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10/25 Straddle craziness 10/25 Straddle craziness
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01-26-2018 , 11:01 AM
#1
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9-handed 10/25 game. Effective stacks are $7.3K. $50 straddle has been on for a few rounds.

V1 (MP): TAG Pro reg. Always plays 10/25, and is capable of making moves.

Hero (SB): TAG rec/semi-pro player. Hadn't gotten out of line.

V2 (BB): Loose Asian that isn't afraid to gii/bluff. Only hh with him is one where I raised with JTo in the CO, and he called in the BB. Flop J74ss, I lead 1/2 pot, he calls. Turn Jh, I check, he bets 2/3 pot, I call. River Ko, I check, he bets pot, I snap, and he shows Q2dd.

Action
V1 raises to $150 in MP, folds to Hero in SB who 3b to $550 with KK. V2 cold calls in BB. V1 then 4b to $2K. Hero?
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01-26-2018 , 11:51 AM
#2
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Anything you do here will look pretty strong. If PFR was CO or BTN I’d be more inclined to get it in pre but since we don’t have that dynamic here i think his range is a bit stronger too and I’d be surprised if he’s going to just get it in with JJ or something considering how deep you are.

That said I’m going with my hand here but it’s a question what’s the most +EV way to do so. I probably just call here and c/rai basically all flops. his range will be pretty strong but I think we will catch some AQo type **** in his range here that we won’t if we raise again pre
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01-26-2018 , 03:11 PM
#3
iamallin
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All in. Sorry you ran into aa
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01-26-2018 , 03:59 PM
#4
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Think I just shrug and rip it in.
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01-26-2018 , 06:16 PM
#5
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is this a joke? rip it.
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01-27-2018 , 02:39 AM
#6
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Looks like not so much over 100bb so all in works fine
Aa is a very frequent hand to bump into tho
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01-29-2018 , 04:47 PM
#7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diskoteque
Anything you do here will look pretty strong. If PFR was CO or BTN I’d be more inclined to get it in pre but since we don’t have that dynamic here i think his range is a bit stronger too and I’d be surprised if he’s going to just get it in with JJ or something considering how deep you are.

That said I’m going with my hand here but it’s a question what’s the most +EV way to do so. I probably just call here and c/rai basically all flops. his range will be pretty strong but I think we will catch some AQo type **** in his range here that we won’t if we raise again pre
These were basically my thoughts at the time the hand was played. I wanted some feedback on if anyone else flats pre, or if this is a clear shove all day with the "dead money" in the middle.
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01-29-2018 , 05:12 PM
#8
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Next time be the guy with the aces in the amazing cooler spot (and hold), or just get home vs him with your 20%. Then you will be on your way to poker stardom!
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01-29-2018 , 05:17 PM
#9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DGAF
Next time be the guy with the aces in the amazing cooler spot (and hold), or just get home vs him with your 20%. Then you will be on your way to poker stardom!
Half spoiler - but no one had AA in this hand as most people are thinking

I'm trying to figure out if shoving is the best play here vs. their ranges, or if there's any merit to flatting (hell, maybe even 5-betting to induce MP to shove...).
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01-29-2018 , 05:29 PM
#10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cook-
Half spoiler - but no one had AA in this hand as most people are thinking

I'm trying to figure out if shoving is the best play here vs. their ranges, or if there's any merit to flatting (hell, maybe even 5-betting to induce MP to shove...).
Then he had AK, immediately regret his 4b sizing, snapped it off with an unhappy face, got home, got pushed the 15k, threw the dealer a buck, checked his phone for whatever, and completely forgot about the hand once a new one was dealt.

No?
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01-29-2018 , 05:40 PM
#11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DGAF
Then he had AK, immediately regret his 4b sizing, snapped it off with an unhappy face, got home, got pushed the 15k, threw the dealer a buck, checked his phone for whatever, and completely forgot about the hand once a new one was dealt.

No?
Pretty close! Results below...

Spoiler:
Hero thinks for a little and flats the 2k, BB snap flats as well. Flop J98cc (Hero has Kc). Hero checks, BB bets 2.4k, MP folds, Hero shoves, and BB snaps us off with 99. Run it twice, get there zero times.

Asked MP what he had later, and he said he had AK and would have called a shove. No A on either runout - not that it really matters.

When the hand was played, I never read MP to have AA, so I didn't want to lose him with a shove. And I also thought BB would fold for the extra 1.5k with his weak-ish range. I was wrong about the latter.

BB went on to say that he would have left the game if he folded that pre and saw a 9 on the flop - which leads me to believe that any 5b I would have probably gotten him to fold.

Results aside, just looking for rationale for flatting/5betting/shoving. Any thoughts appreciated.
Last edited by cook-; 01-29-2018 at 05:58 PM.
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02-02-2018 , 04:10 AM
#12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cook-
Hero (SB): TAG rec/semi-pro player. Hadn't gotten out of line.
Sure, your image will get him to fold anything lower than QQ if you 5-bet.
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02-02-2018 , 12:07 PM
#13
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I'm not sure why we would flat here? If AK made it this far, I think there is some chance they'll call the 5 bet shove.

AK still has ~30% against KK, so it's not like we should be slow playing our hand. And AK may not go wild on the flop unless pairing up. So I don't see how this is a profitable flat.

I would take my dead money (equity denial) by shoving and hope that my opponents make mistake calling off with worse. Targeting QQ and AK.
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02-11-2018 , 02:33 AM
#14
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anything but shoving is bad. You can consider just flatting AA here but not KK. Easiest jam of your life...
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02-11-2018 , 03:00 PM
#15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarretman
anything but shoving is bad. You can consider just flatting AA here but not KK. Easiest jam of your life...
Why flatting AA? You lose much more equity by flatting it.
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02-12-2018 , 04:10 AM
#16
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it's just one of those standard shove QQ+ AK situations. Maybe you can fold AKo since he used non-bluff sizing. But he can prob have JJ here for these stacks so I don't see even QQ being a fold, and I see no value in a flat 2k range of any sort.
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02-12-2018 , 05:00 PM
#17
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I'd still jam AA fwiw but you can consider it.
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02-13-2018 , 12:30 AM
#18
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So tilting that the dude w 99 gets there makes me wanna break my mouse and I wasn’t even in the pot lol
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02-24-2018 , 07:53 PM
#19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cook-
9-handed 10/25 game. Effective stacks are $7.3K. $50 straddle has been on for a few rounds.

V1 (MP): TAG Pro reg. Always plays 10/25, and is capable of making moves.

Hero (SB): TAG rec/semi-pro player. Hadn't gotten out of line.

V2 (BB): Loose Asian that isn't afraid to gii/bluff. Only hh with him is one where I raised with JTo in the CO, and he called in the BB. Flop J74ss, I lead 1/2 pot, he calls. Turn Jh, I check, he bets 2/3 pot, I call. River Ko, I check, he bets pot, I snap, and he shows Q2dd.

Action
V1 raises to $150 in MP, folds to Hero in SB who 3b to $550 with KK. V2 cold calls in BB. V1 then 4b to $2K. Hero?
Shove. Villain will have alot of value but if a solid reg might just squeeze for dead money with some AXs, in that case it would be an horrible idea to just call. If he never has AXs in his range, which you can't know, than yeah flatting is definitely superior. You can flat aces there, rip KK.

If villain gets it in with AA, so be it, but I think he will call AK. definitely won't see QQ or JJ calls I don't think. rip it in, fold his AX, get value from AK, and lose value from AA.
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02-24-2018 , 07:55 PM
#20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imaginary F(r)iend
Why flatting AA? You lose much more equity by flatting it.
Yes and no, it depends on his range. If his range is JJ+ on the 3bet, and you flat, you will get him to bet any T high board, and with stack sizes his bet is essentially an all-in. If his only calling range from a rip is AA/KK/AK, it makes sense to flat AA some frequency and rip KK.
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02-26-2018 , 03:33 AM
#21
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Wait what? There is around 3300 in the middle when it swings back to us and we are worried about getting folds?
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02-26-2018 , 12:03 PM
#22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by julien.roy
Shove. Villain will have alot of value but if a solid reg might just squeeze for dead money with some AXs, in that case it would be an horrible idea to just call. If he never has AXs in his range, which you can't know, than yeah flatting is definitely superior. You can flat aces there, rip KK.

If villain gets it in with AA, so be it, but I think he will call AK. definitely won't see QQ or JJ calls I don't think. rip it in, fold his AX, get value from AK, and lose value from AA.
Makes sense. Thanks.
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02-26-2018 , 12:05 PM
#23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by surf doc
Wait what? There is around 3300 in the middle when it swings back to us and we are worried about getting folds?
It's pretty clear to me now that with such shallow stacks, and all the dead money, ripping it in is best. Not sure if there's anything else to be said!

Thanks for da input.
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