That sounds fun. I wonder if they have that on videopoker.com yet.

Right. Flip before draw only. And yes, at my local they unlock "right away", then go and get the monies. So I was playing on the same machine about 1 min after I hit. It takes far longer at the Wynn (where they don't unlock until they pay).

They do. That's where I was messing around with it when I realized, "hey. I actually stand a fair chance of being dealt monsters in this game".

Sun-running on 10 Play Extra Draw Frenzy..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZqCBSWdOxc

Was hoping that was your vid!

Nah, I stopped playing TDB Extra Draw Frenzy, when I realized when you draw (3) A,2,3,4 with a kicker it does NOT hold the kicker.

I liked the game a lot, but am boycotting it for that reason alone.

Was playing 10 play, $0.25 drew 4-4-4-3-T, and it wouldn't allow me to hold the 3 on 27 hands!

Then, same session, I drew A-A-A-2-K, and again wouldn't let me hold the kicker for 30 bonus hands! I went on rage-tilt and cashed out after that..haven't played EDF since..lol

I saw the flip& pay on videopoker.com but never got really in to it. Why play that when you can just play Dreamcard? And with dreamcard you don't have to have a card one rank up/down - you just automatically get the best card you need no matter what.

I've played a decent amount of dreamcard (and I know you're a fan). Here's my take-

- the dreamcard doesn't come up often enough for my liking. I'm told it comes up far more often on JOB, but I don't play that game (and of course if we're talking about dealt monsters, there's really only one hand on JOB that we care about).
- related to first point- the dreamcard feature effectively gives you 4 "other" slots to work with on the deal- when it comes up, it's as if you're working with a 4 card hand as far as everything else is concerned. The flip card, by contrast, can be any of the 5 dealt cards
- because of the above, it seems that the flip card comes AND matters more often than the dreamcard. Eg, if dealt a pair we have 6 "outs" x 3 slots for what will be trips. In dreamcard, you need to be dealt a pair in 4 cards, not 5, THEN have the dreamcard come in.
- (totally subjective)- I find it irritating, basically a waste to hit a dreamcard on a J-high deal or something like that. Great, I have JOB now on a double bet game. The flip doesn't come in until by definition you improve to a hand better than JOB (I realize this has nothing to do with math and only to do with my own personal triggers)

Most importantly, I've never run well at dreamcard, AND my local doesn't offer it

Yeah I think we discussed this before. Barona once HAD EDF that held the kicker, then they took it away, then it came back but they no longer held the kicker. Screw that.

Add Pechanga to the list of TDB EDF machines that don't allow you to hold the kicker..and they have dozens of machines there that offer TDB EDF.

Too bad..I really enjoy that variant. I much prefer the 5+1 games as opposed to the 5+5 games, such as Dreamcard and Ultimate X, that can really suck up your money quickly..

THIS. Hate Dreamcard.

Those are all good points, I was just curious.

I don't even play dreamcard too much, but I have run ok on it. The game I ALWAYS run bad on is Ultimate X. I've played it a good number of times, and my money just disappears. I've never hit anything remotely big on it.

I wonder how I'm doing lifetime on UX. I'm sure I'm down but it's a question of how much. I remember all these massive hits but at the same time the game has sucked so much money when it's been cold.

Leon, I think that flip and play is closer to 98.4% than 98.5%

I'm glad you had fun at it, but that's going to murder your roll if you play if for very long with 4x the edge of normal TDB

I'm wondering now- WOO has 6/5 TDB flip listed as 96.5, and 7/5 as 98. One makes fulls ALOT in the game (since one pair often flips to two), which explains the 1.5% difference between 6/5 and 7/5. I'm wondering if 8/5 is, in turn, 1.5% better than 7/5? That'd make it a 99.5% game!

Do you have hard info on the 98.4 you quote above?

Full house difference on DDB also listed as 1.5% gain for 1 more coin back. Now I'm really wondering.

Don’t forget to have fun. I’m always entertained by reading the smarter crowd discussing expected value, but I also have being dumb **** lucky and mashing buttons

I remembered to have fun today...

Second dealt royal of my life (no flip needed). Second pic I got dealt 3 aces, kicker, and either the offsuit 2 or king (it flipped and locked up so fast I couldn't tell) and that's all she wrote.

Today was a good day.

Sweet baby Jesus. Merry Christmas!

Get hot stay hot!

Flip and Pay is available in LV at The M Resort and Mirage according to videopoker.com. I played it for free a little bit online and it was pretty fun.

Another new game I tried out was Magic Deal. It's like dreamcard but much more powerful. Every ten hands or so you get dealt 1-3 magic cards on the initial deal that are effectively jokers. This is vastly superior to dreamcard because there is no card removal pre-draw and the magic cards become the best cards possible for you based on your post-draw cards. I played this for a little while for free online and it was really fun. It's available in Las Vegas at Mirage and Suncoast.

Well that's ridiculous nh

leon ready for Vegas now...nice!

+1 in all the best ways. Congrats and Merry Christmas, leon.

Played a bit of magic card on VP.com- yeah, it was the bomb when multiple jokers came. I don't know if I'd play it for realz, even if the paytables were good. I can easily imagine a ton of "basic" strategy changes as a result of the jokers. It probably SHOULD play in some respects like deuces wild (in the sense there are wilds) but I'll freely admit I have zero clue what the holds would be with a non-deuces wild paytable.

Thanks everyone. Can't believe I "used up" another dealt royal on quarters, no flip needed. What about all those times I've played 30-40 lines or 10 line 1$ credits?

In all seriousness, the roll is flush again which is a really good feeling. Such a difference gambling with a healthy bankroll vs scared/short money.