back and you wish that you just didn't worry about those things, because they would have turned out the same anyway. I heard a great analogy the other day from Alan Watts. That guy was smart. Most people treat life like a game. Get to the end and "win." Then everything will be awesome. But we should really just treat it like a song. You don't rush through to the end. You just enjoy the song.
great...now i have to worry about the market tanking. j/k

To address some of your points, the lotto equity is incredibly mis-priced when you're 20-29. I think that's common in a lot of industries including tech, gaming, entertainment, poker, etc. A lot of youngsters will take on a lot of -EV risks to go for these moonshots. And why not if they're young, energetic, and have the time to rebuild.

Before, I was really about the hustle. But now I really just want casual **** where you can go at your own pace. Like yoga or something. I just want to limp in and see some flops, ya get what i'm saying? So i'm big on the living in the moment .

Also, I guess I shouldn't be surprised that a big chunk of the high stakes forum is in their 30s, successful, and is just sitting on half a million in the bank.
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Old 04-14-2019, 08:50 PM   #7033
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

Man, as a small timer, the game's your in sound like thin value all the time. There's real art in it and it would overwhelm me that's for certain. Great podcasts.
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Old 04-15-2019, 07:15 PM   #7034
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

Garrett's Joey Ingram's podcast was elite af Loved the openness on depression (it was also the biggest demon I defeated in my life with the help of no less than 10 000 hours of meditation ), Bonomo's speech, table presence etc.

Am nitpicking here, but
Spoiler:
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:59 PM   #7035
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Am nitpicking here, but
Spoiler:
Don't think you're nitpicking at all. There are sort of 2 directions to take what Garrett said.

* He really means _ideology_ and not religion, and therefore various forms of fascism, totalitarianism, communism, other kinds of fanaticism are also included, and his comment boils down to _people who don't really commit to hardcore ideologies that declare a right and a wrong side of the world don't commit mass atrocities against others_ which is almost a tautology; or

* He means _religion_ and he's being incredibly sloppy in his thinking which, while not really like G, is also something I see all the time with that particular term. The cliff notes here is that scholars of religion can't agree _that there is_ a definition of religion (note, not _on what the definition is_, rather, _that there is one at all_).

I mean, yeah, it's a nitpick in that 98.43% of the GMan interview was absolutely lovely to listen to, smart, focused, and clear. But it's not a nitpick in the sense of exaggerating something said to make a point.

I really loved the riff on how easy it is to ascribe success to some notion of "hard work." I mean, yeah, many of us work hard at things. But that's the price of entry to many things: it's no guarantee of success, it's what gets you in the game.
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Old 04-16-2019, 12:21 AM   #7036
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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98.43% of the GMan interview was absolutely lovely to listen to, smart, focused, and clear.
I got to add : I have listened to all of Joey's podcast up to 6 months ago, and Gman's easily falls into the top 3-5 of them
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Old 04-16-2019, 01:36 AM   #7037
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Don't think you're nitpicking at all. There are sort of 2 directions to take what Garrett said.

* He really means _ideology_ and not religion, and therefore various forms of fascism, totalitarianism, communism, other kinds of fanaticism are also included, and his comment boils down to _people who don't really commit to hardcore ideologies that declare a right and a wrong side of the world don't commit mass atrocities against others_ which is almost a tautology; or

* He means _religion_ and he's being incredibly sloppy in his thinking which, while not really like G, is also something I see all the time with that particular term. The cliff notes here is that scholars of religion can't agree _that there is_ a definition of religion (note, not _on what the definition is_, rather, _that there is one at all_).

I mean, yeah, it's a nitpick in that 98.43% of the GMan interview was absolutely lovely to listen to, smart, focused, and clear. But it's not a nitpick in the sense of exaggerating something said to make a point.

I really loved the riff on how easy it is to ascribe success to some notion of "hard work." I mean, yeah, many of us work hard at things. But that's the price of entry to many things: it's no guarantee of success, it's what gets you in the game.
Thanks for this post. Ya I have a tendency to fumble my words around in interviews at times. I most certainly meant ideologies, and that extremism in anything is usually at best illogical and at worst catastrophic. In general, I usually struggle to connect with people who see most things as black or white.

As I said, I am in full support of the Sunday churchgoer whose life is enhanced by God and the community he connects with over shared beliefs. This is even more true when this person uses religion as a reason to act in a moral and philanthropic manner. But can this person exist without the person on the other end of the spectrum-the extremist killing people in the name of his God? I have my doubts.

Really appreciate the kind words. And really like your last paragraph, never heard it said that way.

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Old 04-16-2019, 10:13 AM   #7038
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

@DGAF

Would you consider getting women's sizes for your t-shirts? I would definitely buy one if you did
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Old 04-16-2019, 11:13 AM   #7039
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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I got to add : I have listened to all of Joey's podcast up to 6 months ago, and Gman's easily falls into the top 3-5 of them
My god, man. That's a Herculean effort right there!
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Old 04-16-2019, 11:31 AM   #7040
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Thanks for this post. Ya I have a tendency to fumble my words around in interviews at times. I most certainly meant ideologies, and that extremism in anything is usually at best illogical and at worst catastrophic. In general, I usually struggle to connect with people who see most things as black or white.
Dude! First, thanks for the interview. You did a spectacular job, and your ability to reflect on yourself and your history speaks to some really hard work that you've navigated over many years. Congratulations on that, and may the lows continue to be manageable.

To your point, one of my most common responses to, well, almost anything, is I think it's more complicated than that ...

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As I said, I am in full support of the Sunday churchgoer whose life is enhanced by God and the community he connects with over shared beliefs. This is even more true when this person uses religion as a reason to act in a moral and philanthropic manner. But can this person exist without the person on the other end of the spectrum-the extremist killing people in the name of his God? I have my doubts.
Somewhere above I said I was hesitant to wade into the thread ... so much for that ... So, one thing that informs this is that, at the end of the day, it may be true that there are deep-seated ethical/moral flaws in the notion of monotheism that makes it incompatible with peace/justice. Since, often, what people mean by "religion" is in fact the three dominant western monotheisms ...

Please note that I am NOT saying that any individual who subscribes to monotheistic faith is not ethical or moral. I am saying that there are philosophical issues that proceed directly from the notion of a single supreme being that are hard to overcome, especially in broad, institutionalized settings.
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Old 04-16-2019, 12:32 PM   #7041
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

requireE=gman06;55028503]



As I said, I am in full support of the Sunday churchgoer whose life is enhanced by God and the community he connects with over shared beliefs. This is even more true when this person uses religion as a reason to act in a moral and philanthropic manner. But can this person exist without the person on the other end of the spectrum-the extremist killing people in the name of his God? I have my doubts. .[/QUOTE]

Can a do-gooder god-loving god is benevolent person exist without extremists killing in the name of God?!

Yes.

It is unfortunate that extremists gonna extreme, but that shouldn't be seen as a requirement for, nor as function of a do-gooders existence.
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Old 04-16-2019, 01:49 PM   #7042
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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@DGAF

Would you consider getting women's sizes for your t-shirts? I would definitely buy one if you did
the shirts say unisex. maybe a small would fit. i plan on getting one for my gf as well. to support.

straddle. i'm looking forward to see her reaction
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Old 04-16-2019, 02:09 PM   #7043
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

DGAF--

Do you think you'll have backpacks ready to go before the WSOP? Really trying hard not to look like a dork grinder this year. Thanks man.
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Old 04-16-2019, 02:46 PM   #7044
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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the shirts say unisex. maybe a small would fit. i plan on getting one for my gf as well. to support.

straddle. i'm looking forward to see her reaction
unisex shirts are mens shirts that are labeled unisex to sell more shirts. I could buy it and tailor it myself, but feels silly to pay $23 for a shirt I have to resew myself. For something like this, where I assume the tshirts are custom printed at order time (assuming based on color options and everything), most companies offer having women's sizes in addition to 'unisex'
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Old 04-16-2019, 02:48 PM   #7045
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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My god, man. That's a Herculean effort right there!
8 years of playing online poker professionally has seen me go through more hours of podcasts (always listening to one while grinding) that I care to guestimate
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Old 04-16-2019, 03:09 PM   #7046
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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unisex shirts are mens shirts that are labeled unisex to sell more shirts. I could buy it and tailor it myself, but feels silly to pay $23 for a shirt I have to resew myself. For something like this, where I assume the tshirts are custom printed at order time (assuming based on color options and everything), most companies offer having women's sizes in addition to 'unisex'
Interesting. So there is more to Men's vs Women's sizes than just Men's sizes run larger? Learn something new every day
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Old 04-16-2019, 03:18 PM   #7047
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Interesting. So there is more to Men's vs Women's sizes than just Men's sizes run larger? Learn something new every day
more room bust size, shorter sleeves, etc. but my gf sometimes prefers men's small/xsmall to a women's small/medium
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Old 04-16-2019, 05:00 PM   #7048
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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Alright, but much like yourself, I can never keep it brief once it comes to subjects I deeply invest myself in , so here are a couple of posts that I made about said retreats over the years :

(Thailand) : https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/s...&postcount=404

(Israel) : https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/s...&postcount=467

In other news, I just started playing (for strictly entertaining purposes) in a fun 5 card 2-4-8$ PLO game in Lima, Peru. The player field is comprised of a single table, so I can't insist enough how all the stuff good for the game repeated Ad nauseam ITT comes in handy for a game like this, especially that given this is substantially lower than my normal stakes, increasing the fun factor is quite important even if the WR inversely decreases Thx all
My read is that you are locked in right now in life.

Spoiler:


Very happy for you. Keep it up!
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Old 04-16-2019, 05:24 PM   #7049
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

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DGAF, wrestling would also be my first suggestion for the kiddos. A relatively non violent physical solution to confrontations that doesn't involve punching or kicking. Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is a close second and they tend to do kids classes at most places. Whereas finding wrestling classes outside of school might be tough depending on your area.

Absolutely love the podcast but will admit I am tilted by "sip of coffee." Maybe its just me but I think you distract when you mention everytime you take a sip of a beverage. Once in awhile is charming, more than that becomes a tad grating for me...

And finally, I know i'm supposed to add this to the podcasts list but I am lazy. I love the podcast "Heavyweight." It is about confronting your past and each episode deals with a new story about a real person who tries to deal with something weighing on them from their past. Super cool, imo and right up your alley.

Sweating new episodes, hope they come sooN!
Thanks for the bullying feedback. Wrestling does seem hard to find, but I know of a good Jui Jitsu spot...

I planned to play poker last night but life has honestly just been too stressful lately. I made the smart move and just chilled (because my head wasn't right). I woke up feeling a bit better today but decided to take tonight off too. I'm just going to write and work on projects and then chill later. That leaves tmrw as the only day I can play this week, so I will try to do that in order to get a pod out.

Anyways, thanks for all the great pod feedback thus far. On that note, I have no idea what to do about the sips. They come naturally like everything else in the pod. I thought they were NBD but a few people seem to hate them. What a conundrum, being 100% me vs appeasing some important listeners.

Thanks for Heavyweight, I'll add it.

Cheers
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Old 04-16-2019, 05:31 PM   #7050
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Re: 2k- a poker story (wtmfl;dr obv)

PODCASTS
UPDATED 4/16/19

True Crime
Serial (Especially Seasons 1 & 3) +1
S-Town +1
Dirty John +1
Generation Why
True Crime Garage
Monster (the zodiac killer season)
Framed (more in the serial style)
Accused (serial style)
Root of Evil
To Live and Die in L.A.
Over My Dead Body +1

Sports
Fall Of A Titan
Gladiator
Around the NFL
30 for 30 podcasts +1
The Lowe Post +1
Dan Le Batard Show
Stupodity
Hang Up and Listen +1
Open Floor

Investigative/Documentary
What Really Happened

Poker
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Intercepted with Jeremy Scahill
On Point
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Positive ****/Health/Education/Etc
Solicited Advice Podcast
Dad The Best I Can
Barbell Logic
Gary Vaynerchuk

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The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish
Planet Money
Smart Passive Income
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Tim Ferris Show

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doughboys (comedy-chain restaurant review)
We'll See You in Hell (comedy-horror/sci-fi/fantasy/other movie review)
Hardcore History (especially Blueprint for Armageddon series) +1 to the Khan series too
Making Sense with Sam Harris +1
The Art of Manliness +1
Stuff You Should Know
Heavyweight
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