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Old 09-14-2016, 10:06 PM   #1
leon
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Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Friends,

I'm still here, barely. Since my May TR , I've basically been beaten like a 2 dollar whore.

Part of the reason for this thread is to keep everyone updated on what's been going on. Part of it is b/c I like telling the story. And part of it is b/c I'm almost felted, and the last few times I've done a write up it's made the losing less painful, and the wins more satisfying. Since all I may have soon are distant memories, I'd better take the opportunity to make my remaining play count.

So, I'll update this in installments to begin, and then post new pics/hits as they happen. If I still have a bankroll when the next Vegas trip rolls around I may make a separate post, or just dump it into this thread. Hopefully this thread never dies...

From May until now- generally...


Awful. Only word to describe it. I returned from Vegas in May with a 30K bankroll and a spring in my step- I've got blood again, and I can play whenever I feel like it. Hell, at my "normal" 50c credit level, I shouldn't ever go bust again, right?

Of course, somewhere in the back of my mind I remember having a near 50K roll in Sept 2015, and THAT was almost felted by May 2016, so...

So I visit my local casino. A lot. And run bad. I play a mix of 50c and 1$ credits, and can recreate basically none of the magic I had in Vegas. It pretty much doesn't matter what I play, I can't win (or at least, I lose far faster than the hits make up for). Here are a few of the hits- sadly, you're not missing many pics (I'm saving my ultimate X and some other hits for another post)...



Spin poker, first hit back from Vegas. Since spin was so good to me in Vegas, maybe it'll continue?




Just enough to make you think every small pair or pair of aces has hope...




These hits USED to be routine. Now, they're rare as hen's teeth.




Another issue with the way I've been running the last few months- I can do stuff like this just enough with quad 2, 3, 4s, but the aces have well and truly dried up. No 4 aces w/kicker = dead.


I get so frustrated at some point, drawing over and over at premium draws and missing, that I decide the only solution is Dreamcard. For those who don't know, the dreamcard feature requires you to bet double. Supposedly 50% of the time, the 5th card (Dreamcard) shows up, and becomes the best possible card for the situation. Ex: you get dealt a pair, and the dreamcard. The Dreamcard automatically becomes a 3 of a kind (you can then draw at trips). You just bleed money on normal hands, but get to draw at trips CONSTANTLY. Dealt quads happens pretty often. And of course, I have visions of a dealt royal- hell, all I need are FOUR royal cards and the dream card, right? I get 4 to a royal (and miss) all the time!

There is only one casino in the local area with Dreamcard. The biggest credit denom is 25c. The best game is double double bonus- no TDB. The paytable is crap (8/5 full house/flush). Who cares- I NEED a score. My confidence is boosted with this on the first session-



3 aces... then the dream card. Exactly what I'm looking for. But, it's double double (as opposed to TDB). And it's only 25c credits. I'm left thinking of what this could have been...


My wife leaves town for a long weekend, and our nanny volunteers to take the kids for basically the whole time. Great! I'm free to gamble pretty much every day! And... I proceed to lose > 10K in a weekend. F me. I make a few of these, not that it's enough to stop the bleeding (you pretty much need dealt aces w/kicker or a royal to get the full effect of Dreamcard).



I NEED THIS ON TDB!

After that weekend, and bc the casino is REALLY ghetto, and the paytable is REALLY bad, I come to my senses and stop with Dreamcard. I'd play if they offered TDB, or if the paytables were better. I've been back less than a month and I've already lost >50% of the 30K I came home with.

To be continued...

Last edited by leon; 09-14-2016 at 10:28 PM.
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Old 09-14-2016, 11:14 PM   #2
TheCanoe
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

You turned me from a craps degen to a VP degen back in May. I love/hate you and wish you nothing but the best. Good luck bro!
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Old 09-14-2016, 11:17 PM   #3
lvBlitzforce
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Pretty sick rollercoaster gl.

What happens if you bust the remaining 15k? You just quit playing VP for good, rebuild, or just simply reload?
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Old 09-15-2016, 12:23 AM   #4
leon
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

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Originally Posted by lvBlitzforce View Post
Pretty sick rollercoaster gl.

What happens if you bust the remaining 15k? You just quit playing VP for good, rebuild, or just simply reload?
What makes you think I have 15K at this point?

To answer your question, #1 or #2 for sure, but not 3. 3 isn't an option. I kind of get into it in my TR from April (I believe), but basically my whole roll started from poker. It has funded many things in my life, including the down payment on our 1st house, wife's ring, etc. Since I stopped playing seriously it has funded degeneracy, and been bled nearly out many times. I simply cannot take from "my money" to make a roll again- then, I won't be able to say that I'm up life time gambling, and more importantly that is a dangerous door to open. I started my roll way back in early 2000 with 500$ and haven't looked back since. If I have to pull more of my personal money to keep the roll afloat, I think that would perma-crush my soul.
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Old 09-15-2016, 12:25 AM   #5
leon
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

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You turned me from a craps degen to a VP degen back in May.
I am truly, deeply sorry for this. I hope one day you'll forgive me...
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Old 09-15-2016, 03:54 AM   #6
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Maybe if it came down to it, you could fund a $500 shot at LHE again. Start at 4/8 and work your way up?

I tried that Dreamcard for awhile. I was getting trips with the dreamcard like it was my job. However, they never turned into quads or a boat. Money disappears in a hurry in Dreamcard if you're not hitting big hands regularly. No more DC for me.
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Old 09-15-2016, 04:14 AM   #7
JackStraightUp
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

I had a roomie who was a knew every trick in the book to freeroll VP, which is what you should be doing. But the story always ended at the same amount $0.00. That said good luck you'll need a ton of it.
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Old 09-15-2016, 08:51 AM   #8
leon
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

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Maybe if it came down to it, you could fund a $500 shot at LHE again. Start at 4/8 and work your way up?
Can't. I realize my poker grinding days are over- I simply don't have the time/patience to start over, having done it before and knowing how much effort it takes. Having to content myself with small wins, etc. I doubt I'd have the discipline- I'd book a 200$ win or whatever and probably try to spin it up into a huge run with -EV games.

I'll always be a gambler, but I'm not a poker player any more, if that makes sense.
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Old 09-15-2016, 08:54 AM   #9
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

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I had a roomie who was a knew every trick in the book to freeroll VP, which is what you should be doing. But the story always ended at the same amount $0.00. That said good luck you'll need a ton of it.
I milk the comp as much as I can, and try and restrict myself to point multiplier days, promos etc but you're right- I give away an edge just like everyone else. That said, I'm under no illusion that this story likely has one ending- BUSTO. I'm just hoping I can stretch out the play for as long as possible. I play for fun these days- I'm not trying to make a living, nor am I interested in grinding 1c/5c simply to last longer. I'd still like to book sizable wins if I can.
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Old 09-15-2016, 11:26 AM   #10
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Leon, sorry to hear about the run bad, really enjoyed your past trip reports and you gave hope to all us VP degens out there haha! You have to face reality though this is a negative EV game and if you keep hammering, eventually the house is going to take it all. That's why I try to limit my VP play and mainly try to hit and run.

I know how sick VP can be, It has almost been a full year since my last royal and it is truly sick how many times I have seen people hit them on the machine next to me.

Anyways! This is how I have been approaching VP lately and things have been going really well. I would start off at your regular denomination and play "Bonus Poker Deluxe". This is the best game!!! 400 credits for any quad with decent smaller hand payouts. So If I am playing quarters, that's $100 per quad. On average you should draw into a quad one in every 423 hands, so depending on the return of your BPD machine, you will have a decent chance at hitting one before going through your $100. If you hit, great, keep hammering at that denomination to see if you might be going on a "quad run".

I will stay on BPD until I hit 9 quads without an AAAA, I know it doesn't mean its more likely to come but after I get to that amount I then switch it up to Triple Double Bonus. It is unreal how many times I've switched at the exact moment that I start getting 2,3,4's w/ k or even aces. Okay so what about the times you are getting killed on Bonus Poker Deluxe and you're now in for $200 at $0.25, so you would need to hit two quads to just get back to even ? Well I either quit at this point or I will then bump up the denom to $0.50, so one quad will get me the $200 and back to even.

This is where it can get kind of sick! If I bust through another $200 at $0.50, im now stuck $400 and have to make the choice to either quit, or martingale up to $1 demon Well ...one quad at dollars is going to net me $400 and we are back baby ! It's a pretty aggressive strategy and those times when you don't get bailed out at a higher denom quad can really hurt, luckily only has happened once for the $800 loss. I know you like to play $0.50 cent, so hopefully the machines your playing have a $2 denom, so you can make that final 3rd martingale before quitting.

Try the Bonus Poker Deluxe man, then parlay to Triple Double Bonus when thing are going well.
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Old 09-15-2016, 12:41 PM   #11
leon
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

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Leon, sorry to hear about the run bad...[/B]
Hey man, thanks for the kind words. It sounds like basically what you are advocating for is "play lower variance in general, take shots when running good" which I agree with as a general longevity strategy. As you also said, we all recognize this is -EV and we're all dead in the long run; only question is how- by a shot to the aorta or with 1000 little razor blade cuts?

Question for you- how do you stay off life tilt if you huge hands which would be huge on TDB on BPD? It's part of the reason that I feel like I can't go play Jacks or better- if I make premium quads on the machine I think I'd be MAD.
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Old 09-15-2016, 02:18 PM   #12
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Easy. Just don't hit any premium quads. That's what I do.
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Old 09-15-2016, 05:08 PM   #13
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Ultimate X

At some point during the run bad I started playing a lot more UX. While I'd dabbled before, I started giving it some serious play during a major dry spell at TDB. You can only bang your head against any wall for so long before any other wall starts to seem more attractive. In addition, the longer my "only serious VP player I know to have never been dealt a royal" streak goes on for, the more I feel like I SHOULD be playing UX if/when I get dealt the royal.

Yes, I know I'm no more likely to be dealt a royal than I was 3 billion hands ago or whatever. I'd simply like event, IF it comes, to come on UX (I have visions of multipliers scattered across the board and I hit for like 45K on a 25c machine). OTOH, knowing how I run I know the likely reality is that if I get a dealt royal, I won't have ANY multipliers, "only" make a 5K hand (1000$ x 5 lines) and that I'll waste my one time. Anyways...

The best UX they have here is 9/5 DDB. No TDB anywhere- I've read that it is a rare casino indeed that will offer TDB with UX, multi-line, and a decent paytable. I guess they don't want someone betting nickels, dimes or quarters hitting the lottery on them and winning more than they would ever likely donk back into the machine.

Here are some of the cooler hits I've had-



This was at the 50c level. One of the fun aspects of UX is that the hits come out of nowhere.



Basically the same hand- twice the multiplier, half the credit value.




Unremarkable hand from a money standpoint. Just interesting/infuriating to be dealt a straight flush with multipliers- WHERE OH WHERE is the dealt royal?!



Previous caption x 2.



GAAAHHH. It's never enough. I lament the lack of the dealt kicker, along with the relative lack of multipliers.



Previous caption x 1000.


So as some of you may know, the variance at UX is also sick like TDB. Sure, I'm playing a less volatile base game (DDB vs TDB). However, the double bet/multiplier aspect adds a ton of variance. My results show this swinginess- I'll go and book multiple losers and never make a real hand, then have one great day, NEARLY make a comeback and feel like I could do this forever. Rinse and repeat. In the next post, I'll post some examples of huge saves/big scores. May you all bink things like this, and no messing around with "small" stuff...
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Old 09-15-2016, 06:41 PM   #14
Stu Ungar
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Leon is BACK!!!

Some sexy screen shots, too.

I have never seen a real dreamcard machine..ever!

I live in SoCal and have never seen one. I go to Vegas 4-6 times a year, and have never seen one there either.

I think I remember a website somewhere that tells you what machines are located where..maybe videopoker.com? I'll check it out.

I, too, can't find any more TDD Ult X machines..I'm pretty sure they are out there, though.

Hopefully you'll have some rungood, now that you are posting again.

Question for you..do you ever play Multi-Strike or 5 Play Multi-Strike? I've never had much success with it, but the 5 Play version is as addicting as any machine I have ever played..
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Old 09-15-2016, 06:57 PM   #15
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

I suppose it goes without saying, but bad pay tables will clean you out. You need to get some coin back on FH, flush, straight, etc. to keep you in the game drawing for those 4oak's. If not, it's busto.
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Old 09-15-2016, 07:30 PM   #16
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

I tried Ult X for awhile, but the long losing streaks were too much. Oh, made trips on some of the hands, cool! Too bad, because all the rest were losers, and the push ends up being a net loser. Also, I couldn't good paytables anywhere, not even the Orleans.

Leon, I think your theory about the lottery aspect is right on the money. At least on progressive banks, they've already taken in the money to pay the jackpots. But someone that brings $200 a trip that plays nickels and dimes? It's a disaster in their minds if he hammers them for ten grand and goes and buys a boat.
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Old 09-15-2016, 08:30 PM   #17
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu Ungar View Post
Leon is BACK!!!

Some sexy screen shots, too.

I have never seen a real dreamcard machine..ever!

I live in SoCal and have never seen one. I go to Vegas 4-6 times a year, and have never seen one there either.

I think I remember a website somewhere that tells you what machines are located where..maybe videopoker.com? I'll check it out.

I, too, can't find any more TDD Ult X machines..I'm pretty sure they are out there, though.

Hopefully you'll have some rungood, now that you are posting again.

Question for you..do you ever play Multi-Strike or 5 Play Multi-Strike? I've never had much success with it, but the 5 Play version is as addicting as any machine I have ever played..
Hey Stu,

Sycuan in SD had ONE multiline dreamcard machine, the one I played on for a bit. I say "had" bc the last time I went there they were remodeling the area and had taken the machine off the floor. When I inquired with a slot person, they said it was doubtful it'd be coming back... to which I immediately then said "well, f this casino then".

videopoker.com does indeed have a list of all available games/denoms, but it's not particularly accurate. I don't think it's been updated in a while. I've easily found several errors in about 5 min of not looking that hard. I think some of our fellow posters have more accurate, up to date info. Supposedly Bally's has a bank of multiline dreamcard, with poor paytables.

I've played multistrike before just a bit- got one hit off of it which I'll post on a later date. Never seen multiline multistrike, which I think I'd enjoy more (probably make premium hands more often...).
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Old 09-15-2016, 09:59 PM   #18
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Sam's Town on Boulder Highway has a couple 5 Play Multi Strike machines..super addicting..
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Old 09-16-2016, 02:36 AM   #19
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Leon!! Glad you're back. Sorry to hear about the downswing, but that's gambling bro. Keep your head up, stay out of the life roll and it's gonna be the biggest 2+2 moment I've ever had if I come on here and you've posted a ultimate x dealt royal lol. Hope u get it bud
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Old 09-16-2016, 03:48 AM   #20
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

You say only one locals casino in LV has Dream Card and it only goes up to $.25. Where is that? I'm guessing it isn't Red Rock, you haven't found these machines at Red Rock or they have been recently uninstalled.

I'm quite sure I've seen Dream card as high $2 at Red Rock. There are some high limit machines that start at $.25. They aren't in high limit though. They are between the pit and the high limit entrance that faces the main cage and security podium. If you sit at one of the machine on the far left of this bank then you are looking at that high limit entrance.

The pay tables are better than the 8/5 DDB you showed, at least last time I looked. You also get 0.3% cash back/free play.

There are two machines that start at $.05 over by the players club desk. Those have the pay tables you mention until you go to $.25.
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Old 09-16-2016, 04:34 AM   #21
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Is there a paytable analysis for Dreamcard anywhere? I've heard of one for Ult X but not Dreamcard.
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Old 09-16-2016, 05:33 AM   #22
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

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Is there a paytable analysis for Dreamcard anywhere? I've heard of one for Ult X but not Dreamcard.
Wizard of Odds has a comprehensive one. OP should note that the only two games that trigger Dream Card 50%+ of the time are Deuces Wild and Jacks or Better, which I find to be the two most boring titles. I don't think Red Rock even offers JoB. Most of the other games hover around 30% Dream Card feature.
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Old 09-16-2016, 10:14 AM   #23
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Quote:
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You say only one locals casino in LV has Dream Card and it only goes up to $.25. Where is that? I'm guessing it isn't Red Rock, you haven't found these machines at Red Rock or they have been recently uninstalled.

I'm quite sure I've seen Dream card as high $2 at Red Rock. There are some high limit machines that start at $.25. They aren't in high limit though. They are between the pit and the high limit entrance that faces the main cage and security podium. If you sit at one of the machine on the far left of this bank then you are looking at that high limit entrance.

The pay tables are better than the 8/5 DDB you showed, at least last time I looked. You also get 0.3% cash back/free play.

There are two machines that start at $.05 over by the players club desk. Those have the pay tables you mention until you go to $.25.
Hey man, I mentioned that only one casino in San Diego, not LV, has dreamcard (sycuan). That only goes as high as 25c and the DDB is 8/5 as you noted. I know basically nothing about Vegas, I'd heard from other posters about Bally's and now that you mention Red Rock I recall that as well. Red Rock is a little far to simply explore given whenever I'm in Vegas I'm usually hanging out with my folks and my dad doesn't get around too well (see previous TRs).

If I still have a roll the next time I come to LV, I may have to make a trip out to Red Rock and take a shot. Right now the thought of being dealt a premium hand with the dreamcard, high denom is very enticing (gotta remember all the times I get dealt **** and bleed, though). And now that you mention it, yes I think you're right about only JoB or deuces having the dreamcard show up ~ 50% of the time- all other games it's even less.
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Old 09-16-2016, 02:50 PM   #24
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

^^ Sorry, I misunderstood your post. I think my brain automatically inserted Las Vegas in there due to the forum.

Red Rock is worth the trip. It has a wide variety of quality video poker and unusual games with decent pay tables to change things up. If you are close to the Strip, Palace Station has many of the same games including 100% DB DDB and FPDW.

Note that points are only worth 0.075% on those games. There are full point games with 99.5% +/- pay tables on them all over the casino.
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Old 09-16-2016, 04:29 PM   #25
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Re: Ongoing video poker "TR", how long will this last?

Slight derail - how is the loyalty program? I don't want to get a free room at Palace Station anyway, but how does it compare to CET? I wouldn't mind free/cheap stays at Red Rock, or even Palms, but not if I have to throw $10 million coin in.
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