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Old 03-26-2010, 09:11 PM   #1
sebastien
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line with hand without showdown value and draw

hero is in BB with 64

vilain open i call BB

flop :952

I usually C/R that
i see some good regualr c/c it
i suppose, it s because my hand look like so draw hand

how do you usually play this?

what i wonder with the C/C line is how do you play your hand in turn, C/R? all turn?
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Old 03-27-2010, 06:02 PM   #2
armor32
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

I think that answer to this question lies in the Cosa Nostra thread...
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Old 03-28-2010, 01:35 AM   #3
herbertstemple
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

I usually fold 64o. But is that good advice or bad advice? Long term profit vs short term loss? Or is it the other way around? Poker is so hard. Can one of the 2+2 snitches please contact leader. Maybe he can fix that too.
Seriously; as played I'd try to win this hand as soon as possible, so its an obvious spot for a donk bet/raise. 100% best advice anyone will give on this hand.
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:07 PM   #4
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

Fold pre
I like c/r better than donking here, but either might work
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:28 PM   #5
freshjuuuiice
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

perfect spot for a trifecta
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:50 PM   #6
johnnyrocket
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

Quote:
Originally Posted by ohudac View Post
Fold pre
I like c/r better than donking here, but either might work
does neone really fold this preflop? 64o seems like a lot stronger hand than me than others i fold but i'd be more inclined to play it than J2o, J3o hands
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Old 04-09-2010, 02:04 PM   #7
jujujaja34
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastien View Post
hero is in BB with 64

vilain open i call BB

flop :952

I usually C/R that
i see some good regualr c/c it
i suppose, it s because my hand look like so draw hand

how do you usually play this?

what i wonder with the C/C line is how do you play your hand in turn, C/R? all turn?
Preflop is obviously fine. Unless you're in a very high rake game it should be a very easy call.

In a vacuum, against competant opponents who can easily call down high card hands if the board runs off in a decent way, calling yields a higher EV...according to me at least.

A lot also depends on how you're playing miiddle pair/bottom pair/good air in this spot. If you happen to like to c/r middle pair, maybe some bottom pair, your best air, then you may choose to balance by adding your gutshots which I think is fine. If you play you're middle/bottom pair/good air more passively then I think c/c these gutshots are better balancewise.

It's also an important consideration that you have zero fold equity on the flop on this board. At least, on a 68J board, you can fold out a few hands with T7.
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Old 04-09-2010, 02:27 PM   #8
dragon1893
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyrocket View Post
does neone really fold this preflop? 64o seems like a lot stronger hand than me than others i fold but i'd be more inclined to play it than J2o, J3o hands
i just looked in my database for hands played at 2/4.

on FT, after 117 hands +28.5bb's made . 52 hand in BB and i'm losing 5.25bb's
on PS after 52 hands -83.80bb's lost. 32 hands in BB and i'm losing 82.65bb's.

sum of it all
169 hands and 55.3bb's lost. 84 hands in BB and i'm losing 87.90bb's.

seems like a breakeven hand at 2/4.
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Old 04-09-2010, 06:04 PM   #9
DVDA4life
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

Quote:
Originally Posted by dragon1893 View Post
i just looked in my database for hands played at 2/4.

on FT, after 117 hands +28.5bb's made . 52 hand in BB and i'm losing 5.25bb's
on PS after 52 hands -83.80bb's lost. 32 hands in BB and i'm losing 82.65bb's.

sum of it all
169 hands and 55.3bb's lost. 84 hands in BB and i'm losing 87.90bb's.

seems like a breakeven hand at 2/4.

Your sample is too small to make any reasonable conclusions.


As others have mentioned what you do in this spot should heavily depend on the rest of your game plan. Although this does look like the perfect spot for a trifecta.
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Old 04-10-2010, 06:15 PM   #10
ImKenyPowers
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Re: line with hand without showdown value and draw

Question -

If we have a very showdown bound opponent, is this even wise to c/r here? If we don't improve he's almost certianly calling us down all the way with a lot of holdings (Q high potentially). If the c/r is not good here, c/c flop, and c/f turn unimproved? or get to river as cheaply as possible? What's a good line against an aggro showdown opponent in this situation?
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